<story><title>C++23: Removing garbage collection support</title><url>https://www.sandordargo.com/blog/2023/11/01/cpp23-garbage-collection</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>EmilyHughes</author><text>How about you stop caring that much about proving others right.</text></item><item><author>kazinator</author><text>You have to arm yourself with facts.&lt;p&gt;- know exactly what you mean by &amp;quot;C++ has support for garbage collection&amp;quot;&lt;p&gt;- have the chapter-and-verse citations from ISO C++ ready if someone disagrees&lt;p&gt;- understand the limitations of what is required in the document, and be the first to point that out&lt;p&gt;- and have a good idea of some of the landscape in terms of what of those requirements is implemented in the wild</text></item><item><author>moralestapia</author><text>I was once made fun of (in a kind of humiliating way, now that I recall) by a bunch of HPC scientists in a room at KAUST for saying that C++ had support for GC.&lt;p&gt;They were like &lt;i&gt;&amp;quot;if you knew the least bit a about C++, you&amp;#x27;d knew it doesn&amp;#x27;t have a GC&amp;quot;&lt;/i&gt;.&lt;p&gt;I was like, &amp;quot;yeah cool, but C++ &lt;i&gt;does have&lt;/i&gt; some GC functionality&amp;quot;, but they just shut me down. My background is Biology so there were a few remarks about how &amp;quot;a biologist just doesn&amp;#x27;t know these things, lol&amp;quot;.&lt;p&gt;This was around 2019, btw. And sure, I&amp;#x27;m a biologist, but I also happen to have spent 8-10 hours&amp;#x2F;week for the past 20 years coding because I just really like it; so, there&amp;#x27;s my 10k hours, ¯\_(ツ)_&amp;#x2F;¯.</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>coolsunglasses</author><text>tbqh kazinator is manifesting the bare minimum of Caring to be trusted with C++ code as a developer. If you aren&amp;#x27;t prepared to get into bizarre pseudo-legal arguments with collaborators about language specifications you are going to be happier somewhere else in the software industry.&lt;p&gt;I do not say this as someone who believes this represents healthy behavior or that wants to write C++ for a living. They&amp;#x27;ve been like this since #C on EFNet and FreeNode were a thing 30+&amp;#x2F;25+ years ago. My guess is they got the behavior from Usenet or something but I didn&amp;#x27;t hang out there so I don&amp;#x27;t know first-hand.</text></comment>
<story><title>C++23: Removing garbage collection support</title><url>https://www.sandordargo.com/blog/2023/11/01/cpp23-garbage-collection</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>EmilyHughes</author><text>How about you stop caring that much about proving others right.</text></item><item><author>kazinator</author><text>You have to arm yourself with facts.&lt;p&gt;- know exactly what you mean by &amp;quot;C++ has support for garbage collection&amp;quot;&lt;p&gt;- have the chapter-and-verse citations from ISO C++ ready if someone disagrees&lt;p&gt;- understand the limitations of what is required in the document, and be the first to point that out&lt;p&gt;- and have a good idea of some of the landscape in terms of what of those requirements is implemented in the wild</text></item><item><author>moralestapia</author><text>I was once made fun of (in a kind of humiliating way, now that I recall) by a bunch of HPC scientists in a room at KAUST for saying that C++ had support for GC.&lt;p&gt;They were like &lt;i&gt;&amp;quot;if you knew the least bit a about C++, you&amp;#x27;d knew it doesn&amp;#x27;t have a GC&amp;quot;&lt;/i&gt;.&lt;p&gt;I was like, &amp;quot;yeah cool, but C++ &lt;i&gt;does have&lt;/i&gt; some GC functionality&amp;quot;, but they just shut me down. My background is Biology so there were a few remarks about how &amp;quot;a biologist just doesn&amp;#x27;t know these things, lol&amp;quot;.&lt;p&gt;This was around 2019, btw. And sure, I&amp;#x27;m a biologist, but I also happen to have spent 8-10 hours&amp;#x2F;week for the past 20 years coding because I just really like it; so, there&amp;#x27;s my 10k hours, ¯\_(ツ)_&amp;#x2F;¯.</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>kazinator</author><text>You mean proving others wrong?&lt;p&gt;In this situation, those others were not exactly wrong. It was about OP proving also not being wrong.&lt;p&gt;If people in your organization think you said something stupid, that could be bad for your opportunities there.&lt;p&gt;If you say something which is correct, but the correctness depends on some unusual conditions that are not well known, or special interpretations of common concepts, or some context that is not shared with whoever you&amp;#x27;re talking to, you have to either not mention that, or spell out those details.&lt;p&gt;If you posit that pigs do fly, don&amp;#x27;t forget the detail that it&amp;#x27;s when they are shot out of a cannon.</text></comment>