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Re: Pop Music in General
Also, no worries Polly, who reads PSs anyway. : I
Re: Pop Music in General
That's a bit disappointing about sting, though i havent listened to the police too much i like their hit songs.
not all pop is terrible. but there is some horrible stuff that i can't believe people like...
Re: Pop Music in General
Re: Pop Music in General
Most definitely. I felt guilty about not posting some Crimson originally, esp something like Lark's Tongues or Red. But I left that for you. :) I used the Chick for the name mostly. And what about Cream, Hendrix or Graham Bond? It goes way back, doesn't it?
I like the notion of pop music as music that is made specifically for commercial consideration. I get a kick out of a lot of it. But I try to make a distinction between music whose merit is exclusively commercial: Brittany or The Archies, and music that although it is commercially appealing, it has some artistic merit, something like Walking on the Moon. In that sense, pop music can rise to the occasion of a sense of artistic merit. I like Dream Theater, another good example. The music they do is a lot of fun; but very rarely actually has an acute sense of artistic merit. I would actually give it more cred. than a lot of folks that would say it's warmed over 70s rock and 80s metal. To me it may have some sense of artistic merit, but to someone else it is just pop.
The important thing to me about contemporary notion is the idea that popular music can rise to art and can be historically pertinent. I brought up Bartok, (and that didn't bring The Colonel in) Look at the number of artist influenced by Bartok: Zappa, Keith Emerson, Jason Moran, and Lutoslawski, a pretty far range. And he didn't get the lauds that Stravinsky got, or Schoenberg among academics. He was probably the composer influenced by folk music who brought it to the most artistic level.
Again the problem when discussing pop music in regards to quality is you have to get passed a lot of superfluous notions of importance to whom, and when. Issues of class, gender, race etc. play a big part in that authentication of taste. And you get into that with a discussion of any musical genre, oh that term.
What is a true artistic expression? Is "She Loves You" not art but "The Long and Winding Road" is? Is "The Black Page" not pop, but My Guitar's Gonna Kill Your Mama, is? What about something like Prokofiev's Lt. Kije Suite, often quoted by popular songwriters? Does quoting Prokofiev make a pop song 'not pop'? Maybe the point of am trying to make is that something can be superfluous and still have charm, and maybe even artistic merit. A lot of the stuff my students bring in is actually quite nice pop: Disturbed, Avenged Sevenfold, Seether. I would be listening to that stuff if I were 15. So this notion that somehow good popular music died with Hendrix and Janis is just nonsense. I mean I am a music historian, and if I could get passed that notion, I think anyone can. and it is a notion that is very bad for music.
Ken Marino Drum Teacher "It's not worth keeping score. You win some. You lose some, you let it go"
Last edited by Deltadrummer; 08-21-2009 at 06:03 PM.
Re: Pop Music in General
So i just thought of something that i feel is very relavent to this discussion...
I am a web designer/developer... i started as an artist and decided to persue commercial art as my occupation. The fields of music and art are inter-related as they are both forms of art, so is dance and theater etc. So i guess the thing is, do you consider commercial art the same way you consider pop-music? I mean do you criticize commercial photographers, graphic designers, movie/tv actors and web designers and say they aren't true artists because they chose to be successful at their jobs? I mean i could be a flat-broke fine-artist or i could be a moderately succesful commercial artist... yes i have to sell-out some sense of artistic integrity but at the end of the day i know i did my job and made money doing it.
In an ideal world people wouldn't have to sell-out artistic integrity due to monetary concerns but this in the real world you often have to do that.
Its like someone said before, money is what makes the world go round... people have bills to pay, mortgages, education and tons of other needs that being "artistic" just won't cover.
Now all that being said, i will also reiterate my earlier point... i feel like 90% of music (and art) is complete crap and there will be a few gems of truly good stuff in all genres. If you use the amount of crap found in any genre as a metric you'll pretty quickly be able to say that all genres are bad. I don't think that we can say that pop is bad because there is a lot of crap in it... if you look back historically at music you'll see the same thing in all genres across all times... the difference is that pop-music is on the radio now so we hear all of the crap along with the good stuff, and the classics stations have already weeded out a lot of the garbage.
Re: Pop Music in General
I see it the same way as I do prostitution really. They take something incredibly intimate, personal, and emotional, and sell it as just another manufactured product with all the handmade quality of an assembly line robotic arm.
I am a younger player, (age 20, 6 years) so I am still filled up with all my dramatic convictions. I have been doing well in the local scene but I really hope I never get paid for my solo stuff, I really hope I never have a fan base with a financial vice grip on my creativity. I don't do this to appease, and artists with that attitude fall out of public interest very easily by the look of it.
The depressing bit to me is I know that peoples taste in music isn't anywhere as poor as the grammies would indicate. After 20+ years of hard work dream theater just last month finally got the record sales they have deserved all along. It just irritates me that producers get fat and happy doing what they know will work, while it takes real musicians decades just to get what they deserve.
9 years of blasturbation.
Re: Pop Music in General
Johnny. Pictured left to right, Bermuda, Weird Al, Grunt.
Re: Pop Music in General
I work 40 hours a week, and then I play with 3 "twice a week" bands and jam with half a dozen misc projects. I am happy that I can do exactly as I want and survive off of it, and I am happy to have the respect of the older guys who have been around for decades, but when I compare paychecks with the high school eye candy drummers... there's no hesitation "Yeah, I work harder than him."
It's not like they're closet talents, and choose to play down, its honestly the material they had from day one and some producer scooped it up with a plastic dog-poop bag. I get offended by this, it's not even a simple pleasure kind of sound, it's just bad.
9 years of blasturbation.
Re: Pop Music in General
There is the same trend going on in music as there is in movies, and sport for that matter - once someone is the loudest and fastest then someone else has to try to be louder and faster still. And there's always new generation who thinks the loudest and fastest of the day is the benchmark and tried to go further again, and all the old loud and fast guys are booooring.
LimpingToad hit the button. Visual art vs music. Music seems so much more conservative than art, which was coming up with wild stuff in the mainstream at a time when Benny Goodman was considered radical. Not a lot of music as "out there" and arty as Picasso or Van Gogh being is as popular with the general public as Pablo and co were/are.
So we're probably more conservative with music than with art. We're also more tolerant of commercialism in art; few people see art in those terms. Maybe because commercial art is mostly a marketing tool which is maybe equivalent of musical backing for a TV ad? I've worked in web and graphic design too and I know commercial artists who would love to have more time to get things how they want it, but the time pressures force you to compromise. Maybe like pop stars are required to keep churning out the hits?
Unlike commercial art, commercial music exists more often as just itself - with little utility value other than serving as a backdrop for dancing and/or socialising, maybe the equivalent of those terrible mass-produced landscapes you see that are produced by painters who churn out one after another. But people are less likely to actively HATE it, and are more likely to just ignore it.
But Ferret... who's to say playing commercial music just for the $$ is more "prostitution" than, say, working in an office or in sales, where we almost completely subsume our innate creativity to commercial ends? After all, people have bills to pay, kids to feed etc. I expect that plenty of musos would rather play sub-optimal commercial music than work in an office and play music on the side.
This brings us to Ken's thoughts about how some commercial music includes stuff with artistic merit, his example being Walking on the Moon with its tasty atmospheric parts and Stewie's fantastic sticking. It's fair to wonder when hearing some commercial music, "How can these guys resist slipping ANY cool stuff in their songs?". Just something ... ANYTHING!! The answer is probably, "Because they can't". But it does keep them out of the office :)
Music is a bit more personal and speaks more clearly to our souls (or whatever) than art does and that's maybe why people seem less tolerant of music they don't like. Maybe that's why there's talk of "musical prostitution"? There's maybe a bit more "sacredness" about music, sacred like relationships. Our ears are more primal sensory organs than our eyes so maybe it speaks to something deeper within us?
So if someone wants to use music to make a living and avoid 9 to 5 work, without treating it as something special, part of me wants to say "Good luck to them". Another part of me is offended because at least working in an office doesn't despoil something that's supposed to be beautiful or exciting or poignant or even transcendent.
Personally, I really like the idea of creating music with broad appeal but retaining some artistic merit. Most times you want to pick up gigs to enjoy the full musical experience and that means being discipline and compromise, but at the same time you want to really enjoy what you're doing. I suspect that's the space many forum members are at. Others might be hoping that their unfettered expression will strike a chord with the public so they don't have to be wage slaves, tho' that's a bit like buying a lottery ticket.
Last edited by Pollyanna; 08-22-2009 at 04:44 AM.
Re: Pop Music in General
I lost all interest in popular culture a long time ago. Lowest common denominator and all that. It's just not interesting. It's crass, base and, well, ignoble. To me pop music is the Fox news of music.
Look around you. Pop culture is everywhere, it's pretty much all there is. America is all about pop culture. I just spent two weeks in New York and it isn't any different there.
But since that's the way it is you're left with the choice of what to do with yourself in this tacky culture of ours. You just have to make your peace with the reality that in order to keep from starving you will definitely play drums on some really crappy music, you will and don't kid yourself. The strange thing is that in order to do that you have to be a really good drummer because there are tons of drummers who want those kinds of gigs.
As to all these bands and entertainers, I don't know anything about them, nor do I care, any more than I care about American Idol or professional wrestling.
Call me J
Re: Pop Music in General
It is all around us, not just in music. Its this monster that tells you what to wear, what to eat and how to look and ends up with what to listen to.
And when commercial and media interests align themselves to this all powerful juggernaut, there's no stopping it and it permeates pretty much the whole world.
The 'In- Things', Reality TV, processed food, the Hollywood blockbusters served up like pancakes every summer, fitting into size 0 Ed Hardys and other such trivial pursuits is what sadly defines millions of innocents aspiring for a sense of identity and self worth.
Thankfully, the news isn't all bad because on either side of this flood, there have always been gutters that run rich with the nutrients of our creativity, morality, our conscience that fulfill and satiate our basic desire and innate need for what is special and beautiful in this world.
Re: Pop Music in General
Ironic that musical compost can be used to help grow [expletive] :)
Re: Pop Music in General
What about something like Ticket to Ride. If you had only heard The Beatles version you would say it is a pop song. But what about Vanilla Fudge's version or their version of "You Keep Me Hangin' On." I think the problem is that genre is largely interpretation and interpretation is largely marketing or audience in the popular music world. The question that would need to be answered is which one is art? The Vanilla Fudge version is one of the earliest examples of progressive rock elements and had a major influence so that much qualify it as having some artistic merit. But let me add that I am not prepared to say that Motown has no artistic merit. That seems to me to be nonsense.
Is the song "You Keep Me Hangin' On" any more 'sophisticated' than "Sugar Sugar." I would say perhaps, but barely and they both have the same social function, to sell records. Now one could do a social reading into it Motown and say this is at the height of the Civil Rights Movement and say there is a social element to the music that is reflective of the times. But I don't think that many would argue that The Supremes being a were not a pop band, and that song being pop.Neither one is nearly as sophisticated as what Miles Davis or Stan Getz were doing at the same time. People always ask the question, if pop is devalued in the face of something like King Crimson, why should King Crimson have value in the face of Steve Reich?
