2007/08/15/#ubuntu-devel.txt

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=== Topic for #ubuntu-devel: Development of Ubuntu (not support, even with gutsy; not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper/edgy/feisty, #ubuntu+1 for gutsy support | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Tribe 4 released
=== Topic (#ubuntu-devel): set by pitti at Thu Aug  9 16:01:54 2007
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=== Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-devel.log
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-devel: Development of Ubuntu (not support, even with gutsy; not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper/edgy/feisty, #ubuntu+1 for gutsy support | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Tribe 4 released
=== Topic (#ubuntu-devel): set by pitti at Thu Aug  9 16:01:54 2007
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[05:40] <fabbione> morning
[05:40] <bderrly> evening
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[05:48] <calc> grr wake up hobbsee
[05:48] <calc> rather come back you were here 1hr ago
[05:48] <ajmitch> heh
[05:49] <calc> she has been marking bugs as duplicates that aren't actually due to a misunderstanding of the bug
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[05:49] <calc> hopefully she's the only one who has been doing it so that she has a list of them to fix quickly
[05:49] <calc> apparently marking anything that was broken due to new glib/gtk as a duplicate of the openoffice bug
[05:50] <calc> of course i didn't even know what the cause was until the past day or so
[05:50] <calc> so its not her fault
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[05:59] <TheMuso> calc: She does idle on here as LongPointyStick as well.
[06:03] <DShepherd> hehe.. nice nick
[06:05] <calc> TheMuso: oh ok
[06:05] <calc> LongPointyStick: hey sarah?
[06:05] <StevenK> Her other client is mainly for logging.
[06:07] <StevenK> calc: So, what is the cause?
[06:07] <calc> StevenK: oh ok
[06:07] <calc> StevenK: improper (or non-existent) initialization of glib/gdk/gtk before calling a function
[06:07] <calc> StevenK: in openoffice case there was a call to gdk_screen without initialization
[06:08] <StevenK> Neat.
[06:08] <StevenK> Are you fixing it with a patch, or is upstream?
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[06:10] <calc> StevenK: a guy at redhat has a fix, but i'm not sure if he considers it good enough for general use yet, i sent him an email letting him know it works for ubuntu (its not even really needed on fedora) and to see if he wants to commit it upstream
[06:10] <calc> i should know something in probably 12hr or so
[06:13] <thully> i'm curious if anyone here knows about getting in touch with Ubuntu developers.  I've had many issues (mostly laptop-related, but some having to do w/the general desktop) and I haven't been able to get good developer response...
[06:14] <calc> thully: i'll let you know a secret... you are in the right channel
[06:15] <thully> The thing is - I have filed bugs, and e-mailed devs who have commented on bugs, and I feel like I might as well send my info to /dev/null...
[06:16] <calc> thully: i'm sorry to hear that, people try to get to the reports as quickly as possible but sometimes things get dropped :(
[06:16] <calc> thully: what particular issue?
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[06:16] <thully> a few
[06:16] <calc> thully: some developers have many hundreds of bugs to take care of
[06:17] <calc> thully: for example anything involving openoffice is for me, so just ping me and i'll try to look at it
[06:18] <thully> The thing is - I've also been using Debian (I'm actually on Etch now), and I get their bug system fine
[06:18] <thully> You just find the maintainer/team, and they usually answer...
[06:18] <thully> calc: unfortunately none of my issues involve OpenOffice
[06:18] <calc> thully: ok :)
[06:20] <tonyyarusso> Is there a 6.06.2 in the works?  I just saw a debian-installer note in dapper-changes.
[06:20] <calc> tonyyarusso: yes eventually
[06:20] <calc> tonyyarusso: i'm not sure if there is a projected release date yet
[06:21] <tonyyarusso> That upload would seem to suggest it's soon, in my head at least.
[06:22] <thully> Most of my issues have to deal with laptop stuff - suspend to RAM, brightness controls, synaptics touchpad, ACPI C-states, and so on...
