inputs.text: sad state affairs - second zen vision fourth creative mp3 player former creative mp3 players served well past replacing zen mistreated last one dropped concrete six feet high looked zen vision also compared ipod players liked zen cheaper comparable sized ipod included things like radio receiver voice record without additional module cost also like use software load music videos pictures device simply plug usb cable computer device like use several different file formats instead proprietary apple software formats dont understand microsoft still facing antitrust lawsuits impossible find new quality nonipod mp3 apples control market creative keeps making mp3 players keep buying