Every era has it's bubble gum. Sugar Sugar was actually the number one song of 1969, and stood four weeks at number one at the height of the after math of Woodstock. It is actually a well written song. It was probably written for kids. It is kids music. You'd have to ask who was buying those records, and I would say it was tweens. The cultural problem is when people who are forty are still listening to that type of music. Whose listening to Hannah Montana? If it's my ten year old drum student, who loves Hannah, that's one thing. If it's somebody in their twenties maybe she needs to grow up a bit. We have a joke. Ten year old boys like Hannah, and fifteen year old boys like Hannah; but for a very different reason. And the other question to answer is why is bubble gum so bad and Motley Crue so good? And then there was The Backstreet Boys and N'Sync. You could sit around all day only listening to the most sophisticated music.
Jazz is losing its audience today, and classical music has been in decline for a decade now. People ask the question how do you save jazz, how do you save classical music? A lot of people's paychecks depend on it. A lot of musician's paychecks depend on the status quo. And people ask the question how do you market jazz to a new, perhaps younger audience. I think that as people are expressing the problem here, it is not one of marketing. Marketing is the problem. If you hear The Coltrane Quartet recording of Alabama, and it's meaningless to you, there is a bigger problem. You got no soul.
Ken Marino Drum Teacher "It's not worth keeping score. You win some. You lose some, you let it go"
Re: Pop Music in General
I guess props to the Monkees for refusing Sugar Sugar, so their producer invented another band The Archies and had them do it.
Johnny. Pictured left to right, Bermuda, Weird Al, Grunt.
Re: Pop Music in General
Re: Pop Music in General
Just a quick thought before I go and pretend that I have a life for a while:
It isn't black-and-white. There's some great pop songs out there and also some "creative" underground music that's little more than obscure noodling fit for neither man nor beast (nor woman or female animals).
Like brilliance, crap comes in various flavours ...
Re: Pop Music in General
Ken Marino Drum Teacher "It's not worth keeping score. You win some. You lose some, you let it go"
Re: Pop Music in General
the Monkees were trying to expand their work and wanted more control over their music and Sugar Sugar was the last straw as far as creativity was concerned so they refused to sing it.
Johnny. Pictured left to right, Bermuda, Weird Al, Grunt.
Re: Pop Music in General
"Got no soul?" Nah. They just don't like it, that's all. It's not a problem that people like what they like unless you make it one. Just don't go there, don't eat at Chili's or Burger King, don't watch reality TV, don't buy Lady Gaga records, don't look at MTV and don't buy your clothes at Old Navy or the Gap. Easy. Maintaining high standards in your life is just as easy if it matters enough. But the first thing to do is not give a damn about what the "hoi polloi" are doing. Which is hard to do when you're in traffic with them.
The point is to make your own life what you want it to be, to only let into your life what you want there. None of my friends, my non-musician friends, really give a damn about music one way or the other, and that even goes for some of the musicians I know, but I don't have any problem with that and I very much doubt that John Coltrane did either.
Call me J
Re: Pop Music in General
Are you kidding me with this? Just wanting to be hip? There's nothing 'hip' about liking a 50 year old jazz recording by one of the great jazz ensembles. Maybe it was hip in '64. I don't know why I should justify this with a response.
Ken Marino Drum Teacher "It's not worth keeping score. You win some. You lose some, you let it go"
Re: Pop Music in General
I remember a time when I was 15 and and went around singing praises of Hendrix to all the cool cats around me, while privately I just didn't 'get it'. It was all distorted noisy feedback.
Of course the Hendrix eureka moment did arrive a few years later but even within our little musician world I've felt the pressure to like what everyone else likes..
Last edited by aydee; 08-22-2009 at 09:33 AM.
Re: Pop Music in General
This is an interesting thread. I see it from different points.
For the musician there is always a need to pay the bills. Many I know will play 'commercial' gigs to pay the bills and use that money to pay for their real passion. Similar to Ferret working to pay the bills then indulging in his passion. A lot of 'pop' bands also play/write different music away from their day job.
For most of the public 'popular music' is background music. Something simple to sing or hum along to whilst washing up or driving. I have no real dislike of popular music. For me anything that gets people discussing the merits of music is a good thing.
My Son's first band crush was 'Right Said Fred' and then to cap it off 'The Spice girls'. I didn't condemn his choice though because it was an interest in music, of whatever flavour, and that interest has grown into an appreciation of lots of different types of music. I started off with an odd mix of chart, rock and brass band music!!
I don't like Jazz. Never have understood it and never liked it but I won't condemn it because it gives people an interest in music and you never know one day I might get that revelation and learn how to appreciate it. So for me this thread is proof that pop music is a necessity in getting people interested in music whatever it's condition or quality. What we should be talking about is how to get people more interested and involved in music rather than musicians bashing away at each other to prove musical superiority.
OK, OK It's back to rudiments for me! I'll be back in a few months
Re: Pop Music in General
This is going back a few posts, to the 'Visual Art' analogy and particularly Pollyanna's interpretation of it.
Visual art is - to some degree - less conservative. At least in the mainstream that we can see. You also have to remember that visual art (particularly static visual art) is controlled by a very, very small selection of elite collectors and artists who can change their minds in an instant as to what is the 'in thing'. Music is a small business at the top, but they have to satisfy shareholders, whereas artists do not. Exposure in music relies on a network of distribution, art does not. It is far more flexible.
Re: Pop Music in General
Ok, living is over for now. Back to the PC :)
But ... I've always been a closet pop fan - The Beatles, Madonna, early Elton, The B52s, The Bangles, Bryan Ferry, George Michael, old disco - all that uncool music. I'm a sucker for a good tune and a good feel. I didn't admit it at the time for fear of being thought of as just a ditzy girly-girl by my muso friends but I was absolutely NUTS for the riff/beat combo in The Knack's My Sharona.
Just because something is an acquired taste doesn't mean everyone will like it if only they get to know it. Just ask Con struct :) Horses for courses. A lot of jazz doesn't speak to me. My soul may not be too flash, but most of the moving parts still work.
Alabama would try the patience of most people. Great if you close your eyes late at night and drift into it, like classical, like Dark Side of the Moon or Eno or a whole bunch of moody things. Not much good for the unwashed otherwise, who often use music as a backdrop for their social lives and rarely if ever turn off the lights, turn up the volume and sail away on sound.
Why does Trane really move you but not others? Why do we like some people more than others? Similar questions.
Uncool non-muso types (hoik! ptui!) dig pop and rock'n'roll. They love a good tune, a contagious beat, words that describe something they've felt. Music that speaks to their generation or scene. Jazz has developed over the years to a point where subtleties that are only picked up by connoisseurs are considered to be of paramount importance. Forests and trees, ivory towers, rareified realms and all that. Just as intellectuals in the art world could never turn the public on to Jackson Pollock and his ilk, hard bop is a minority taste. Hell, so is all bop for that matter.
Why can't at least some jazzers compromise without giving us Kenny G wallpaper? Why not simplify and make the song structures more clear? Get more into composition. Melody. Rhythms that make you want to move. Hardly anyone gives a rat's posterior if a drummer plays polyrhythms (Polly Rhythms!) ... they just want it to sound cool. Is it a buzz? Is it beautiful? Does it "speak"?
Music doesn't have to be trite to reach a mass audience. Birdland did well and can be appreciated on a basic visceral level but if you want to dig deeper there's lots of nuances to enjoy. Kinda like The Simpsons :) Joe and co didn't play Birdland by rote; they improvised within a structure rather than tossing off the common jazz club fare:
1. theme
2. sax solo
3. piano solo
4. bass solo
5. drum solo
6. theme
7. Outtro
Unless it's VERY cleverly done, that just bores most people [expletive]less. Nice over dinner, tho ... as long as it doesn't get too intense.
For now, it looks to me that jazz, along with indie, world, prog, experimental, metal etc is just more of the sincere stuff running down the musical gutters (re: Aydee's and my chat earlier), occasionally being used as "compost" to fertilise the pop scene through samples, funk, and sessioners slipping some nuances into MOR tunes.
Re: Pop Music in General
I think your first point is the thing that really pisses me off about music today. I was listening to this interview with Lez Zeppelin, and they said the treat The Led like it were a canonic work, like Beethoven. The reason why bands like The Zep and The Stones, ELP, Crimson were so good was because they could take, 'steal,' music but do something unique and interesting with it. Jazz was is fundamentally genre messing, and when you go back to Bach, Mozart and the Beethoven, they were doing the same thing.
It can be silly:
I think that you are right that it is the lyrical content of the Motown tune that separates it from bubble gumminess. Its 1967. Any song with 'Free' or 'Freedom' is making a statement whether it wants to or not. What if SS, was, "Freedom, oh, sweet sweet Freedom, here comes a bright new sun, and it leaves me wanting more." :) A song I always liked from that era was Build me up Buttercup.(You can't write a song like Eight Miles High and say you were innocent enough to think no one would take it as a drug reference.)
I think that the other important facet is that popular music is about the songs, and the lyric is on par, and often more important than what is happening musically, "Blowing in the Wind." And the visual can be as important as in musical theater, dance or musical film. That may be unnerving for musicians. If you can making living doing what you like like Bruford, Dejohnette or Billy Cobham, and make a living from it, my hat goes off to you. But I know quite a few jazz drummers who have taken gigs doing R and B and hip-hop. One of my favorite jazz drummers did hip hop a tour with this guy I worked with years ago.
You and I both have a pop sensibility. I love that live version of Down Let the Sun Go Down on Me, where the crowd goes wild when George Michael introduces Elton. GM has a great voice for pop It's going to leave me wanting more after a song or two. But we can also recognize a sense of musical accomplishment.
The reason why I mentioned "Alabama" specifically is because this is a piece that transcends music. It certainly transcends aesthetics. It was written after a racially motivated church bombing in Alabama left four young girls dead. The tune is more than music: moving, haunting, edgy and transcendental. The ability that the Coltrane Quartet had to just sit on that edge is breath taking and in this piece, it is fully realized. Knowing the narrative and listening to the piece, would one say that they are not moved by it?
Ken Marino Drum Teacher "It's not worth keeping score. You win some. You lose some, you let it go"
Re: Pop Music in General
Haha - love the link! Well, for about 45 seconds :)
One of my faves was Pat Boone's version fo Smoke On The Water. I like it more than the original. It's both a crackup and classy.
Yeah, we've touched on this on the forum a few times, the extramusical playing a major role in the music. When I was young I had a real hoik! ptui! attitude towards the extramusical. We thought that extramusical elements were BS that masked a lack of talent. These days I think that, unless the music is OUTSTANDING (and I don't use that term lightly), then music needs extramusical elements to be of high value (not necessarly $$).
After all, music stemmed from the extramusical right from the first vocalisations and clap sticks. It meant somthing, represented something, said something. Performances weren't so much this artificial thing we've developed where the musicians perform as artists or stars in front of a rapt audience. There was no separate "band" and "audience", just the whole tribe hving a pow-wow. The musos just had a certain role in the gig, along with the chief, shaman, dancers, people clapping along etc. If anything, some pop and rock bands come closest to that rootsy dynamic, often those playing small gigs and parties. It's not just about the music but everyone getting together to enjoy an uplifting experience.
The least interesting types of extramusical elements are sex and love. Common as muck, unless they are outstanding. Dance/disco/funk is also common - "get ya body movin' yeah". Comedy is a good one (I like comedy) and it frees up bands to get into a bit of genre bending a la Uncle Frank, early Tubes and Weird Al.