[06:22] <calc> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-6.06.2
[06:23] <calc> thully: ah ok you might ask in #ubuntu-kernel if you don't hear anything back, sounds like all of that is probably kernel related
[06:23] <thully> not necessarily synaptics, though - that's an X.org driver...
[06:24] <calc> thully: ah yea
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[06:26] <calc> tonyyarusso: apparently the existence of the release isn't public yet, or at least not on wiki.ubuntu.com yet
[06:27] <calc> tonyyarusso: but yea what you see in the upload is correct there will be one
[06:30] <tonyyarusso> calc: interesting
[06:32] <calc> and i think 8.04 will be the next LTS
[06:33] <thully> One thing that has me WAY confused is "triaging".  In Debian (and almost any other project) , you simply report the bug, give enough info, and people look at it.  What is the deal with the triage process?
[06:34] <bderrly> thully, have you ever been to the hospital emergency room? it is the same idea: a nurse will categorize the incoming patients in order of importance
[06:36] <thully> who does this in Ubuntu, anyway?  I've generally had an experience where if I report a bug, it just sits on "new" for months at a time, no matter what information I attach to it...
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[06:37] <johanbr> Often done by members of the ubuntu bug squad, I believe.
[06:41] <thully> is it possible to do this myself?  I've been reporting bugs in software for years, so I generally know what I'm doing...
[06:42] <RAOF> thully: You need to be in the ubuntu-qa team to have priority-changing privileges, but you can do all the rest.
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[06:43] <thully> sorry, my connection was just reset by that darned Peer :)
[06:51] <StevenK> RAOF: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/patchnotes/test-realm-patchnotes.html
[06:51] <StevenK> RAOF: Note the top item under General.
[06:52] <RAOF> StevenK: Oh, hell yes!
[06:52] <StevenK> RAOF: So, now you just need to wait for patch 2.2.0 to hit.
[06:53] <RAOF> Wooooooot!
=== RAOF runs around the room
[06:53] <StevenK> ... on fire
[06:54] <thully> OK - what I'm wondering is- how does a Bug go from "Confirmed" to "Triaged"?  I've gone through the triage steps and confirmed some of my bugs in the past, but they don't get marked "Triaged"...
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[07:01] <lifeless> thully: #ubuntu-bugs is the right channel for that question, the bug triage team hang out there
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[07:11] <LongPointyStick> greetings
[07:12] <ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
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[07:15] <Hobbsee> calc: ah, thanks.  i'd suspected the same myself.
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[07:35] <StevenK> Morning pitti
[07:35] <pitti> Good morning
[07:35] <ajmitch> morning pitti
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=== Hobbsee hugs pitti.  morning pitti!
=== pitti hugs Hobbsee and ajmitch back
[07:38] <Hobbsee> :)
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[07:39] <Hobbsee> pitti: do you want to answer a licencing question, or send it to [email protected]?
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[07:39] <pitti> Hobbsee: I'd prefer u-a@, I'm no licensing expert
[07:40] <pygi> pitti, available for a little review?
[07:40] <Hobbsee> pitti: cool, ok
[07:41] <pitti> pygi: review of what?
[07:41] <pygi> pitti, libmtp
[07:41] <pygi> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libmtp/+bug/132554
[07:41] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132554 in libmtp "[needs review]  libmtp 0.2.1 [needs upload] " [Undecided,New] 
[07:43] <pitti> pygi: can you please add an URL to the orig.tar.gz?
[07:43] <pygi> pitti, will do so now
[07:43] <Mithrandir> Hobbsee: what's the question?
[07:44] <Hobbsee> Mithrandir: in #ubuntu-motu
[07:44] <pygi> pitti, done!
