Top rugby referees plead: we need to expand TV view so we can always see bigger picture Player education is also part of it. A player may come up and ask me "I am thinking of trying this, what is the law on that?" I suppose my skill should be the knowledge of the law. EM It doesn't end with the senior team. Part of our role is to support all the national teams. It is part of our ongoing development that we do that. If you are in contact with the best players and the best coaches, it can also only improve us as referees. GM There have still been a couple of controversial moments in the Six Nations, including your decision, Wayne, to give a match-winning penalty to Wales in the last minute of their victory over Ireland for a dangerous tackle by Stephen Ferris on Ian Evans. WB It was a big decision but my performance was assessed by five individuals from five different countries and the coaches. The review came back positive that I had made the right decision. A decision like that might not always be popular but you have to trust your knowledge and self-belief. Chris White (RFU's national referee academy manager) You are totally focused at that point on what's happening. You have to be in the zone and referee only what is in front of you. Bang, it's a penalty, the decision is made. There is so much more coverage of the game now at all levels that referees are more used to having every decision scrutinised as part of their development. EM One of the major characteristics of the type of person we are looking for is the strength of character to make those kind of decisions. If Wayne had chosen to ignore that penalty, he was being unfair to one side. If that had been in the first minute, I don't think anyone would have questioned it. GM People did question the decision not to send off Bradley Davies for his tip tackle on Donnacha Ryan, when he only got a yellow card. Would it have helped if the remit of the television match official also covered foul play? WB Part of our review process is that we will look at instances where we say "should we have given a yellow card here, should we have given a red card here, did we get that right?" If we can refer an incident to the TMO to advise on sanction, then we will get more decisions right. We hope we get them right on the day but sometimes you see things out of the corner of your eye or you miss the instigator. If we have the tools there - what would it take, an extra 30 seconds? Luke Pearce (Premiership referee) It benefits everyone. No one benefits from making the wrong call. If you can get the right outcome everyone is happy. Technology has increased the overall accuracy because you are aware that in our review process every single call is analysed. EM The IRB, along with the RFU, is trying to expand the role of the TMO so that we can get further to the position that we can get the correct outcome. The referee still has to control the game but if he has any doubt in his mind he would be able to ask more questions. GM Does the TMO now have the most stressful job, given the focus on his decision and limited time to make it? CW I can remember pacing up and down outside the TMO box because you have nowhere to go. It is a different skill and we have got people who practise it all the time. I think it was David Shepherd, the cricket umpire, who said that the referees may get better but the technology will get better. He was right. WB I hope the TMO will be expanded and I think it will to get the right decisions. We don't want a World Cup at Twickenham in 2015 decided by a decision which could have been referred to a TMO or a player not being sent off when they should have been and going on to score the winning try. EM The bigger picture is the image of the game. When we host the World Cup in 2015, we are hoping to get more people involved in rugby and we want people to see the image of the game is more positive from using technology. The odd occasions that we get these incidents, the one person who has got the best view of all this is sat in the truck with everything in front of him and at the minute he's the one person we don't ask. GM Has wearing a microphone during matches reduced the backchat from players? CW The top-level game is extremely clean in terms of language. You hardly ever hear any expletives. EM You simply cannot compare the discipline of today with yesteryear. Every move these players make is now under the microscope and if one of them does something they shouldn't do then its tea and buns with Jeff Blackett on Wednesday afternoon! Whitey, you were always good at stopping the game to warn players that lots of people were listening to their comments. CW One of the strengths of the microphone is that everyone knows right or wrong why a decision has been made. It is a really important skill for referees to learn to communicate in an accurate and succinct way because they are now speaking to such a big audience, not just the players on the pitch. LP Players will quite often say sorry if they say something after a big tackle or collision and I think that is something special and unique we have created. GM But has the pressures of professionalism given rise to growing criticisms of referees from coaches, as you have experienced this season Wayne? EM Take it from me, it is not new! Human behaviour is human behaviour. I would actually suggest there is less of it now than if you went back 20 years or so when leagues first came in. The best way of chewing someone's ear is to do it privately. WB There is also the belief that we are not accountable. My boss is sitting opposite me and if I am not performing in the Premiership or internationally then he will pull me to one side and tell me I need to improve X, Y and Z. If I don't improve or continue to make the same mistakes, there is no doubt I won't be refereeing international, European or Premiership rugby. GM Coaches are complaining that scrums are too much of a lottery. What do you think should be done? A specialist scrummaging referee? EM We mustn't be afraid to trial things but bringing a front row expert on isn't the answer. Firstly, you have got the delay of Wayne going off then who comes wobbling on but someone like Jason Leonard and it takes him 10 minutes to run over to the scrum! The reality is, you could have two of the most imminent front row coaches in the world in this room and they could watch a scrum and have two different views. That is the complexity of this business. CW We spend a lot of time looking at scrums. During my career I looked at scrums three or four times during my review of the match, even the ones that worked, to see why. There is a huge pride taken in all our decisions in trying to get it right. GM Would you like to see any law changes in time for the 2015 World Cup? EM A lot of people talk about changing the laws but whatever laws you have, you are going to get good games, indifferent games and brilliant games. What is really important is not the laws but the attitude of those involved. If people want to play, they can play.