Then you have scenes that express group attitudes - the rebellion against prudishness of old RnR (and jazz, going back further), the ghetto expression of rap, the nihilism of punk, the anti-establishment of metal, the left wing politics and anti-hierarchy attitude of experimental music, blues's down-to-earth reconciliation with life's pain etc.
Singers usually understand this more than other band members because they're the ones who are have to present the words in a way that suggests that they agree with the lyric's worldview. I mean, no matter how great the music is, not too many singers will sing a song that promotes bestiality ... "Hey baby, I love your snout. I bet you like to get about. I love it when you swing your tail. Don't care if you're a girl or male" :)
So if singers are feeling or acting out the ideas in the lyrics, then image and stage presentation matters. You might not want to sing a plaintive version of Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood while wearing Daevid Allen's umbrella hat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFZ1N22I_QU) but that outfit is fine for playing Radio Gnome Invisible.
But Alabama ... I'd not heard of it until you mentioned it. If the YouTube link didn't tell the story there is NO WAY I would have worked out the meaning from the music. I would have just thought of it as having some beautiful ethereal passages along with some fairly dull jazz noodling in the middle. No doubt the meaning would have been clearer at the time, but the song is abstract expressionism, which will always go over the heads of a lot of people.
Some think that art shouldn't need explanations to be clear, but I think that's too precious. Nothing wrong with providing explanations. The explanation becomes part of the art and allows it to be appreciated on another level. I guess that's marketing. And marketing - explanations - plays a much bigger role in art than we often care to admit, or we rail against it. But in a sense that's genre messing too, just on a broader scale.
So I don't care much for the connoisseur attitude of "pure music" being superior to other forms. As far as I'm concerned it's more a matter of "whatever it takes" to say what you want to say, just as long as it's not fraud like miming when people expect live music. Some musics are deeper than others, but depth rarely pays the rent. Probably because life itself is only occasionally deep, if at all - lol
As for jazz players in R&B bands, maybe they like playing jazz best but I expect they still love playing those gigs. It's hard to play music you don't like and perform with enough conviction to please other band members and fans. How about a monster R&B player like Jim Keltner who, like Bill and Billy etc, is also playing exactly what he wants to play? I suspect that many much-derided pop musos who are accused of playing crap for money are playing exactly what they love too.
The best situation is if good musos enjoy a wide range of styles like you do. Then the world is your oyster :) If I was a really good drummer I'd have that luxury too so I only get a taste and have to make my bucks producing management reports.
Re: Pop Music in General
Pop music = Pretty Oustandingly Pathetic.
Its a producer's dream and a musician's nightmare. Imagine how much Picassos, Rembrandts, and Van Goghs would be worth if some art producer controlled the final product.
Re: Pop Music in General
Pop in the art world can be great. Gary Larson ain't no Picasso but he's one of my favourite people ever!
Last edited by Pollyanna; 08-23-2009 at 11:18 AM.
Re: Pop Music in General
Historically, music was largely vocal so there was always a text. People knew what the music was about. The text that was paramount; the music served its needs. As music became more instrumental the Romantics created a programmatic context for it. Music was representational and had a story to explain it. Debussy questioned if music was really representational and Stravinsky came along and said "music doesn't represent anything but music." The twentieth century was defined. But he himself later admitted that in retrospect he was wrong about that.
The notion that music needs no explanation is going out of favor. And in today's post-modern world the notion that anything comes to us narrative-free is questioned. C-F-G has significant historical meaning, and as 'absolute' and pure as one may want to believe it is, it just ain't so. The definition of the chords and scales is a long historical narrative. It took a millennium to get to bubble gum. :) People used to argue that the narrative was to get us to C-F-G; but now we see that was only one stop on the narrative.
On the other hand you have a piece like Appalachian Spring, which evokes the gentle breezes and blossoming of spring in the mountain, it's cool, it's breezy, it's light and airy, and it was not named by the composer. All that was 'unintentional.' it's nice to sit in the middle and enjoy the wonderful narrative of a piece of music; but also be able to hear the beauty of the instrumentation, the counterpoint and harmony, the melodies and rhythms without them having any significance but that of music.
Today, some conductors will turn and address the audience, which had long been a faux pas. It certainly breaks down the forth wall. One can learn a lot from going to pre-concert lectures, and listening to conductors, composers and noted scholars. That's where you can get insights and education. Add good programming and people will come. It's the woman, woman in the 60s esp. really get into great music, and they get roused by music that is provocative, interesting and somewhat out of the ordinary of what we normally hear.
Ken Marino Drum Teacher "It's not worth keeping score. You win some. You lose some, you let it go"
Re: Pop Music in General
Interesting info, Ken.
Which of these performances has strong extramusical impact?
Would you like to hear the story of my drum throne? There is a story behind it (or was that a behind on the story?), but it's not interesting for anyone who's not a keen chair sniffer :)
Re: Pop Music in General
I don't think we are thinking in the same terms as what pop music is. I always thought of it as top 40 ish stuff, like Beyonce, Lil Wayne, and Kelly Clarkson of today.
Re: Pop Music in General
I think the question is, " is the story musical?" When you listen to something like the Coltrane Quartet, there is always a strong musical narrative, though there may be a descriptive narrative as well. From the above examples, it would probably be the AC/DC. If you were to give me a choice of AC/DC and Bill Evans, I'd have to go with the Bill Evans.
I think people can be biased to say the jazz is a 'high' art form, when not all jazz is great music. Not everyone composing in Vienna in 1788 was a 'great' composer. Now you hear a lot of people saying rock should get the same recognition as ' a high' or great art form. It becomes classic. The term classical music comes from the same concept of being classic, old and exemplary of the greatness of its time. Now you have the classic era of the American song and musical theater 1940s and 1950s, the classic jazz era of the 1950s and 60s, and classic rock era of the 1960s and 70s. The music does become enshrined. In America, and NY in particular, people look back at the time as an artistic Golden Era. It may very well be that it was. In 1949, you could see Cole Porter, Rodgers and Hammerstein, or the great plays of Tennessee Williams and Arthur Miller on Broadway, hear Monk, Bird or Bud Powell play in the nightclubs or Copland and Bernstein at the Philharmonic. But it is somewhat dangerous to go back to some time period and exemplify it and how great it was then, and it really sucks now.
Now is a very interesting time in the history of music because with the Internet you have a wide-open, global space to get music out. For the folkies, it was the music of the people that was as important or probably more important than what was being played on the radio. I think many big bands, like The Beatles, come to understand that about music, the marketing gets in the way. Things become hyped, and Brittany Spears becomes the number one album. Because it is the best thing happening at the time: p What is important to whom, when and why? Today you have such a proliferation of bands and artists; anyone could make a CD. Everyone could get their music out, and the concept of an overseer, the Church, The Censor, The Industry, is slowly diminishing. That is true republicanism, and in that world Does pop really have a place? (Bye-bye pop music.)
Ken Marino Drum Teacher "It's not worth keeping score. You win some. You lose some, you let it go"
Last edited by Deltadrummer; 08-24-2009 at 04:25 AM.
Re: Pop Music in General
So I chose bands that also enjoyed that freedom.
Ken, I thought true republicanism invloved going into debt to boost the military and going on hare-brained invasions :P
More seriously, I think pop will always be around because simple and catchy music works for those who don't listen hard enough to enjoy nuance, skill or originality. It's musical ice cream. I like ice cream but I don't want a diet of it. I eat a lot of veggies, which I enjoy because they are versatile, taste good, are nourishing and don't involve killing animals to satisfy my tatste buds. I like my musical veggies too :)
Re: Pop Music in General
I try to avoid any lofty ideals when dealing with music. There is music for everyone. People such as Kenny Aronoff, Steve Gadd, Steve Ferrone, JR Robinson etc have all played on loads of so called "pop" music. Does this diminish their careers or what they have offered of themselves? I do not think so.
Anyway, what is pop? To me the punk of today, heavy metal and Kylie Minogue all comes under the banner of "pop music". Music by the Bad Plus and others of their ilk, is not pop music. Pop is simply a part of the mainstream culture.
I'll play it. I'll also play anything else offered. It's all music.
Re: Pop Music in General
Yeah, I feel similarly. My understanding is that Steve Godd [sic] doesn't think any music is too easy for him because he sees the challenge in getting any track right. So I don't think he'd see it devaluing his career.
Re: Pop Music in General
Steve Gadd still is, has long been and will probably always be my favorite drummer. People say he invented disco with "Do the Hustle" but it is quintessential Gadd from the upbeat tom in the intro, ghost notes, tom fills and two measure phrases. It's not just some basic four on the floor disco beat.
. . .and blaming the democrats for it. :)
I would hope that some day people will either realize they can just make that music themselves or teach their kids to do it. There is a very large community of folk music enthusiast here in the States, and esp. NY. They essential believe that people should write music to chronicle their own lives, and not have the pop industry do it for them. They can keep that chronicle for their grandchildrens' grandchildren.
Ken Marino Drum Teacher "It's not worth keeping score. You win some. You lose some, you let it go"
Re: Pop Music in General
Re: Pop Music in General
I hold current pop music trends to the same esteem I give to my time while on the toilet. It should all go down the crapper and sent to a waste treatment plant. Too far?
But that being said, I don't think being the drummer for a pop band is selling your soul to the musical devil. Granted, a lot of the people that get hired (is it just me, or are they normally gospel chops drummers?) are advertised to the point that I don't want to have anything to do with the company they're representing, but they had to go through all the auditions and made it out on top. That has to mean something. N'Sync's drummer, Billy Ashbaugh, is actually a good, completely respectable drummer. I've looked up what he's been doing after the boy band, and he's a really fantastic player.
Re: Pop Music in General
Play what you like. Life's too short to play music you hate...
(just my little 2 cent opinion)
Re: Pop Music in General
Rosanna was a pop song. I am currently teaching that groove to about 6 students.
I realised some years ago that most people only like music. Some simply tolerate it while others give it no thought at all. What we as musicians miss is the understanding of the public's general lack of interest.
Sometimes too I am tired and just want to hear something light. Mostly I listen to world music and it is amazing. There's a great deal of choice. But you know, many musicians I have known have had the most limited taste of any people I have met. If a style does not fit into their idea of what is cool, most just close their ears. Especially the least experienced musicians.
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UC Davis MIND Institute Resource Center
We're Here to Help!
The UC Davis MIND Institute and Center for Excellence in Developmental Disabilities have collaborated to bring you comprehensive resources relating to neurodevelopmental disorders and other conditions.
Along with the online resources we provide on this site, you are welcome to visit the Resource Center located at the MIND Institute (directions) and browse our collection of books, DVDs, handouts, brochures, and utilize our computers for research.
The information online and in our Resource Center is helpful to parents, professionals, and the community. If you can't find it here, we also offer assistance in locating helpful resources for your specific needs.
The Resource Center is open Monday through Friday from 9am - 5pm. We generally have Spanish-speaking staff on Mondays, Thursdays, and Fridays. If you'd like to make an appointment with a particular staff person or a Spanish-speaking staff person, or have questions, please call us at 916-703-0336. The Resource Center is closed on UC Davis holidays.