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[07:44] <pitti> pygi: erk, ABI bump
[07:44] <pygi> pitti, yup, I know
[07:45] <pitti> pygi: there are 4 reverse dependencies which need to be rebuilt and tested against this
[07:45] <pygi> pitti, but brings support for new hardware and brings no problems
[07:45] <pygi> pitti, been there, done that
[07:45] <pitti> well, 3 (mtp-tools is in libmtp)
[07:45] <pygi> from the bug report: All rdepends build properly against it. :)
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[07:46] <pitti> pygi: debdiff looks good to me
[07:47] <pygi> good sign :)
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[07:50] <pitti> pygi: uploaded
[07:50] <pygi> pitti, thanks :)
[07:50] <pitti> np
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[07:59] <tonyyarusso> cjwatson: I sent you a message a while back concerning Keyspan driver.  Was wondering a) if you received it, b) if anything's happened on that front
[08:04] <ArneGoetje> tonyyarusso: cjwatson is on vacation this week.
[08:05] <tonyyarusso> cjwatson: I have http://www.keyspan.com/products/usb/USA19HS/, which has firmware and drivers included in the vanilla 2.6 kernel tree, but which have not been included in Debian/Ubuntu due to licensing problems, as explained on http://www.keyspan.com/downloads-files/developer/linux/.  I was wondering if it could be evaluated for inclusion in linux-restricted, per the advice of someone else.
[08:05] <tonyyarusso> ArneGoetje: ah, hrm.  e-mail to -devel better you think?
[08:05] <ArneGoetje> tonyyarusso: probably
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[08:23] <\sh> morning all...
[08:23] <\sh> does anyone has a clue how the we determine if a graphics card is able to have "Composite" extension enabled?
[08:24] <\sh> s/the//
[08:25] <pitti> \sh: mvo can tell you stories about it
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[08:25] <pitti> \sh: look at /usr/bin/compiz, that does exactly that
[08:28] <mjg59> Composite is supported on all cards
[08:28] <mjg59> But I don't think that's what you're asking
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[08:29] <pitti> \sh: yeah, for s/cards/driver/
[08:30] <pitti> ideally it would also blacklist cards, though
[08:30] <pitti> some are just too old and slow to sensibly support it
[08:30] <pitti> (with our drivers anyway)
[08:31] <RAOF> pitti: We do
[08:32] <RAOF> Oh, sorry.  EPARSE.
[08:34] <\sh> pitti, mjg59 : the problem I had was with an ati radeon 9600 card (desktop) (128MB ram) and with the oss ati/radeon driver
[08:35] <pitti> \sh: same here; compiz works OOTB on my radeon 9200, but the ati driver is way too slow
[08:35] <\sh> the little ati radeon m22 (r300 card) works on my laptop nicely with compiz on gutsy, but the desktop card doesn't...desktop effects aren't working
[08:35] <RAOF> Really?  I think that might be a Ubuntu-specific problem then.  People happily run compiz on 9200s
[08:37] <pitti> RAOF: well, as I said it works, but some operations like resizing windows are painfully slow
[08:37] <RAOF> Ah, but not in general?
[08:38] <\sh> could it be, that this is an dist-upgrade issue from feisty to gutsy? I had some troubles with the latest updates from feisty (oofice and ttf-opensymbol package) and after upgrading to gutsy the same problems...
[08:38] <pitti> RAOF: in general it's just a bit sluggish
[08:38] <RAOF> People in #compiz-fusion are probably not quite as performance-sensitive as you :)
[08:39] <pitti> RAOF: I guess you could get used to the speed after a while, but I find it annoying after a while
[08:39] <\sh> I'll do a clean install with gutsy media this evening ... let's see
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[08:39] <pitti> RAOF: it's just a poor old G4 800 MHz, that might contribute to the problem :)
[08:39] <RAOF> :)
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=== TheMuso should try gutsy/compiz on his G4 1.42 mini soonish. That has a 9200 with 32MB of RAM.
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[08:56] <thully> devs - where would be the best place to discuss a few laptop issues I've been having as of late?  I've reported them (or commented on them) and they've for the most part sat in launchpad limbo...
