<story><title>AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking</title><url>https://www.caixinglobal.com/2018-11-22/ai-mistakes-bus-side-ad-for-famous-ceo-charges-her-with-jaywalkingdo-101350772.html?cxg=web&amp;Sfrom=twitter</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>nitrogen</author><text>Scaling fines &lt;i&gt;up&lt;/i&gt; to higher incomes for things that don&amp;#x27;t really matter (jaywalking, minor traffic violations) seems antithetical to the individualistic core of American culture.  We typically try to equalize society by raising the floor for the many, rather than lowering the ceiling for the few.</text></item><item><author>nabla9</author><text>Fines should be some percentage of income.&lt;p&gt;Here in Finland the record speeding ticked is over 100,000 euros.&lt;p&gt;One guy in Switzerland received $1 million speeding ticket for driving his Mercedes SLS AMG over 280 km&amp;#x2F;h. That&amp;#x27;s how hit should be.</text></item><item><author>burfog</author><text>&lt;i&gt;NOTE: not specifically about jaywalking, but about fines&amp;#x2F;fees being disproportionate punishment in general&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;Jail disproportionately punishes those who are working. (they lose their income source, then they can&amp;#x27;t pay bills, then their house gets foreclosed, etc.)&lt;p&gt;Ditching punishment entirely means free-for-all anarchy until somebody takes that opportunity to impose a government with punishments.&lt;p&gt;What options are left? Torture? Execution? Ignoring the masochists and the suicidal, those don&amp;#x27;t disproportionately punish people.</text></item><item><author>goatsi</author><text>&amp;gt;I am lucky. I can pay that. It sucks but some people would be out food money if they suddenly had to pay $500 to drive again.&lt;p&gt;Absolutely, court fees and fines disproportionately punish those with low incomes. Increasing enforcement of low level violations by surveillance tech and&amp;#x2F;or AI is going to crush a lot of people if we don&amp;#x27;t change that fact.&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.npr.org&amp;#x2F;2014&amp;#x2F;05&amp;#x2F;19&amp;#x2F;312158516&amp;#x2F;increasing-court-fees-punish-the-poor&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.npr.org&amp;#x2F;2014&amp;#x2F;05&amp;#x2F;19&amp;#x2F;312158516&amp;#x2F;increasing-court-fe...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.citylab.com&amp;#x2F;equity&amp;#x2F;2017&amp;#x2F;09&amp;#x2F;municipal-courts-war-on-poor-people-explained&amp;#x2F;541395&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.citylab.com&amp;#x2F;equity&amp;#x2F;2017&amp;#x2F;09&amp;#x2F;municipal-courts-war-...&lt;/a&gt;</text></item><item><author>raleigh_user</author><text>Heres further proof the justice system is screwed. Yesterday I was stopped while driving for not having current tags. Registration was renewed but I didn&amp;#x27;t have the sticker yet. Cop looked at my paperwork said all good be back in 5.&lt;p&gt;Come to find out, I haven&amp;#x27;t had a valid license in 5 years.&lt;p&gt;There was a mistake in court 5 years ago when I paid a fine (speeding ticket). I have a receipt from court saying all settled&amp;#x2F;money received but court says they never got money.&lt;p&gt;So, after talking to a lawyer yesterday I will be paying another $250 for lawyer fees + court costs to get out of the mistake made by the court in another state 5 years ago.&lt;p&gt;I am lucky. I can pay that. It sucks but some people would be out food money if they suddenly had to pay $500 to drive again.&lt;p&gt;But, I did nothing wrong (except for speeding 6 years ago which I paid the fine and haven&amp;#x27;t had any issues since) and am stuck paying for the courts mistake.</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>retsibsi</author><text>&amp;gt; things that don&amp;#x27;t really matter&lt;p&gt;If they really don&amp;#x27;t matter, why forbid them at all?&lt;p&gt;For things that are worth forbidding, scaling is surely necessary to create a meaningful disincentive for the rich, without destroying the poor by setting very high flat fines.</text></comment>