subset: commoncrawl


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[Craig Fravert, Jane Hinds, Cindy Fravert]
Fall Donor Event
On Thursday, November 21, the annual Fall Donor Event was held at the home of Bill and Emily Bowron. Over 60 supporters of Birmingham Botanical Gardens enjoyed cocktails and hors d'oeuvres.
[Harold Bissel, Mena Brock, John Brock]
[Tricia and Jim Holbrook]
[Holly DeBuys, Bob DeBuys, Michael Balliet, Peggy Balliet]
Tags: Andrew Krebbs, Blake Ells, Bob DeBuys, Cindy Fravert, Craig Fravert, Harold Bissel, Holly DeBuys, Jane Hinds, John Brock, Mena Brock, Michael Balliet, Peggy Balliet, Tricia and Jim Holbrook


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Avoiding unexpected situations
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text: › Sustainability » What We're Doing » Food Home Our Vision Our Commitment What is Sustainability? Sustainability Planning Council National Recognition STARS Highlights What We're Doing Energy Food Green Buildings Recycling Transportation Water What You Can Do Student Organizations Residential Communities Volunteer Opportunities Academics & Research Major in Sustainability Science Curriculum Research Community Outreach Furman Farm Resources Contact Us Plan a Visit ›Apply Now ›Give to Furman › Main Content Column 1 Our food choices at Furman have a significant impact on our health, culture, environment, and local and global economies. We are committed to limiting these impacts by using fresh, locally and sustainably produced foods. Furman's dining services are dedicated to being sustainable in their operations and adding as much local and organic food as possible to food options available to students. We even use herbs grown right here on campus in the Furman Farm!


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Electrical block insulator
EnergyBlock is a piece of foam insulation molded to fit securely around standard electrical boxes, which reduces the chance of mold forming due to moist inside air escaping and condensing on an exterior wall. Electricians can install EnergyBlock in less than two minutes, and it's sealed after rough wiring is complete so there's no chance of breaking the seal. The block provides a solid R-10 insulation behind the outlet every time and meets the International Building Code for flame spread and smoke development.
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Structured cabling products
The eXtreme 6+ system line of Cat. 6 structured cabling products are designed for gigabit Ethernet applications, future-proofing for HDTV applications, and evolving entertainment and communication applications. Products in the line include Cat. 6 QuickPort connectors and the multimedia adapter bracket and mounting plate for installation in this manufacturer's structured media centers. The system is compatible with this manufacturer's line of QuickPort field configurable wallplates and housings.
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text: I really enjoyed watching Shepherd Clark skate! He is a U.S. skater who won the U.S. pewter medal in 1998. I was doing a web search to see what he's been up to the past decade, but can't find anything. I know he has designed jewelry and worked with charities in the past. He seems like a great person and I always enjoyed watching his inspiring skating. Does anyone have an update on this skater?


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Do you still remember the toys of your youth? They might be far different compare to the toys created nowadays, but still, it is a Toy. Kids today can get virtually any plaything their little hearts desire by jumping online (either virtually via the Internet or by going old-school and standing in line at the local toy store) . Below are some Toy stores that sells, what your siblings or special someone desired to have.
Anime Jungle
JennyBec's Toys for Children
Karen's Toys
Tom's Toys
Hollywood Toys & Costumes
Kip's Toyland
Mattel, Inc.
The Green Bean
Dinosaur Farm
Star Toys
A Magic Forest
Mr G's Toys & Expressions
Traveling Tikes Baby Shop
Jack's Wholesale Candy & Toy
Puzzle Zoo
Comics VS Toys
ABC Kids
Child's Play Toys
Giant Robot Store
Right Start
Landis' Labyrinth Toy Shop
Toy World
The LEGO Store
Evett's Model Shop
Charming Grace Toys, Inc.
Miracle Mile Toys & Games
B & B Toymaker Corporation
Giant Toys
Starworld Toys
Mega Toys
Big Kid Collectable Toy Mall & Retro Store
Toys "R" Us
Pinwheel Palace
Fun Life Toys LLC
Acme Toyz
H & L Lucky Bamboo Wholesale
Train Shack Inc
S & H International Inc
ABC Toys
Cal Toys, Inc.
Tom's Models
Maui Toys Inc
Fu-Shing Toy & Gift
Toy Mandala
Sunstar Industries Warehouse
Spin Master Inc.
Bruder Toys America, Inc.
TPN Toys Co
American Girl Place Los Angeles
O K Toys Inc
SLB Toys USA Inc
The Stockroom/Syren Retail Boutique
For more Toy Stores in Los Angeles,click here: http://us.wowcity.com/losangeles/?what=Toy+Stores
When childreb play with their toys, they are actually exploring the world, but on manageable scale.Unconciously, they are making sense of the world by seeing what rules operate within the grasp of their hands.


text:
2.- Best features/cost relation.
3.- Passed all our tests.
Until now, there was no known policy against other system, even if they didn't support it. You could use their boards as long as your system adheres to the same standards the board was supposed to support. With this statement, Gigabyte said they don't care about specifications, so their products are trash.
Not providing support for linux is one thing, not caring to fix their faulty products is something entirely different.