[08:57] <thully> A few of the issues include 122682, 37234 (granted, more of a feature request - but quite a significant one), and 128653
[09:03] <thully> I've also got 124642, but I just reopened that one - apparently my MacBook likes to make funky noises in some ACPI C-states, but only with certain kernels
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[09:10] <thully> I guess I dunno what to do from here - I want to help on these issues, and the whole laptop support area in general, but I haven't been able to find much (I saw a laptop team, but it looked like it mostly consisted of mjg59 and a few people who posted their specs/results).
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[09:12] <mdke> thully: you could try the laptop-testing mailing list.
[09:12] <thully> That's as dead as a doornail - check the archives
[09:13] <mdke> seems slightly less dead than laptop-devel
[09:14] <mdke> thully: maybe give it a try, if you don't get anywhere you could try the main development lists
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[09:18] <thully> OK
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[10:13] <lifeless> where do test-install-reports go these days ?
[10:14] <pitti> lifeless: https://iso.qa.stgraber.org/
[10:15] <lifeless> shame its not a ubuntu.com name
[10:15] <lifeless> hmm
[10:15] <pitti> yeah, but it hopefully will be in the future
[10:15] <lifeless> I have a 36 step-to-install document
[10:15] <lifeless> its not clear what issues are bugs, and what are not.
[10:16] <lifeless> that web site doesn't give me any hint as to what I should do in this situation.
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[10:16] <pitti> we usually file bugs and link them in the install reports
[10:17] <lifeless> right, but where do I write up my report ?
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[10:17] <pitti> lifeless: if you click on a particular ISO, you'll see the tests you can do with it, and if you click there you can submit your's
[10:19] <lifeless> its hellishly slow
[10:20] <lifeless> slower than launchpad
[10:20] <lifeless> ok, none of the tests match what I did
[10:20] <pitti> weird, it's not any slower than any other webpage (faster than LP in any case for me)
[10:20] <pitti> might be my geographically close location :)
[10:20] <lifeless> its https and lots of separate requests
[10:20] <pitti> I guess that thing is in .de
[10:20] <lifeless> this is known as 'bad'
[10:20] <Hobbsee> it's faster than LP here
[10:21] <Hobbsee> which is weird
[10:22] <pitti> heh, only 6 hops here
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[10:31] <StevenK> pitti: libvips10c2a, libvips10-dev, libcgal1, hylafax-doc and hat-ghc6 can be NBS'd out at your leisure.
[10:31] <pitti> yay
[10:31] <lifeless> pitti: my mail has hit ubuntu-devel
[10:32] <lifeless> (if you are interested)
[10:32] <pitti> I am
[10:33] <stgraber> lifeless: about the "I think the ISO testing web pages
[10:33] <stgraber> should include some guidance for adhoc tests"
[10:33] <stgraber> (crappy copy/paste ...)
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[10:33] <stgraber> It's possible to add a link to a wikipage for each tests, but we need people to do so :)
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[10:34] <pitti> StevenK: hm, ppu-fortran needs a rebuild on i386 and ppc for getting rid of libmpfr1
[10:34] <pitti> StevenK: killed, merci
[10:34] <stgraber> (the Ubuntu Server have a link to what to a test description (if you click on the icon next to the test name))
[10:36] <stgraber> pitti: It's hosted in France with some nice peerings for Germany (and Switzerland by the same)
[10:38] <stgraber> (and yes it'd need more RAM :), 256MB being a bit short but that's what you have when you pay 20 for a server :))
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[10:39] <lifeless> stgraber: well, I'm not saying that there need to be links to each test
[10:39] <pitti> stgraber: I also pay 20 for my colo, but I could just buy another gig and have them build it in at no additional monthly cost (just the price for the RAM bar, of course)
[10:39] <lifeless> stgraber: I'm saying that when someone does a test which is not covered, what should they do ?
[10:40] <lifeless> I installed a crypted, lvm'd, desktop.
[10:40] <lifeless> thats not even a minor variation, its a massive variation, because of the impact on partitionining, on whether the right packages *can* be there, of using universe...
[10:41] <Lutin> pitti: can you give-back mgcv and kernsmooth please ?
