<story><title>My Evaluation of SvelteKit for Full-Stack Web App Development</title><url>https://cprimozic.net/blog/trying-out-sveltekit/</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>capableweb</author><text>Gatekeeping what should be called &amp;quot;full stack&amp;quot; based on your own requirements seems futile at best. Believe it or not, there are businesses built without using those things, even though you&amp;#x27;ve never come across that in your life.&lt;p&gt;Besides that, I think the things you&amp;#x27;re looking for are listed here: &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;sveltesociety.dev&amp;#x2F;components&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;sveltesociety.dev&amp;#x2F;components&amp;#x2F;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;Never used Svelte&amp;#x2F;SvelteKit myself, but seems the framework takes a &amp;quot;some batteries included, others available&amp;quot; approach to the whole thing, which is one way to about it as well.</text></item><item><author>midrus</author><text>I&amp;#x27;m really surprised at how easy anything is considered &amp;quot;full stack&amp;quot;. Where is the ORM&amp;#x2F;data access library? The validation framework? The background jobs? The caching system? The translations&amp;#x2F;i18n system? And the other 1000 things you do need for a full stack real life application? I definitely do have those things in Laravel, Django and rails. Next.js, nuxt.js, sveltekit etc are far, far from full stack. They can certainly run js in the backend, but that&amp;#x27;s not full stack, you still need 10s of other packages.</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>midrus</author><text>Yes, precisely because I&amp;#x27;ve been involved in maintaining codebases built without real full stack frameworks is why I say what I said.&lt;p&gt;The problem we have in this industry, is that somebody reads these blog posts, and the next day at work they ditch the &amp;quot;legacy rails&amp;quot; and starts rewriting the monolith in sveltekit&amp;#x2F;nextjs&amp;#x2F;whatever because that&amp;#x27;s what he&amp;#x2F;she has been told is the modern way to do full stack.&lt;p&gt;No need to say those engineers will quit 1 year later after they realize the mess they&amp;#x27;ve created with their lightweight and simple modern framework.&lt;p&gt;I&amp;#x27;ve seen this too many times already.&lt;p&gt;It is not about gatekeeping. It is about engineers being humble and assume it is very likely that their code is very unlikely to be better tested, documented, cohesive and maintained than what you&amp;#x27;re given in the real full stack frameworks.&lt;p&gt;Of course you can build anything even in assembler if you want. The question is if that&amp;#x27;s the most useful thing to do with your company&amp;#x27;s money.</text></comment>
<story><title>My Evaluation of SvelteKit for Full-Stack Web App Development</title><url>https://cprimozic.net/blog/trying-out-sveltekit/</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>capableweb</author><text>Gatekeeping what should be called &amp;quot;full stack&amp;quot; based on your own requirements seems futile at best. Believe it or not, there are businesses built without using those things, even though you&amp;#x27;ve never come across that in your life.&lt;p&gt;Besides that, I think the things you&amp;#x27;re looking for are listed here: &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;sveltesociety.dev&amp;#x2F;components&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;sveltesociety.dev&amp;#x2F;components&amp;#x2F;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;Never used Svelte&amp;#x2F;SvelteKit myself, but seems the framework takes a &amp;quot;some batteries included, others available&amp;quot; approach to the whole thing, which is one way to about it as well.</text></item><item><author>midrus</author><text>I&amp;#x27;m really surprised at how easy anything is considered &amp;quot;full stack&amp;quot;. Where is the ORM&amp;#x2F;data access library? The validation framework? The background jobs? The caching system? The translations&amp;#x2F;i18n system? And the other 1000 things you do need for a full stack real life application? I definitely do have those things in Laravel, Django and rails. Next.js, nuxt.js, sveltekit etc are far, far from full stack. They can certainly run js in the backend, but that&amp;#x27;s not full stack, you still need 10s of other packages.</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>adamors</author><text>Some gatekeeping is necessary because soon JS frameworks will have redefined everything making it impossible to converse.</text></comment>