<story><title>Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany</title><url>http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/28/technology/whatsapp-facebook-germany.html</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>corndoge</author><text>This is false. Market dominance does not transform a proprietary product into a basic utility. What I mean is that simply because a proprietary product has a large mass of users does not mean the users have the right to demand that it be regulated like a public utility.</text></item><item><author>logn</author><text>&amp;gt; Using the messaging service is a voluntary decision&lt;p&gt;Once a critical mass uses a messaging service, it&amp;#x27;s not a completely voluntary decision, especially when there is no open standard with interoperable competing apps.</text></item><item><author>0xmohit</author><text>Quoting from the link:&lt;p&gt;&lt;pre&gt;&lt;code&gt;  Facebook said on Tuesday, after the order had been issued, that
  it had complied with Europe’s privacy rules and that it was
  willing to work with the German regulator to address its
  concerns.
&lt;/code&gt;&lt;/pre&gt;
Two Indian students challenged Facebook on WhatsApp privacy policy changes [0].  The following is what WhatsApp counsel told [1]:&lt;p&gt;&lt;pre&gt;&lt;code&gt;  Using the messaging service is a voluntary decision, we have
  not forced anybody to use it. Users have an option of opting
  out of it.
&lt;/code&gt;&lt;/pre&gt;
Disclaimer: I don&amp;#x27;t have an account on either Facebook or WhatsApp.&lt;p&gt;[0] &lt;a href=&quot;http:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.bloomberg.com&amp;#x2F;news&amp;#x2F;articles&amp;#x2F;2016-09-20&amp;#x2F;facebook-faces-indian-court-challenge-on-whatsapp-privacy-policy&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.bloomberg.com&amp;#x2F;news&amp;#x2F;articles&amp;#x2F;2016-09-20&amp;#x2F;facebook-f...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;[1] &lt;a href=&quot;http:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;mashable.com&amp;#x2F;2016&amp;#x2F;09&amp;#x2F;23&amp;#x2F;india-delhi-high-court-whatsapp-facebook&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;mashable.com&amp;#x2F;2016&amp;#x2F;09&amp;#x2F;23&amp;#x2F;india-delhi-high-court-whatsa...&lt;/a&gt;</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>anexprogrammer</author><text>I imagine the electric companies made similar arguments at the start of the 20th century.&lt;p&gt;&amp;gt; Market dominance does not transform a proprietary product into a basic utility&lt;p&gt;Agreed. Isn&amp;#x27;t it more that it becomes so ubiquitous and expected that it starts to be considered a basic utility by the public? In the case of social and IM it&amp;#x27;s the network effect that matters - where are family and friends.&lt;p&gt;Once a certain tipping point was reached you&amp;#x27;d be hard pushed to find many willing to live without mains water or electric.  These days you&amp;#x27;d be hard pushed to find many willing to live without internet, social networking, and IM chat. They&amp;#x27;re becoming utilities, and quotes like from their counsel &amp;quot;well just don&amp;#x27;t use it, it&amp;#x27;s optional&amp;quot; ring, for the majority of the public, increasingly hollow.&lt;p&gt;Just as our definition of essentials, poverty, minimum income and inflation (in the UK at least) have all been adjusted to reflect the internet age and provide for internet connections, mobile phones etc, our defnition of utilities should too.</text></comment>
<story><title>Facebook Ordered to Stop Collecting Data on WhatsApp Users in Germany</title><url>http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/28/technology/whatsapp-facebook-germany.html</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>corndoge</author><text>This is false. Market dominance does not transform a proprietary product into a basic utility. What I mean is that simply because a proprietary product has a large mass of users does not mean the users have the right to demand that it be regulated like a public utility.</text></item><item><author>logn</author><text>&amp;gt; Using the messaging service is a voluntary decision&lt;p&gt;Once a critical mass uses a messaging service, it&amp;#x27;s not a completely voluntary decision, especially when there is no open standard with interoperable competing apps.</text></item><item><author>0xmohit</author><text>Quoting from the link:&lt;p&gt;&lt;pre&gt;&lt;code&gt;  Facebook said on Tuesday, after the order had been issued, that
  it had complied with Europe’s privacy rules and that it was
  willing to work with the German regulator to address its
  concerns.
&lt;/code&gt;&lt;/pre&gt;
Two Indian students challenged Facebook on WhatsApp privacy policy changes [0].  The following is what WhatsApp counsel told [1]:&lt;p&gt;&lt;pre&gt;&lt;code&gt;  Using the messaging service is a voluntary decision, we have
  not forced anybody to use it. Users have an option of opting
  out of it.
&lt;/code&gt;&lt;/pre&gt;
Disclaimer: I don&amp;#x27;t have an account on either Facebook or WhatsApp.&lt;p&gt;[0] &lt;a href=&quot;http:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.bloomberg.com&amp;#x2F;news&amp;#x2F;articles&amp;#x2F;2016-09-20&amp;#x2F;facebook-faces-indian-court-challenge-on-whatsapp-privacy-policy&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.bloomberg.com&amp;#x2F;news&amp;#x2F;articles&amp;#x2F;2016-09-20&amp;#x2F;facebook-f...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;[1] &lt;a href=&quot;http:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;mashable.com&amp;#x2F;2016&amp;#x2F;09&amp;#x2F;23&amp;#x2F;india-delhi-high-court-whatsapp-facebook&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;mashable.com&amp;#x2F;2016&amp;#x2F;09&amp;#x2F;23&amp;#x2F;india-delhi-high-court-whatsa...&lt;/a&gt;</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>jimmytidey</author><text>Natural monopolies are very often regulated because of the negative side effects of not doing so.&lt;p&gt;Which is to say, market dominance has transformed products into utilities in the past.&lt;p&gt;You can argue that should not be the case, but, historically, it very much has been.&lt;p&gt;There&amp;#x27;s surely a balance to be struck between incentivising firms to innovate by allowing them to earn profits when they develop a good product and allowing a firms to lock-in economic rents forever.&lt;p&gt;How you strike that balance is a value judgement about the kind of society you want to live in.</text></comment>