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[10:41] <lifeless> anyone know if gconf database is arch specific?
[10:42] <mvo> mjg59: are you around? I'm writting up the discussion of the techboard meeting now and I wonder if the performance problem for 3d apps in compiz affects all video drivers or only nvidia. I can not see it here on my ati system (in a quick and unscientific test)
[10:43] <pitti> Lutin: done
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[10:49] <mvo> pitti: hm, looks like restricted-manager is currently unable to enable the nvidia driver at all :/ did you got a bugreport about this already?
[10:49] <pitti> mvo: hm, no, works quite fine for me; what does it do?
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[10:51] <mvo> pitti: if I use it with the apperance capplet (--check-composited) it will give me a message that I need to enable the driver, then I click ok and nothing appears to happen
[10:51] <mvo> pitti: xorg.conf is not rewriten at least
[10:51] <mvo> I think the download worked earlier
[10:51] <mvo> pitti: this is a fresh tribe-4 install
[10:52] <pitti> mvo: oh, can you please try with latest r-m?
[10:53] <mvo> pitti: ok, I will do that in a bit (machine has no network yet)
[10:53] <pitti> mvo: thanks; if it's still broken, please get back to me
[10:53] <mvo> ok, thanks
[10:53] <pitti> mvo: it indeed was broken for very new or very old cards (nvidia-glx-{legacy,new})
[10:53] <mvo> mine is neither :)
[10:53] <mvo> 6600
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[11:07] <\sh> mvo, I heard you are the compiz master...upgraded feisty to gutsy, having a ati radeon 9600 card (agp desktop) running xorg with ati oss driver, but enable desktop tells me, that it's not working
[11:07] <\sh> mvo, could it be, that this is an upgrade issue, or is ati radeon 9600 not supported from xorg-ati oss drivers?
[11:08] <mvo> \sh: can you please put the output of ".xsession-errors" to a pastebin? after you tried to enable it?
[11:08] <\sh> mvo, can do it this evening :) because it's my home machine :)
[11:08] <\sh> mvo, but sure will do
[11:08] <mvo> \sh: ok, please do that then :)
[11:08] <mvo> \sh: it has some verbose output that will help me diagnose the issue
[11:09] <mvo> everything else is guesswork
[11:09] <\sh> mvo, better to install gutsy from scratch or just leave my installation like it is (upgraded gutsy from feisty)
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[11:12] <mvo> \sh: upgraded should be fine
=== mvo always upgrades
[11:13] <\sh> mvo, cool...you'll get the output around 20 :)
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[11:21] <pitti> infinity: btw, what's the difference between dpkg --print-{,installation-}architecture?
[11:21] <pitti> infinity: I changed that in apport now as per your recommendation a few days ago
[11:21] <pitti> infinity: and I made it DTRT on lpia
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[11:39] <Riddell> keescook: are you doing poppler packaging these days?  0.5.91 is out
[11:41] <pitti> Riddell: desktop team usually, but I can look into it, too
[11:41] <pitti> Riddell: maybe it fixes PDF printing again :)
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[11:42] <pitti> Riddell: hm, http://poppler.freedesktop.org/ doesn't mention it
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[11:43] <pitti> Riddell: ah, download works, though :)
[11:43] <asac> hmmm any idea where i can get a plain ubuntu.{png,xpm} ?
[11:43] <Riddell> :)
[11:44] <Riddell> asac: canonical.com has an artwork page
[11:44] <asac> i knew i was missing the obvious ;) ... thanks!
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[11:45] <asac> Riddell: wiki?
[11:45] <Riddell> that too, but the public website had one made recently
[11:46] <asac> hmmm
[11:46] <Riddell> http://www.canonical.com/logos
[11:46] <asac> where is that linked from?
[11:46] <Riddell> irc logs now :)
[11:47] <asac> hmmm i want just the image ... not the text
[11:47] <asac> ... maybe i have to cut it then
[11:47] <Riddell> launchpad.net/ubuntu
[11:47] <Riddell> or, crop
[11:47] <asac> yeah :)
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[11:49] <lifeless> is there something to configure which compiz plugins are active?