<story><title>AI Mistakes Bus-Side Ad for Famous CEO, Charges Her With Jaywalking</title><url>https://www.caixinglobal.com/2018-11-22/ai-mistakes-bus-side-ad-for-famous-ceo-charges-her-with-jaywalkingdo-101350772.html?cxg=web&amp;Sfrom=twitter</url></story><parent_chain><item><author>nitrogen</author><text>Scaling fines &lt;i&gt;up&lt;/i&gt; to higher incomes for things that don&amp;#x27;t really matter (jaywalking, minor traffic violations) seems antithetical to the individualistic core of American culture.  We typically try to equalize society by raising the floor for the many, rather than lowering the ceiling for the few.</text></item><item><author>nabla9</author><text>Fines should be some percentage of income.&lt;p&gt;Here in Finland the record speeding ticked is over 100,000 euros.&lt;p&gt;One guy in Switzerland received $1 million speeding ticket for driving his Mercedes SLS AMG over 280 km&amp;#x2F;h. That&amp;#x27;s how hit should be.</text></item><item><author>burfog</author><text>&lt;i&gt;NOTE: not specifically about jaywalking, but about fines&amp;#x2F;fees being disproportionate punishment in general&lt;/i&gt;&lt;p&gt;Jail disproportionately punishes those who are working. (they lose their income source, then they can&amp;#x27;t pay bills, then their house gets foreclosed, etc.)&lt;p&gt;Ditching punishment entirely means free-for-all anarchy until somebody takes that opportunity to impose a government with punishments.&lt;p&gt;What options are left? Torture? Execution? Ignoring the masochists and the suicidal, those don&amp;#x27;t disproportionately punish people.</text></item><item><author>goatsi</author><text>&amp;gt;I am lucky. I can pay that. It sucks but some people would be out food money if they suddenly had to pay $500 to drive again.&lt;p&gt;Absolutely, court fees and fines disproportionately punish those with low incomes. Increasing enforcement of low level violations by surveillance tech and&amp;#x2F;or AI is going to crush a lot of people if we don&amp;#x27;t change that fact.&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.npr.org&amp;#x2F;2014&amp;#x2F;05&amp;#x2F;19&amp;#x2F;312158516&amp;#x2F;increasing-court-fees-punish-the-poor&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.npr.org&amp;#x2F;2014&amp;#x2F;05&amp;#x2F;19&amp;#x2F;312158516&amp;#x2F;increasing-court-fe...&lt;/a&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.citylab.com&amp;#x2F;equity&amp;#x2F;2017&amp;#x2F;09&amp;#x2F;municipal-courts-war-on-poor-people-explained&amp;#x2F;541395&amp;#x2F;&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;https:&amp;#x2F;&amp;#x2F;www.citylab.com&amp;#x2F;equity&amp;#x2F;2017&amp;#x2F;09&amp;#x2F;municipal-courts-war-...&lt;/a&gt;</text></item><item><author>raleigh_user</author><text>Heres further proof the justice system is screwed. Yesterday I was stopped while driving for not having current tags. Registration was renewed but I didn&amp;#x27;t have the sticker yet. Cop looked at my paperwork said all good be back in 5.&lt;p&gt;Come to find out, I haven&amp;#x27;t had a valid license in 5 years.&lt;p&gt;There was a mistake in court 5 years ago when I paid a fine (speeding ticket). I have a receipt from court saying all settled&amp;#x2F;money received but court says they never got money.&lt;p&gt;So, after talking to a lawyer yesterday I will be paying another $250 for lawyer fees + court costs to get out of the mistake made by the court in another state 5 years ago.&lt;p&gt;I am lucky. I can pay that. It sucks but some people would be out food money if they suddenly had to pay $500 to drive again.&lt;p&gt;But, I did nothing wrong (except for speeding 6 years ago which I paid the fine and haven&amp;#x27;t had any issues since) and am stuck paying for the courts mistake.</text></item></parent_chain><comment><author>CJefferson</author><text>Depends what you think the fines are for. If they are to discourage behaviour, it makes sense to me to try to make them equally discouraging to everyone, which requires scaling.</text></comment>