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Votre titre Audible gratuit
The Steel Wave
Prix : 47,47 €
General Dwight Eisenhower once again commands a diverse army that must find its single purpose in the destruction of Hitler's European fortress. His primary subordinates, Omar Bradley and Bernard Montgomery, must prove that this unique blend of Allied armies can successfully confront the might of Adolf Hitler's forces, who have already conquered Western Europe. On the coast of France, German commander Erwin Rommel fortifies and prepares for the coming invasion, acutely aware that he must bring all his skills to bear on a fight his side must win. But Rommel's greatest challenge is to strike the Allies on his front, while struggling behind the lines with the growing insanity of Adolf Hitler, who thwarts the strategies Rommel knows will succeed.
Meanwhile, Sergeant Jesse Adams, a no-nonsense veteran of the 82nd Airborne, parachutes with his men behind German lines into a chaotic and desperate struggle. And as the invasion force surges toward the beaches of Normandy, Private Tom Thorne of the 29th Infantry Division faces the horrifying prospects of fighting his way ashore on a stretch of coast more heavily defended than the Allied commanders anticipate - Omaha Beach.
From G.I. to general, this story carries the reader through the war's most crucial juncture, the invasion that altered the flow of the war, and, ultimately, changed history.
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Ce que les membres d'Audible en pensent
- Ryan
- 15/04/2015
The best kind of WWII history book
Any additional comments?
The Steel Wave is the second in a trilogy (which ended up being 4 books) Shaara wrote about WWII, the first three about the war in Europe and the fourth covering the latter end of the war in the pacific.
The Steel Wave picks up right where The Rising Tide left off - with the Normandy invasion and Patton's sweep across Europe. These books have been some of the best resources I have come across for learning WWII battles, major players, and timelines. The book effectively conveys the horror of these key battles through the eyes of several main characters.
And unlike many war novels, Shaara is fairly clean in his writing. He doesn't go over the top trying to mimic soldier-speak or the language any one of us might use if under fire. In other words, the books are a great way for teens or young adults to learn history. That's not to say the books are too polished or boring - they're exciting and well written. Highly recommended.
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- Richard
- 11/11/2008
The Steel Wave
This book should be required High School reading. You feel the emotions, the stress, the pain of war from both sides.
4 sur 4 personne(s) ont trouvé cet avis utile.
- David
- 22/05/2010
Generals - Yes ... Average Soldiers - No
Shaara does a great job with Generals and statesmen. But when the story jumps away to tell a soldiers story, it just doesn't have the same impact as the dialog the Generals speak. The soldier parts are almost forgettable, where the Generals seem to have better lines.
2 sur 2 personne(s) ont trouvé cet avis utile.
- Mark
- 28/04/2009
Entertaining way to learn history
I like this format of "history telling". It makes it easier to listen to and retain. I am ready to get the last part of this trilogy of WWII history.
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- Lemons40
- 03/12/2009
Another great work by Shaara. For historians and non-historians alike it is a great read. These books, while simplifying some of the more complex aspects of WWII (for obvious reasons)provide a vibrant tableaux that enhances anyones understanding of these monumental events. History is not a series of events, but a series of actions by people with distinct motivations, attributes and flaws as Shaara so amply demonstrates.
Paul Michael is a national treasure. Not only does he 'get' Eisenhower and Churchille in tone and temperment (not to mention sounding like them)but he brings the fictional characters to life. His soldiers sound like soldiers. As one myself, I know them when I hear them.
As a Rommel buff, I will never read anything about Rommel again, without hearing Paul Michaels excellent performance of him.
4 sur 5 personne(s) ont trouvé cet avis utile.
- Marc Dieters
- 01/10/2014
You're even more in the middle of it !!"
Like the first part of this series, this book tells a historical story from a personal perspective.
This book tells the story of D-Day from the eyes of mainly American Forces.
The big difference with part 1 is this story is more from the men on the ground and less from a commanders perspective.
I really enjoy these personal stories. You really feel the emotions and experiences of the men.
I'm totally hooked to this series.
VERY highly recommended.
1 sur 1 personne(s) ont trouvé cet avis utile.
- Carroll
- 04/12/2013
A great view of an epic campaign!
Well researched as usual...... I've read the classic histories of this campaign.... I have walked all 5 beaches in humble awe.... and I was still surprised with aspects from the German side in his narrative..... another awesome work.
1 sur 1 personne(s) ont trouvé cet avis utile.
- G.Monie
- 13/07/2013
Great, what 'Saving Pvt. Ryan' couldn't include
'Saving Private Ryan' as mentioned in this book was a great visual conception of the D-Day Normandy Invasion, but like I said the movie as with most could not go into detail of all the different viewpoints that were involved into the planning & ultimate follow thru of all the 'moving parts' of the invasion of France... Everyone knows the paratroopers sent behind lines were completely scattered & basically were still able to pull together & achieve their ultimate objectives showing that 'commandos' or soldiers performing behind enemy lines can really be a pivotal technique
The book itself goes thru a lot of behind the scenes of power & which major characters (Eisenhower, Churchhill, Patton, etc...) thought about pre-invasion planning & strategy & the last parts of the book mainly focus on individual soldiers experiences overcoming the fear & odds stacked against them to be part of a war that the world will hopefully never have to see again, although considering how our enemies fight nowadays I doubt anything like WW1 or WW2 will go down as clear cut as the past with battle lines & world domination (but u never know?). I would highly recommend this book to anyone who enjoys both the historical value & the action in a well written fiction. Shaara is great in combining both, I personally enjoy the visceral violence of battle, written of course! But there are always ways of writing it in a way that is both filled with historical knowledge & giving u the feeling of fear & what the troops had to go thru physically
I highly recommend this book for anyone looking for a book on a subject that has been written on frequently, put into movies, or just included on TV so commonly, this will not disappoint in giving another level in the guessed/written perspectives of those involved on both sides of the fight...
1 sur 1 personne(s) ont trouvé cet avis utile.
- Jim
- 09/02/2013
Great Listen
What other book might you compare The Steel Wave to and why?
Any of Jeff Shaara's books are compelling in my view
What about Paul Michael's performance did you like?
Paul Michael's can make you feel like you are listening to the real person, great performance
Was there a moment in the book that particularly moved you?
being a bit of a history fan the entire book was infomative andeductaional while still entertaining
Any additional comments?
Listen to the entire trilogoy of WWII but do so in order so it all ties together. Jeff Shaara puts you there and Paul Michael does a great job with the characters
1 sur 1 personne(s) ont trouvé cet avis utile.
- KayMac
- 16/02/2010
Very good read. Excellent perspective of WW II.
1 sur 1 personne(s) ont trouvé cet avis utile.
- vrunkel
- Buckenhof, Deutschland
- 29/01/2010
Gut geschrieben
Gut geschrieben, zeigt den Verlauf der Invasion aus verschiedenen Sichten mit hohem Realit?tsgrad an.


text:
In the popular ABC television drama "Nashville," a young country music artist is discovered by a famous producer and offered a signing bonus. But the bonus is not cash—instead, it is a gorgeously restored, classic convertible sports car. The musician happily accepts this gleaming prize over the protestations of his manager, who reminds him that the car is worth much less than standard signing bonuses. But the advice falls on deaf ears. The young musician jumps behind the wheel of the convertible and speeds blissfully away, his hair blowing in the wind.
Why would someone be satisfied—happy even—with an obviously inferior reward? According to Neal J. Roese, a professor of marketing at the Kellogg School of Management, and Jingjing Ma, a doctoral student at Kellogg, it all comes down to how "countable" the reward is. The two argue that presenting rewards or bonuses in less quantifiable terms decreases the likelihood that recipients will compare rewards, which in turn increases their satisfaction.
Accentuate the Positive
Ma first noted the "countability effect" as a college student researching rural minority ethnic groups in her native China. "I noticed people in these communities are not likely to compare what they get to people who receive more than them," Ma says. "They focus on what they have—even if it's less than what others have. I belong to a minority group in China myself, and noticing this behavior pattern motivated me to study how unhappy feelings might be mitigated in unfair reward distributions."
Ma teamed up with Roese, whose own research has focused on "the emotion of regret and how people make spontaneous comparisons," he says. "Does it matter how you present rewards? People are usually upset if they're on the short end of the stick. But we found that when things are less easily quantified into nice whole numbers, people are much less sensitive to differences in fairness."
The researchers built upon a framework called General Evaluability Theory, which identifies three basic ways in which people compare items in order to extract information about their subjective worth. We may use our own built-in experience of the world—such as our inherent knowledge that 150-degree weather is too hot, but 70 degrees Fahrenheit is pleasant—to judge the desirability of an item. We may also rely on specialized expertise, as a jeweler does when examining a diamond. Or we may simply compare two items side by side, "such as tasting two different flavors of potato chip," Roese explains. "When we noticed this additional pattern of 'countability' anecdotally, we wondered how we could connect it up with this existing theory of how people evaluate things."
Uncountable Unfairness
The authors began by designing a simple experiment to test whether making unequal rewards less countable would reduce dissatisfaction. They randomly assigned 120 Chinese university students to two groups: members of the "overbenefit" group would receive 60% of a fixed reward, while members of an "underbenefit" group would only receive 40%. Each of these groups was divided again: some people would receive a "countable" reward in the form of cash (either six or four ¥1 bills, from a total of ten), while the others would receive an "uncountable" reward of a slice of cake (representing 60% or 40% of the whole cake).
Underbenefited participants—those who received four ¥1 bills or a smaller slice of cake—reported less satisfaction than their overbenefited peers. But those who received the cake were much less dissatisfied in general: on a seven-point scale, their average satisfaction rating was a 5. The average satisfaction of those who received the smaller amount of cash, meanwhile, was only 2. The difference between overbenefitted and underbenefitted cake-eaters' satisfaction was also much smaller: overbenefited participants, who received a larger slice, reported an average satisfaction rating of 6—just one "point" higher than their underbenefited peers.
According to Ma, offering cake encouraged the recipients to focus on the experiential aspect of their reward—"oh, this cake is delicious," she says—instead of "thinking about how they received less than the other guy." She and Roese conducted eight additional experiments designed to test the limits of this effect. "We did it with kids and adults, Americans and Chinese, other goods like cooking oil—trying to generalize it outwards," Roese explains. "The consistency of the results—that uncountable rewards leave people less dissatisfied even when they're unequal—was impressive and intriguing."
"Upsizing" Satisfaction
The results have clear applications for marketing promotions, which can create feelings of dissatisfaction in consumers who miss out on the deal (either because the promotion ends or because supplies run out). Ma and Roese created an experiment in which a "countable" promotional reward, such as "buy one get one free," was contrasted with an uncountable reward (in the form of "upsizing" a product or offering 50% more shampoo in a container, for example). The effects on satisfaction still held. "You feel happy if you get the reward, whether it's 'buy one get one free' or upsizing," says Ma. "However, if you miss out on it, you feel more upset when it's 'buy one get one free,' which is more countable."
The authors say that their results suggest that less countable promotional strategies, like upsizing, will result in more customer satisfaction overall. Ma and Roese are currently studying how the countability effect functions in credit card rewards programs, which often offer number-based bonuses such as extra "points" or "miles." Instead of these offerings, rewards could be presented in "experiential packages" such as vacations, trips, or goods.
Cultures of Counting
If highlighting experiences over quantities increases satisfaction, should companies start paying bonuses to their employees in cars instead of cash, as the record producer in "Nashville" did? Not necessarily, cautions Ma. Offering experiential rewards may reduce dissatisfaction when the rewards are unequally distributed, but uncountability "can also be costly," she says. "You need to purchase real goods and distribute them, and you also need to figure out what people really like or need. That's a lot more work than just issuing cash."
Furthermore, cultural expectations can complicate matters. According to Ma, China has a decades-long tradition of issuing employee rewards in the form of real goods. "Chinese companies survey their employees regularly so they know what to do," she says. "Even in recent years, we still use a combination of real goods and money. But in the U.S., where this practice is less common, an employee might think, 'I don't really need a trip to New York, why did you give me this?' Or, 'I don't need a coffee maker, I already have one.'"
Further study to determine these "boundary conditions," as Roese calls them, will be necessary to put the countability effect and its potential applications into proper context. "It's natural to draw comparisons and also to think about ideals," he says. "What's the best I can get? What's the optimal way to behave? But these are things we're thinking about at the cost of appreciating what's right in front of us."
Learn more:
- Credit Card Industry and Market
- Mobile Payment Technologies
- Mobile Payments Industry
- Mobile Payment Market, Trends and Adoption
- Credit Card Processing Industry
- List of Credit Card Processing Companies
- List of Credit Card Processing Networks
- List of Payment Gateway Providers
- M-Commerce: Mobile Shopping Trends
- E-Commerce Payment Technologies and Trends