[11:50] <Fujitsu> lifeless: compizconfig-settings-manager or something similarly named.
[11:50] <mvo> lifeless: what Fujitsu says
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[11:50] <lifeless> what package is it in? (its notinstalled )
[11:51] <mvo> lifeless: what HW do you have that made the system freeze when enabling effects? is that a i945?
[11:51] <Fujitsu> lifeless: compizconfig-settings-manager is the package, AFAIK.
[11:51] <mvo> lifeless: compizconfig-settings-manager is the pakcagename (universe)
[11:51] <lifeless> 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller [0300] : Intel Corporation Mobile 945GM/GMS/940GML Express Integrated Graphics Controller [8086:27a2]  (rev 03)
[11:52] <mvo> with the "intel" driver I assume?
[11:53] <lifeless> yes
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[12:00] <mvo> lifeless: I wonder if 32bit/64bit makes a difference here
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[12:06] <ajmitch> Fujitsu: an impressive package, doesn't even start for me
[12:06] <Fujitsu> ajmitch: WFM
[12:06] <ajmitch> python ImportError
[12:07] <ajmitch> afaik I have the latest compiz crack installed
[12:07] <geser> must be an new error as it worked for me yesterday
[12:07] <ajmitch> or just a broken package on my system
[12:08] <tkamppeter> hi pitti
[12:08] <pitti> hey tkamppeter
[12:09] <pitti> tkamppeter: currently discussing the firmware issue
[12:09] <tkamppeter> pitti, Tim Waugh has modified the add-printer wizard so that it asks for the queue name only after printer and model selection, in time before the UVF. I have packaged it, see your mail.
[12:09] <pitti> tkamppeter: rock!
=== pitti sends a  Tim Waugh for being a great upstream
[12:10] <geser> ajmitch: just upgraded ccsm to 0.5.2+git20070814-0ubuntu1 and it still WFM
[12:10] <pitti> tkamppeter: with a nice default name now, I assume?
[12:10] <ajmitch> geser: it was referring to an undefined symbol in a library
[12:10] <ajmitch> geser: and I'm not using any 3rd party packages either :)
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[12:12] <pitti> tkamppeter: will have a look later, currently attacking new poppler version (cross your fingers that it fixes PDF printing :) )
[12:12] <infinity> pitti: To be honest, I'm not sure if there is a difference anymore, I'd have to look at the code.
[12:12] <pitti> infinity: --p-i-a is not even documented
[12:13] <infinity> pitti: I know. :)
[12:15] <infinity> pitti: Ahh, there we go.
[12:16] <infinity> pitti: Okay, --print-architecture used to do the same thing as dpkg-architecture (call a compiler, other silly thing), while --p-i-a just dumped the current dpkg arch.
[12:17] <infinity> pitti: Since 2005 or so, --print-arch was fixed to do what --p-i-a used to do, and then --p-i-a was aliased to --p-a, so they're the same (and both correct) now.
[12:17] <infinity> pitti: I just live in the past, apparently.
[12:17] <ajmitch> geser: I had old libcompizconfig0 installed, I guess it's a bit loose with shlibs
[12:17] <pitti> infinity: ah, good; I guess I'll revert it then to stay on the documented side
[12:20] <geser> ajmitch: bug mvo about it
[12:20] <infinity> pitti: Probably safer, though if a dpkg dev ever drops --p-i-a, there will be an uproar from both the Debian and Ubuntu buildd maintainers who have it hardcoded all over the place (due to the old switch historically not quite doing the right thing)
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[12:22] <pitti> tkamppeter, geser: rock! new poppler fixes pdftops
[12:22] <geser> yeah
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[12:24] <tkamppeter> pitti, great, then this showstopper is fixed.
[12:25] <pitti> can anyone on current gutsy please test whether opening http://fixnum.org/public/fullcircle/fullcircle-issue01-english.pdf in evince crashes?
