<story><title>Framework laptop water damage repair attempt using partial schematic [video]</title><url>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijRUsxdaLK4</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>TheSpiceIsLife</author><text>One might even imagine someone would write something like this in an effort to reinforce the parents the point.&lt;p&gt;The strongest interpretation of  &lt;i&gt;&amp;quot;we&amp;#x27;d love to release the full schematics&amp;quot;&lt;/i&gt; the subtext: but we can&amp;#x27;t &amp;#x2F; don&amp;#x27;t want to due to &amp;quot;reasons*, none of which are likely to satisfy everyone, so we&amp;#x27;ll try to avoid that discussion as it would help distract us all rather than getting on with our goals.</text></item><item><author>cmeacham98</author><text>The problem I have is that if these requests are unrealistic, they should just say that. As far as I can tell, what they&amp;#x27;re currently doing requires more effort to vet repair shops and create an NDA than if they just dumped the schematics online.&lt;p&gt;Now, maybe there&amp;#x27;s a great reason for this. Maybe they&amp;#x27;re under NDA and can&amp;#x27;t reveal part of the schematics. Maybe releasing these schematics would make it super easy for a competitor to completely steal everything. Maybe they are going to release the full schematics and we&amp;#x27;re waiting on their engineering team and legal team to review them.&lt;p&gt;The problem here is that Framework hasn&amp;#x27;t communicated any of this. Every time they&amp;#x27;re asked they don&amp;#x27;t seem to give any reason and just dodge around with &amp;quot;we&amp;#x27;d love to release the full schematics&amp;quot;. Well, why haven&amp;#x27;t you then? Please tell us.</text></item><item><author>npunt</author><text>This is the challenge of trying to do good - no matter how much better you are than the default, for some subset of users you will never be good enough, and they’ll complain just as loudly about you as they do the default (far worse) option.&lt;p&gt;Unrealistic purity tests ruin all sorts of attempts to make the world  a better place. We should celebrate attempts to change the status quo.</text></item><item><author>somethoughts</author><text>On one hand - it makes sense to push for more visibility - to test the depths of their commitment to right-to-repair.&lt;p&gt;On the other hand - being overly critical about a new entrant that is attempting to address the right-to-repair market for not getting everything perfect from the get go might send the wrong signals about the right-to-repair market to the rest of the industry.&lt;p&gt;It seems like a delicate balance might be wise.  Having module level repairability for LCD panels, connectors, drivers, memory is a pretty big step relative to the other OEMs.&lt;p&gt;Perhaps the best analogy would be Raspberry Pi schematics which are also reduced [1] and IMHO, the RPi has generally been a plus for the open source hardware&amp;#x2F;software community.  Similarly I could definitely see Intel having some trade secrets as you get closer the CPU.&lt;p&gt;[1] &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;datasheets.raspberrypi.com&amp;#x2F;rpi4&amp;#x2F;raspberry-pi-4-reduced-schematics.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;datasheets.raspberrypi.com&amp;#x2F;rpi4&amp;#x2F;raspberry-pi-4-reduc...&lt;/a&gt;</text></item><item><author>nrp</author><text>We make full schematics and board views available to repair shops under a confidentiality agreement: &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;knowledgebase.frame.work&amp;#x2F;en_us&amp;#x2F;availability-of-schematics-and-boardviews-BJMZ6EAu&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;knowledgebase.frame.work&amp;#x2F;en_us&amp;#x2F;availability-of-schem...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;In this case, we didn&amp;#x27;t see a request for it come in.&lt;p&gt;Publicly with no agreement required, we were able to share a sub-set of the schematic focused on the internal and external connectors: &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;github.com&amp;#x2F;FrameworkComputer&amp;#x2F;Mainboard&amp;#x2F;blob&amp;#x2F;main&amp;#x2F;Electrical&amp;#x2F;Mainboard_Interfaces_Schematic.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;github.com&amp;#x2F;FrameworkComputer&amp;#x2F;Mainboard&amp;#x2F;blob&amp;#x2F;main&amp;#x2F;Ele...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;Louis has more context on the latter in an earlier video: &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.youtube.com&amp;#x2F;watch?v=8cJj8PUY0DU&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.youtube.com&amp;#x2F;watch?v=8cJj8PUY0DU&lt;/a&gt;</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>tyrfing</author><text>The strongest and most likely interpretation is that they simply don&amp;#x27;t own the IP, and it&amp;#x27;s based on a licensed reference design. It makes zero sense for a startup like this to have done all of it from scratch - just copy everything possible and innovate the actually interesting parts. If they don&amp;#x27;t own the design, they can&amp;#x27;t say that due to NDAs, and the best they can do is a maximally broad interpretation of &amp;quot;repair shop&amp;quot;.</text></comment>
