Listen to Bret Easton Ellis interview The National's Matt Berninger for an hour Listen to the podcast here For music and literature fans, it was like being served lobster with your steak. Here are two wordsmiths who have explored the depths of our anxieties in very different but equally moving ways, coming together to discuss their creative processes and sharing their respective experiences of loneliness. The podcast begins with Bret explaining how the band's album Boxer pulled him out of depression in 2008 and cemented The National's place as his favourite band, before the pair trade thoughts on whether pain is necessary for good writing. Matt's new film Mistaken For Strangers is also discussed, along with the songwriting process and what it is like to perform such high intensity shows as The National do - the full interview being well worth checking out when you have an hour going spare. Ellis has become a prolific podcaster in recent months, previously interviewing Kanye West, Judd Apatow, Marilyn Manson, Kevin Smith and more.