[12:27] <geser> pitti: Segmentation fault (core dumped)
[12:28] <geser> on amd64
[12:28] <Mithrandir> pitti: works fine for me on i386
[12:28] <pitti> geser: cool, thanks; with new poppler it works fine
[12:28] <Fujitsu> Works on i386 here.
[12:28] <tkamppeter> pitti, default printer name is derived from the model, and if the model was not auto-detected derived from the selected PPD.
[12:28] <pitti> so seems bug 123116 is fixed as well
[12:28] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 123116 in poppler "evince-thumbnailer crashed with SIGSEGV in Object::fetch()" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/123116
=== pitti downgrades poppler just to verify
[12:28] <pitti> $ evince-thumbnailer -s 128 file:///tmp/fullcircle-issue01-english.pdf  /tmp/xx
[12:28] <pitti> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
[12:29] <pitti> yep, confirmed
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[12:35] <pitti> Riddell: updated and tested with evince and pdflatex; it doesn't seem to break ABI this time around, but if you could test it with kpdf and koffice it would be good
[12:37] <Riddell> koffice doesn't use poppler
[12:37] <pitti> oh, right
[12:38] <Riddell> and neither does kpdf in gutsy right now, since it needed the new version, it's high on my list to port the poppler patch to kde 3.5.7
[12:38] <pitti> Riddell: ah, I see; right, I had to do that for texlive, too
[12:38] <pitti> Riddell: some minor things only, though, like UGooString -> GooString
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[12:39] <pitti> tkamppeter: please register, so that we can /msg
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[12:44] <pitti> tkamppeter: bug 132646 explains the problem
[12:44] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132646 in hplip "firmware files do not have any license" [Critical,Triaged]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132646
[12:44] <pitti> tkamppeter: I'll binary-NEW hplip now to make desktop installable again, but this should be sorted out with upstream eventually; can you contact them please?
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[12:47] <tkamppeter> pitti, now /msg should work.
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[01:00] <\sh> btw...is someone working on those screenlets for c-f?
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[01:09] <lifeless> mvo: I have no idea.
[01:10] <Fujitsu> \sh: screenlets?
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[01:17] <RAOF> \sh: Not really for c-f :)
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[01:17] <\sh> Fujitsu, http://compiz.org/Desktop_Screenlets
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[01:25] <gaara> ANY1 HERE READY TO HELP?
[01:26] <ogra> no
[01:26] <ogra> thats not a support channel
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[02:00] <Riddell> mvo: if I run /usr/share/update-notifier/notify-reboot-required should update notifer give me a popup saying to reboot?
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[02:04] <mvo> Riddell: touch /var/lib/update-notifier/dpkg-run-stamp too
[02:06] <Riddell> mvo: ok, that did something, what is it that touches /var/lib/update-notifier/dpkg-run-stamp ?
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[02:06] <mvo> Riddell: a configuration option added from update-notifier
[02:06] <mvo> Riddell: that is dropped into /etc/apt/apt.conf.d
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[02:09] <Riddell> mvo: so for adept should I make an update-notifier-common package with notify-reboot-required and that apt option?
[02:10] <mvo> Riddell: yes, that sounds perfect, then it can drop its 10-adept-periodic file too
[02:11] <Riddell> mvo: ok, I'll implement the adept side before playing with u-n packages
[02:11] <mvo> Riddell: ok
[02:12] <Riddell> mvo: does anything delete the dpkg-run-stamp and notify-reboot-required files?
[02:13] <mvo> Riddell: notify-reboot-required lifes on /var/run so it gets autoamtically removed and the dpkg-run-stamp is just a stamp file, no need to remove it, its monitored with inotify
[02:14] <Riddell> right
[02:15] <Riddell> mvo: do you know of anything which currently uses the upgrade hooks?
