<story><title>Pre-exposure to mRNA-LNP inhibits adaptive immune responses in mice</title><url>https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36054264/</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>mabbo</author><text>But the thing is we ran a massive experiment on this called &amp;quot;The covid-19 pandemic&amp;quot;.&lt;p&gt;What we saw was no serious increase in mortality for the immunized, and a significant increase in mortality for the non-immunized.&lt;p&gt;Seems like the data from that experiment should be taken into consideration when deciding if the tradeoff is worthwhile, right?</text></item><item><author>lazyier</author><text>I donno.  Seems like white blood cells are kinda important.&lt;p&gt;We have a huge number of interactions with bacteria and viruses and all sorts of microorganisms. Hundreds? Thousands times a day?  Scratches in the kitchen while preparing food, for example, floods our body with stuff that white blood cells are required to deal with.&lt;p&gt;Giving up some of the ability to deal with those for a small reduction in the symptoms associated with a specific disease doesn&amp;#x27;t seem like a useful trade off.</text></item><item><author>mabbo</author><text>&amp;gt;  On the other hand, we report that after pre-exposure to mRNA-LNPs, the resistance of mice to heterologous infections with influenza virus increased while resistance to Candida albicans decreased.&lt;p&gt;It sounds to me as though the tradeoff being made here is: a slightly decreased immune response generally, but a better immune response to the thing you&amp;#x27;ve been immunized against. That seems to be a reasonable tradeoff if there&amp;#x27;s something really bad going around.&lt;p&gt;But as they say in the paper summary: more research is needed.&lt;p&gt;Also: this is purely in mice. They have zero data on whether this is true for humans.</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>treeman79</author><text>Isn’t “unknown cause of death” skyrocketing?&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;youtu.be&amp;#x2F;F74iqEJnb14&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;youtu.be&amp;#x2F;F74iqEJnb14&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;thehill.com&amp;#x2F;changing-america&amp;#x2F;well-being&amp;#x2F;longevity&amp;#x2F;588738-huge-huge-numbers-death-rates-up-40-percent-over-pre&amp;#x2F;amp&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;thehill.com&amp;#x2F;changing-america&amp;#x2F;well-being&amp;#x2F;longevity&amp;#x2F;58...&lt;/a&gt;</text></comment>
<story><title>Pre-exposure to mRNA-LNP inhibits adaptive immune responses in mice</title><url>https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36054264/</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>mabbo</author><text>But the thing is we ran a massive experiment on this called &amp;quot;The covid-19 pandemic&amp;quot;.&lt;p&gt;What we saw was no serious increase in mortality for the immunized, and a significant increase in mortality for the non-immunized.&lt;p&gt;Seems like the data from that experiment should be taken into consideration when deciding if the tradeoff is worthwhile, right?</text></item><item><author>lazyier</author><text>I donno.  Seems like white blood cells are kinda important.&lt;p&gt;We have a huge number of interactions with bacteria and viruses and all sorts of microorganisms. Hundreds? Thousands times a day?  Scratches in the kitchen while preparing food, for example, floods our body with stuff that white blood cells are required to deal with.&lt;p&gt;Giving up some of the ability to deal with those for a small reduction in the symptoms associated with a specific disease doesn&amp;#x27;t seem like a useful trade off.</text></item><item><author>mabbo</author><text>&amp;gt;  On the other hand, we report that after pre-exposure to mRNA-LNPs, the resistance of mice to heterologous infections with influenza virus increased while resistance to Candida albicans decreased.&lt;p&gt;It sounds to me as though the tradeoff being made here is: a slightly decreased immune response generally, but a better immune response to the thing you&amp;#x27;ve been immunized against. That seems to be a reasonable tradeoff if there&amp;#x27;s something really bad going around.&lt;p&gt;But as they say in the paper summary: more research is needed.&lt;p&gt;Also: this is purely in mice. They have zero data on whether this is true for humans.</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>origin_path</author><text>Two problems:&lt;p&gt;1. That wasn&amp;#x27;t a controlled experiment. Observational data &amp;lt; RCTs.&lt;p&gt;2. You are mixing up mortality and mortality attributed to COVID. It&amp;#x27;s a common error. For overall mortality the picture is far less clear. For example in the Pfizer trials there were more deaths overall in the vaccinated arm than the unvaccinated arm i.e. RCT evidence = no mortality benefit.&lt;p&gt;Also, we now have excess deaths above the expected baseline for long periods in 2022, which is unprecedented. Governments are highly reluctant to split these deaths out by vaccine status, but the increase seems mostly attributed to heart and blood clotting related deaths. So the data from the &amp;quot;experiment&amp;quot; is not obviously positive.</text></comment>