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El Niño in the central and eastern equatorial Pacific Ocean is expected to be a dominant climate factor that will influence the December through February winter weather in the U.S., according to the 2009 Winter Outlook released by NOAA's Climate Prediction Center. "We expect El Niño to strengthen and persist through the winter months, providing clues as to what the weather will be like during the period," says Mike Halpert, deputy director of the Climate Prediction Center. "Warmer ocean water in the equatorial Pacific shifts the patterns of tropical rainfall that in turn change the strength and position of the jet stream and storms over the Pacific Ocean and the U.S." (More)
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Steve Hackett
Dr. Steve Hackett strives for neutrality. An odd goal? Not really, when you consider the nature of his work as an economics professor.
"I see it as my job to produce and explain unbiased information for policy makers," he says. "Good economists are less about opinion and more about economic realities."
Steve views himself as a scientist trying to "explain what is" and says he lets "policy makers and the public assign value" to the tradeoffs he uncovers in his research. He was named Humboldt State's Scholar of the Year 2005 for his research, including examining the economic impacts of a declining crab fishery in Northern California. "There's a pattern in my working and teaching. I tend to look at the relationship between economics and the environment or natural resources," Steve explains. "I've always had a tremendous interest in the natural world."
That attraction to the environment led him to Montana State University where he began studying natural resource management. But his interests in economics — piqued from economic discussions with his father during the oil crisis of the 1970s — eventually caused him to alter the course of his studies.
Steve currently serves as a consultant with Planwest Partners, a local community and environmental planning firm, and collaborates with Humboldt State's Schatz Energy Research Center examining the feasibility of renewable energy projects on Indian tribal lands. He also conducts research for various government agencies such as the California Department of Fish and Game, where he is researching the economic impact of the state's declining fisheries, and the United States Department of Agriculture, where he provides technical analysis concerning the deregulation of genetically modified alfalfa.
The North Coast's unique economy has provided Steve with plenty of research opportunities. He founded the Humboldt Economic Index, a barometer that tracks six sectors of the county's economy since January 1994. The index is compiled by professors and students, and published monthly. It's the county's only frequently updated source of broad-based economic indicators.
"Humboldt County is a regional economic center for a remote area," he says. "We have a more diversified economy than other rural areas that are heavily dependent upon agriculture or natural resources."
What does Steve do when he's not studying the county's fiscal matters or examining the potential economic impacts of a policy decision?
"I ride 4,000 to 5,000 miles a year on my bike. It's a major part of my life that I find deeply satisfying."


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Amazon loves LoveFilm (true)
Enough to buy out the company?
Amazon is mulling a £200 million bid for Lovefilm, the UK's answer to Netflix, the Sunday Times reports.
Techcrunch UK's Mike Butcher is sceptical - he reckons The Sunday Times is often used as a stalking horse to help investors achieve a "liquidity event" - i.e. cash in some or all of their shares.
Unlike Mike we cannot claim any inside knowledge, but an Amazon-Lovefilm tie-in makes sense to us, even if nothing is on the cards now.
First up, Lovefilm is running the slide rule over a stock market flotation - at a time when IPOs are unpopular.
Secondly, the act of preparing a flotation often smokes out a buyer - it is easier, cheaper and gives investers the chance to sell out in full.
Third, and this is crucial, Amazon is already Lovefilm's biggest shareholder,, with a 42 per cent stake, after reversing its European film rental operation into the company in 2008 and later buying out one of the VC backers.
Lovefilm has the customers - 1.4 million all told - that Amazon wants. And it does something that Amazon used to do and wants still to do.
Most Lovefilm customers rent their films by post, rather than by Internet or TV, and Techcrunch thinks that buying a" legacy physical operation" would be a distraction for Amazon.
We disagree: Amazon does physical distribution as good or better than anyone. It is also managing the transition to online - witness The Kindle - rather well. As an independent Lovefilm will struggle to convert all its customers to a world of media players and video on demand. It is simply too small to take on the internet giants. This makes it a perfect fit for Amazon.


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Eboard has a relatively simple interface, which comes packaged with a few alternatives graphical themes.
You can use this client to play against the computer, a remote server, or directly with another Eboard user on a remote computer.
In the last two cases, you can chat with the other player using the text entry field in the left bottom corner.
Eboard also makes it easy to teach chess to somebody. You can replay a whole game and explain its strategy by moving back and forth, move by move, with the VCR-like buttons in the lower part of the window.
Eboard development services are hosted by SourceForge.
An FTP mirror of eboard and related files is kindly hosted by the SEUL project.
You may also automate Eboard actions, or create custom ones, by writing scripts and binding them to extra buttons.
DownloadEboard is distributed as source code. You will need a C++ compiler and the GTK 2.x libraries (any version above 2.4.0). You also need to have Perl 5 installed. Most Linux distributions fulfill the above requirements.
Current Release: 1.1.1eboard 1.1.1 was released on Feb 22nd, 2008. It fixes text overlapping on the seek graph, adds non-ASCII character filtering, allows text timestamps, provides better text searching and fixes promotions in peer-to-peer games. See the ChangeLog for further details.
Download Source eboard-1.1.1.tar.bz2 (462 KB) from Sourceforge (release date: Feb 22nd, 2008)
Binary Packages Linux RPM for i386 (32-bit): eboard-1.1.1-1.i386.rpm (631 KB) from Sourceforge Linux RPM for x86_64 (64-bit): eboard-1.1.1-1.x86_64.rpm (644 KB) from Sourceforge Linux RPM packages built on CentOS 4.5. Requirements: glibc >=2.3.0, GTK+ >=2.4.0.
eboard-extrasThe eboard-extras packages are additional graphics and sounds for eboard. Unpack and install these after eboard has been installed. You can see examples of these graphics in the gallery section of the screenshots page.
Extras Pack 1 (22 piece sets + 3 sounds) Download eboard-extras-1pl2.tar.gz (360 KB) from Sourceforge (release date: Sep 8th, 2001)
Extras Pack 2 (12 piece sets + 10 sounds) Download eboard-extras-2.tar.gz (598 KB) from Sourceforge
(release date: Jul 7th, 2003)
(release date: Jul 7th, 2003)
(old) eboard for GTK 1.2.xeboard 0.9.5 was the last version of eboard based on GTK 1.2.x. On 32-bit systems it may be a bit more stable than the current 1.0 series. If you have problems with 1.0.0, try 0.9.5.
- Download eboard-0.9.5.tar.bz2 (360 KB) from Sourceforge (release date: Nov 26th, 2003)
Compilation InstructionsUnpack the source code with the command tar jxvf eboard-1.1.0.tar.bz2, and follow the instructions in the README and INSTALL files.
To compile eboard with DGT board support you need to have dgtnix installed, version 1.7 or later. The file Documentation/DGTboard.txt in eboard's source distribution has detailed instructions for setting up dgtnix.


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Like I said, they are quick.
Also, you apparently are subscribed to the beta releases, the latest non-beta is still 1.9.29.
Yeah, I just thought I'd ask.
I was forced to opt into the 1.9 beta by a mod. I upgraded a mod (SkyUI, I think) which would not work without the latest SKSE. Which in turn would not work with the latest non-beta Skyrim patch. Thus, I had to opt into the beta. I never turned it off.
Stability is better, or my luck is. I'd never had much luck with Skyrim before, with regards to crashes and questline-breaking bugs. I would start a quest line, finish it, and before I got far in the next one, something would break. This is my Dark Brotherhood character. A Dunmer whose story began when he was mugged and left for dead south of Rorikstead. After the Dark Brotherhood he moved onto Dawnguard, then the Companions and then the College of Winterhold. Those done, he started the Main Quest at level 52. I'm actually going for the Daedric and Side quests now -- I've got 7 of the former and 6 of the latter done.
Guys, I'm almost fully convinced that Bethesda planned a "Wipe Out the Thieves Guild" quest similar to, but perhaps more involved than the "Wipe Out the Dark Brotherhood" quest. Mjoll talks about doing it. The merchants talk about wanting somebody to do it. You can ask about corruption in the Jarl's palace. The only problem I can see is, Delvin is tied into the Dark Brotherhood quest. And Vex is needed for the Stones of Barenziah collection. I think both of them (or rather, their function) could have been duplicated.
Barring that, I'm actually going to do the Thieves Guild (yet again -- it's great) but I've taken a further step. Married Mjoll, and I'm going to move her to one of the Hearthfire houses, so her big nose is out of the Guild's business. I don't even care if that guy who rescued her from the Dwemer ruin goes to see her. The marriage was purely for the Guild. Although, Mjoll might be the best female fighter companion. She rushes into combat and eats friendly fire like they all do, but she doesn't whine all the time like Serana or sell herself out as a stealth agent and ruin your sneaking like Jenassa. She is repetitive but not that bad.