<story><title>Framework laptop water damage repair attempt using partial schematic [video]</title><url>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijRUsxdaLK4</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>TheSpiceIsLife</author><text>One might even imagine someone would write something like this in an effort to reinforce the parents the point.&lt;p&gt;The strongest interpretation of  &lt;i&gt;&amp;quot;we&amp;#x27;d love to release the full schematics&amp;quot;&lt;/i&gt; the subtext: but we can&amp;#x27;t &amp;#x2F; don&amp;#x27;t want to due to &amp;quot;reasons*, none of which are likely to satisfy everyone, so we&amp;#x27;ll try to avoid that discussion as it would help distract us all rather than getting on with our goals.</text></item><item><author>cmeacham98</author><text>The problem I have is that if these requests are unrealistic, they should just say that. As far as I can tell, what they&amp;#x27;re currently doing requires more effort to vet repair shops and create an NDA than if they just dumped the schematics online.&lt;p&gt;Now, maybe there&amp;#x27;s a great reason for this. Maybe they&amp;#x27;re under NDA and can&amp;#x27;t reveal part of the schematics. Maybe releasing these schematics would make it super easy for a competitor to completely steal everything. Maybe they are going to release the full schematics and we&amp;#x27;re waiting on their engineering team and legal team to review them.&lt;p&gt;The problem here is that Framework hasn&amp;#x27;t communicated any of this. Every time they&amp;#x27;re asked they don&amp;#x27;t seem to give any reason and just dodge around with &amp;quot;we&amp;#x27;d love to release the full schematics&amp;quot;. Well, why haven&amp;#x27;t you then? Please tell us.</text></item><item><author>npunt</author><text>This is the challenge of trying to do good - no matter how much better you are than the default, for some subset of users you will never be good enough, and they’ll complain just as loudly about you as they do the default (far worse) option.&lt;p&gt;Unrealistic purity tests ruin all sorts of attempts to make the world  a better place. We should celebrate attempts to change the status quo.</text></item><item><author>somethoughts</author><text>On one hand - it makes sense to push for more visibility - to test the depths of their commitment to right-to-repair.&lt;p&gt;On the other hand - being overly critical about a new entrant that is attempting to address the right-to-repair market for not getting everything perfect from the get go might send the wrong signals about the right-to-repair market to the rest of the industry.&lt;p&gt;It seems like a delicate balance might be wise.  Having module level repairability for LCD panels, connectors, drivers, memory is a pretty big step relative to the other OEMs.&lt;p&gt;Perhaps the best analogy would be Raspberry Pi schematics which are also reduced [1] and IMHO, the RPi has generally been a plus for the open source hardware&amp;#x2F;software community.  Similarly I could definitely see Intel having some trade secrets as you get closer the CPU.&lt;p&gt;[1] &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;datasheets.raspberrypi.com&amp;#x2F;rpi4&amp;#x2F;raspberry-pi-4-reduced-schematics.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;datasheets.raspberrypi.com&amp;#x2F;rpi4&amp;#x2F;raspberry-pi-4-reduc...&lt;/a&gt;</text></item><item><author>nrp</author><text>We make full schematics and board views available to repair shops under a confidentiality agreement: &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;knowledgebase.frame.work&amp;#x2F;en_us&amp;#x2F;availability-of-schematics-and-boardviews-BJMZ6EAu&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;knowledgebase.frame.work&amp;#x2F;en_us&amp;#x2F;availability-of-schem...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;In this case, we didn&amp;#x27;t see a request for it come in.&lt;p&gt;Publicly with no agreement required, we were able to share a sub-set of the schematic focused on the internal and external connectors: &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;github.com&amp;#x2F;FrameworkComputer&amp;#x2F;Mainboard&amp;#x2F;blob&amp;#x2F;main&amp;#x2F;Electrical&amp;#x2F;Mainboard_Interfaces_Schematic.pdf&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;github.com&amp;#x2F;FrameworkComputer&amp;#x2F;Mainboard&amp;#x2F;blob&amp;#x2F;main&amp;#x2F;Ele...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;Louis has more context on the latter in an earlier video: &lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.youtube.com&amp;#x2F;watch?v=8cJj8PUY0DU&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.youtube.com&amp;#x2F;watch?v=8cJj8PUY0DU&lt;/a&gt;</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>cmeacham98</author><text>It&amp;#x27;s not just about the reason, but other details too. Does &amp;quot;we&amp;#x27;d love to release them&amp;quot; mean &amp;quot;we just mean more time&amp;quot;, &amp;quot;there&amp;#x27;s a 50&amp;#x2F;50 chance we&amp;#x27;ll be able to release them&amp;quot;, or &amp;quot;we&amp;#x27;d love to but it&amp;#x27;s a long shot&amp;quot;. If they are going to come out, will it be in weeks, months, or years?</text></comment>