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Skip to content. Skip to main navigation.
Professor investigates plant defenses
Wednesday, December 5, 2012
Media Contact: Traci Peterson
Researchers examining how the hormone jasmonate works to protect plants and promote their growth have revealed how a transcriptional repressor of the jasmonate signaling pathway makes its way into the nucleus of the plant cell.
They hope the recently published discovery will eventually help farmers experience better crop yields with less use of potentially harmful chemicals.
"This is a small piece of a bigger picture, but it is a very important piece," said Maeli Melotto, a University of Texas at Arlington assistant professor of biology.
Melotto recently co-authored a paper that advances current understanding of plant defense mechanisms with her collaborator Sheng Yang He and his team at Michigan State University's Department of Energy Plant Research Laboratory (DOE-PRL). He is a Howard Hughes Medical Institute-Gordon and Betty Moore Foundation investigator. A paper on the collaboration was published online Nov. 19 in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences under the title, "Transcription factor-dependent nuclear import of transcriptional repressor in jasmonate hormone signaling."
Jasmonate signaling has been a target of intense research because of its important role in maintaining the balance between plant growth and defense. In healthy plants, jasmonates play a role in reproductive development and growth responses. But, when stressors such as herbivorous insects, pathogen attack, or drought, jasmonate signaling shifts to defense-related cellular processes.
The team from UT Arlington and Michigan State focused on the role of jasmonate signaling repressors referred to as JAZ. Specifically, they looked at how JAZ interacts with a major transcription factor called MYC2 and a protein called COI1, which is a receptor necessary for jasmonate signaling.
The researchers discovered that a physical interaction between the repressors and the MYC2 persisted inside the plant cell nucleus, preventing jasmonate-associated gene transcription.
"This tight repression of transcription factors may be important because activation of jasmonate signaling, although important for plant defense against pathogens and insects, is energy-consuming and could lead to growth inhibition – a widely known phenomenon called growth-defense tradeoff," said He, the Michigan State plant biologist. "In other words, plants have developed a mechanism to tightly repress presumably energy-consuming, jasmonate-mediated defense responses until it becomes necessary, such as upon pathogen and insect attacks."
The National Institutes of Health, the U.S. Department of Energy, Howard Hughes Medical Institute and the Gordon and Betty Moore Foundation funded the work featured in the recent paper.
Melotto said understanding jasmonate signaling at the molecular level is also vital because some plant pathogens, such as Pseudomonas syringae, have developed ways to mimic the hormone's action in the cell. This gives them the ability to aggressively colonize plants without activating natural defense mechanisms, she said.
Melotto, who is currently receiving National Institutes of Health funding to examine plant defenses, said the next step in her jasmonate research is to determine which domain of the JAZ protein is responsible for plant innate immunity.
"This is one way to have sustainable agriculture," Melotto said of the research. "By increasing genetic resistance we could reduce the use of pesticides, decrease crop production costs and promote environmentally friendly farming practices."
Melotto's work with Michigan State University is an example of the collaborative research going on at UT Arlington, a comprehensive research institution of more than 33,200 students and more than 2,200 faculty members in the heart of North Texas. Visit www.uta.edu to learn more.
The University of Texas at Arlington is an Equal Opportunity and Affirmative Action employer.


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More About: World News Business Facebook Twitter Yahoo Google Google Glasses Blackberry Samsung Steve Jobs Apple
San Jose, California (CNN) -- After three weeks, the closely watched Apple versus Samsung patent trial wound down Tuesday with four hours of closing arguments.
Apple is accusing Samsung of copying the design of the iPhone and iPad, suing Samsung for $2.5 billion. Samsung denies any wrongdoing and is counter suing Apple for $519 million, also for patent infringement.
Tuesday's closing arguments capped off weeks of testimony that included highs -- colorful stories from Apple executives about the iPhone's origin -- and lows -- jurors nodding off during drier discussions of software patents. The final battle for the jury's favor had a little bit of both.
Judge Lucy Koh urged the two sides to try one last time to reach a settlement Friday. Apple chief executive Tim Cook spoke Monday to former Samsung CEO Choi Gee-Sung but they couldn't reach an agreement.
Now the decision rests with the jury, which must determine exactly what devices violated which patents, as well as how much money, if any, is owed in damages. While its decision could go either way, what's certain is that the outcome will have a far-reaching affect on the technology industry.
Closing arguments
Throughout the trial, the two sides presented their cases with distinctly different styles, which were represented in the closing statements. Apple generally went more for emotional impact by keeping its narrative simple and engaging, showing the jury easy-to-understand images of devices. Samsung argued that Apple's approach didn't go deep enough to prove that individual devices infringed on patents, and dove into more technical detail.
Apple urged jurors to judge based on "historical documents" and to look at the evidence in chronological order. "That's where you'll find the truth," said Apple council Harold McElhinny. Samsung put the emphasis on chunks of transcribed text of testimony from the trial that it said supported its case.
Apple blamed Samsung for abusing its monopoly powers.
Apple blamed Samsung for abusing its monopoly powers.
Both sides injected a mix of anger, passion and hyperbole into their closing arguments.
"Apple took five years to bring this revolution to U.S; Samsung took three months to copy it. That's the truth and that's simple, clear, and not disputed." said McElhinny, referring to the the three months Samsung spent developing the Galaxy S smartphone.
Samsung didn't spend much time denying the similarities between the product lines, but rather claiming that form followed function. "It's not against the law to be inspired by your competition," said Samsung council Charles Verhoeven, going on to argue that Apple can't patent "a rectangle with rounded corners." He compared current smartphone design to TVs, which changed across brands from thick heavy boxes to black, flat rectangles.
Samsung claimed that Apple was being anti-competitive, and "seeking a competitive edge through the courtroom." Any decision in Apple's favor, Samsung warned, would lead to a country made up of "giant conglomerates, armed with patent arsenals, that block competition."
Apple also painted its side as best for America, saying a decision for Apple would be reaffirming the American patent system, allowing companies to continue hiring people and investing in technology companies. Just finding for Apple wouldn't be enough, it claimed, as a slap on the wrist wouldn't stop Samsung from doing the same thing again.
A main point of contention throughout the trial was customer confusion -- if a casual shopper could confuse a similar-looking Samsung product for an iPhone or iPad. Apple insisted that the jury did not need to believe people had actually been fooled into buying the wrong product, just that the overall visual resemblance between Samsung and Apple products is deceptive.
Samsung said no analysis was presented on whether or not any customers were confused at the point of sale, and contended that there was no deception or confusion.
"Customers make choices, not mistakes," said Verhoeven.
What's ahead for the jury
The jury has to reach a unanimous verdict, a task complicated by the amount of variables in the decision. Jurors must fill out a daunting 20-page verdict form, marking on worksheets exactly which Samsung products infringe on Apple patents and vice versa.
Judge Koh has expressed concern in recent days that members of the jury could be "seriously confused." There are 84 jury instructions totaling 102 pages, including recaps of accusations, key terminology, and directions on how to operate the smartphones and tablets.
"I need everyone to stay conscious during the reading of instructions, including myself" said Koh, who read the entire document to the jury on Tuesday morning, being sure to throw in periodic standing breaks to keep the jury alert.
The thick document will serve as a guide for jurors when they begin deliberations at 9 a.m. Wednesday. They'll also have access to the full line of contested smartphones and tablets so they can examine the hardware and software up close.
Larger implications
Apple is asking for $2.5 billion in damages. The amount, if awarded in full, would be almost three times the amount of the largest patent verdict ever, according to Mark Lemley, a law professor at Stanford University. But the amount isn't what would have the biggest impact on the smartphone industry.
"Even more important than the money is the risk of an injunction," said Lemley. Samsung could be forced to pull its products from the market and redesign them, a costly and time-consuming process that would give Apple an advantage in the smartphone and tablet market, especially if consumers prefer to stick with Apple's familiar designs.
The ramifications wouldn't stop with Samsung. A verdict for Apple would serve as a warning to all Android handset manufacturers.
"Apple's real target in this suit is the Android ecosystem, not just Samsung," said Lemley. There's some debate over whether forcing these companies back to the drawing board would have long term benefits. Lemley says it could promote more diversity, but not necessarily innovation.
A new report from investment research firm UBS says that in the long run, forcing competitors to experiment with new designs could result in new products that are an even greater risk to Apple.
"It could hurt Apple because the real threat is not a competitor beating Apple at its own game but instead changing the game," the report says.
If Samsung wins, it's possible Android smartphone and tablet makers would continue to make products similar to Apple's, leading to more unified design across the industry and a dearth of innovative new products.
A split decision is also a possibility. Peter Lee, a law professor at UC Davis School of Law, says a decision that finds both companies liable for patent infringement would confirm the importance of smartphone and tablet patents.
"It may also accelerate the trend of companies amassing enormous patent portfolios to protect their freedom to operate and provide 'insurance" if they are sued for patent infringement,' said Lee.
One thing everyone can agree on is that a jury decision isn't likely to end the Apple versus Samsung drama.
"One can expect appeals and perhaps, ultimately, a settlement." said Lee.
Edited By Cen Fox Post Team


text: This past weekend we did geocaching in the sunshine of the Millinocket and Greenville area. I started using my 60cs and it was jumping all over. I went to my Vista and it worked to perfection ALL weekend. I just used my 60cs for routing only. Both days were clear and we were in the open most of the time. I think there is something Garmin isn't telling us about the 60cs.


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Atmospheric Sciences & Global Change
Research Highlights
May 2007
Greenhouse Gas: Caught Between a Rock and a Hard Place
Prehistoric lava flows hold great promise for addressing climate change
Typical stratigraphy of a single flow basalt formation includes both porous vesicular and brecciated zones (flow top and bottom, respectively). This formation could be suitable for long-term CO2 storage, with flow interior acting as a seal to prevent CO2 from leaving the target storage zones. Enlarged View
Results: Findings from recent laboratory experiments confirm carbon dioxide (CO2) injected into deeply buried basalt formations can be effectively trapped by the relatively rapid formation of stable carbonate mineral compounds. A key discovery by researchers at the Pacific Northwest National Laboratory is that these carbonate minerals form in a relatively short period of time after CO2 injection, which should enhance long term retention. These results verify their hypothesis that in situ mineralization rates are quite promising and that field testing of CO2 storage in these formations should be accelerated.
Why it matters: Given the central role played by fossil fuels in the global economy, a great deal of current research and development is focused on creating the means to reduce CO2 emissions cost effectively. Carbon dioxide capture and storage represents a set of technologies aimed at capturing CO2 from large, stationary sources such as industrial and power generation facilities, and injecting the compressed CO2 into deeply buried geologic formations to permanently isolate it from the atmosphere. This class of technologies appears to hold significant promise through its ability to cost effectively reduce hundreds of billions of tons of CO2 emissions from large, industrial sources if society can address the technological and policy issues that currently stand in the way of large-scale deployment of CCS.
Researchers at PNNL have shown that flood basalts have significant potential capacity for safely isolating vast quantities of anthropogenic CO2 in the United States and abroad in key developing nations such as India. Basalt flows have many geologic characteristics that make them attractive candidates for CO2 storage. These formations contain regions that are porous and permeable, qualities that make the rocks capable of storing CO2. Just above these porous, permeable layers lie low-permeability layers of rock from subsequent flows that should act as an effective seal to trap the CO2 in the deep subsurface allowing time for mineralization reactions to occur. If this approach proves viable, major flood basalts in the United States and India would provide significant CO2 storage capacity, as well as geologic storage options for certain regions where more conventional storage options, like depleted oil and gas fields, are limited.
This figures shows the distribution of major basalt formations in the United States (brown areas) along with distribution of CO2 sources (green circles).
Enlarged View
Methods: Computing the rate of carbonate mineral formation in a real basalt formation requires, at a minimum, detailed information about three primary characteristics of the formation: (1) solution concentrations of calcium, magnesium, iron, and manganese required to precipitate calcite or other carbonates, (2) release rate of these elements from the basalt, and (3) concentration of CO2 dissolved in the formation waters. Because all three characteristics are strongly coupled, rigorous calculation of carbonate mineralization rates requires solving a complex reactive chemical transport problem. In this study, the research team used empirical measurements to understand the rate at which carbonate minerals can form in the basalt, permanently storing the CO2.
Next steps: The research team is currently performing more complex calculations to obtain more detailed results. Additional work is needed to better understand the kinetics of these mineralization reactions as a function of temperature, CO2 pressure, basalt composition, and especially the dispersion of CO2 within and around basalts on a large scale.
Acknowledgments: The research team included Pete McGrail, Todd Schaef, Yi-Ju Chien, James Dooley, Casie Davidson, all Pacific Northwest National Laboratory; and Anita Ho, Flathead Valley Community College in Kalispell, Montana.
This research was supported by Laboratory Directed Research and Development funding and by the U.S. Department of Energy, Office of Fossil Energy.
References: McGrail BP, HT Schaef, AM Ho, Y Chien, JJ Dooley, and CL Davidson. 2006. "Potential for Carbon Dioxide Sequestration in Flood Basalts." Journal of Geophysical Research. Solid Earth 111(B12) Art. No. B12201, doi:10.1029/2005JB004169.


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Hubble's Advanced Camera for Surveys, or ACS, is responsible for many of Hubble's most impressive images of deep space. With its wide field of view, sharp image quality and enhanced sensitivity, the camera doubled Hubble's field of view and expanded its capabilities significantly when it was installed in March 2002.
ACS sees in wavelengths from the far ultraviolet to visible light, making it capable of studying some of the earliest activity in the universe.
ACS contains a trio of cameras: the wide field camera, the high-resolution camera, and the solar blind camera. In 2007, an electrical short shut down all but the solar blind camera. Astronauts repaired ACS during Servicing Mission 4 in 2009, and only the high-resolution camera could not be returned to life.
Each camera performs a specific function. ACS's wide field camera conducts broad surveys of the universe. Astronomers use it to study the nature and distribution of galaxies, which reveal clues about how our universe evolved.
The solar blind camera blocks visible light to enhance ultraviolet sensitivity, focusing on hot stars or planets radiating ultraviolet wavelengths.
The high-resolution camera took detailed pictures of the inner regions of galaxies. It searched neighboring stars for planets and planets-to-be, and took close-up images of the planets in our own solar system. The high resolution of one of Hubble's newest instruments, Wide Field Camera 3, will be able to make up for some of the loss of this particular camera.
Making Room


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drchimrichalds necesitaba un nuevo diseño de logotipo y lanzó un concurso de diseño en 99designs.
Un ganador ha sido elegido entre 145 diseños de 30 diseñadores freelance.
hillside church
we are a new church plant in the seattle area. we are a church who aim to be fun, honest & real. we don't like "churchy" stuff - doves, crosses, etc - we want to be church for those tired of traditional church. we love people. art. music. the concept of light. light on a hill, but no hills in logo. we love the idea of a light bulb bc we are thinkers, new ideas, etc. we love the concept of story & movement - moving people into life change...not judging, but loving people to better choices. transformation. growth. organic. i should note we are all about fun, out-of-the-box ideas, & changing people's minds about what the church should do/be. we want to be the church & love our community & its needs. we want to be "that fun church that loves well" - we are pretty laid back people, but want a professional contemporary logo that is symbolic of who we are. we want our people to be about these 4 concepts:
ask. care. move. share. asking questions, care about others, move yourself/do something with purpose, share your life with others.
we love art. every creative medium under the sun (photo, oils, paints). we love jesus. we are all about relationship, not rules. we love God & all He has done for us. we don't want to be about rules/judgment. God made all kinds of folks & we want to love them & hear their story & introduce them to a creative & loving God. do faith, do love, do life.
all ages, styles, sizes, marital (or not) status.
our community is interesting. ethnically diverse, but also some "back woods" types. we have commuters to seattle who are contemporary, tech-savvy, and forward thinkers - mixed with people who have lived here their wholes lives either on farms, or shipyards, or family business and have a much simpler approach to life - mixed with people who have transplanted here (refugees) and don't know any or much english and are trying to do right by their family. we want to love them all the best we possibly can. we will be introducing ourselves to the area on easter (only 6 weeks away now) and need to saturate the community with our logo, upcoming events, and first services.
we are for singles, step-families, traditional families, non-traditional families, teens, college age, and empty-nesters. makes it a little more difficult to target an audience so broad, hence our coming to you with suggestions and ideas :)
~fresh. clean. professional. contemporary. creative. alive!
~fun, creative, faith, hope, love, transformation, authentic, are themes we live/work within
~like the concept of light, but not necessarily married to it. hate "rays" of sun, but like the concept of "light on the hill" - without an obvious hill - like idea of light bulb, but not married to it
~our name comes from a book in the Bible, Matthew 5, the sermon on the mount (hill), where the root of our faith is based from, where Jesus turns traditional church thought of the day, upside down - revolutionary for its time
~fun or bold colors that are alive and easily read on a sign
~a logo that's "doing something" or is "alive" or has movement
~need logo to stand alone (in black and white) or be able to pop off a page when color is available to use
~we like "hillside church" in lower case - have been using houschka rounded font and really like it (found on fontshop.com)
~our website might help with design concepts (we like clean lines, contemporary feel, but love creative and simple themes) thehillsidechuch.com
~attached are a few color/ideas but don't let that stifle your creative juices...we want your best stuff...let it flow, people! - don't even look at the attached stuff at first, maybe...don't want that to get in the way of a great idea!
~we are definitely NOT afraid of creativity...let loose & let's see what happens!
Descubre cómo funciona un concurso de diseño u obtén más información sobre nuestros servicios de diseño de logo.


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Drake Releases Track Listing for 'Take Care' Album
This is no trick, just a nice treat. R&B superstar Drake has unveiled the track listing for his forthcoming album 'Take Care.' The collection features 17 songs (19 if you cop the deluxe version) and some impressive guest features.
Unlike his debut LP 'Thank Me Later,' Drizzy's second album boasts a slew of big-name artists including Rick Ross, The Weeknd and Nicki Minaj. According to reports, Stevie Wonder, TLC, Florence + the Machine and T-Pain also make cameos on the collection.
Elsewhere, OutKast's André 3000 is a surprise guest feature on the Lil Wayne-assisted ballad 'The Real Her,' which recently leaked online. Since Drake appeared on Rihanna's hit song 'What's My Name, the R&B songbird returned the favor by appearing on the title track.
Judging by the track listing, this is going to be one helluva album. Drake's 'Take Care' will arrive in stores on Nov. 15.
'Take Care' Track Listing:
1. 'Over My Dead Body'
2. 'Shot for Me'
3. 'Headlines'
4. 'Crew Love' Feat. The Weeknd
5. 'Take Care' Feat. Rihanna
6. 'Marvin's Room'
7. 'Under Ground Kings'
8. 'We'll Be fine'
9. 'Make Me Proud' Feat. Nicki Minaj
10. 'Lord Knows' Feat. Rick Ross
11. 'Cameras'
12. 'Doing It Wrong'
13. 'The Real Her' Feat. André 3000 & Lil Wayne
14. 'Look What You've Done'
15. 'HYFR' Feat. Lil Wayne
16. 'Practice'
17. 'The Ride'
18. 'Hate Sleeping Alone'
19. 'Untitled' Feat. Lil Wayne