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[02:17] <mvo> Riddell: the kernel I think, hal
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[02:31] <Riddell> mvo: they use reboot-required but not the scripted upgrade hook
[02:31] <Riddell> as far as I can tell anyway
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[02:32] <\sh> hmm..firefox is using some of those upgrade hooks, isn't it?
[02:32] <Riddell> dunno, asac?
[02:33] <\sh> they are copying things back and forth, at least since i had a look at the source package the last time, during feisty devel end or gutsy devel start, I'm not sure anymore
[02:33] <\sh> and wine should have at least this "reboot needed" notification hook , because of wine-server and mdz' bugreport
[02:34] <asac> \sh: firefox installs restart notification hints ...yse.
[02:34] <\sh> asac: not this update notification for restarted firefox?
[02:34] <\sh> s/ed/ing/
[02:35] <asac> i don't understand your question ;)
[02:35] <asac> its an update notification to restart firefox
[02:35] <\sh> asac, yeah...didn't read properly :(
[02:36] <mvo> Riddell: oh, sorry. firefox uses one of the upgrade-hooks
[02:36] <Riddell> asac: so it does, thanks
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[02:37] <asac> but its not perfect that way
[02:37] <asac> its often too late to restart firefox when binaries have been replaced
[02:38] <asac> if user is out of luck he gets notification after firefox crashed ;)
=== \sh ran once or twice into this problem ;)
[02:40] <Riddell> "Please execute the asoundconf(1) set-default-card macro" wow, that's not very user friendly
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[02:41] <pitti> Riddell: WTH?
[02:41] <ogra> sexy
[02:41] <ogra> Riddell, where do you get that `
[02:41] <ogra> ?
[02:42] <\sh> with a nice blue background, I would say: vista baby vista  ,-)
[02:44] <Riddell> ogra: alsa-lib upgrade hook
[02:45] <ogra> ouch
=== ogra didnt upgrade since tribe4
[02:45] <Riddell> it only runs [ -f ~/.asoundrc.asoundconf ]  so I guess you have to have played around with your sound card settings previously
[02:45] <Riddell> it's not a new script
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[02:48] <Riddell> seb128: you're on holiday!
[02:48] <seb128> hi Riddell, yeah I know ;)
[02:49] <Riddell> seb128: but while you're here, does anything in gnome have an update-notifier upgrade hook?
[02:50] <seb128> not that I know, but better to ask mvo, he probably knows about package using hooks
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[02:51] <pitti> hey seb128
[02:51] <seb128> hey pitti
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=== Hobbsee waves
=== highvoltage waves across the ocean to Hobbsee 
[03:14] <pitti> hey Hobbsee
[03:14] <Hobbsee> highvoltage!
[03:14] <Hobbsee> hiya pitti :)
=== Hobbsee hugs pitti
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[03:17] <geser> Hi Hobbsee
[03:18] <Hobbsee> hi geser
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[03:25] <ogra> meh, since when does evo complain that i didnt add attachments to my mails ...
=== ogra shakes his head
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[03:26] <Riddell> ogra: it might do if your e-mail talks about something being attached?
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[03:27] <ogra> Riddell, right, it said something like that ... bad is if someone in a thread added that content... you have the question on every reply then
=== lamont notices that splix and dovecot both build-depend things in universe.
[03:28] <lifeless> holy crap that would be insane
[03:29] <Hobbsee> i would assume it would detect quoted mail, and know not to ask for that
=== lifeless hopes its in a plugin and thus nukable
[03:30] <ScottK> In Kmail you can edit the regex that's used for the function.  I don't know about Evolution.
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=== lamont is reminded why he's happy evo has never been his mailer
[03:31] <ogra> lifeless, thanks for the pointer, its indeed a plugin called "Attachment Reminder"
[03:33] <Hobbsee> ogra: thunderbird doesnt do such rubbish.
[03:33] <Hobbsee> thank goodness
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[03:34] <ogra> Hobbsee, well its a neat feature if you like it i guess ... and its just one clieck to disable it
[03:34] <Hobbsee> ogra: true, but you're stuffed if you ever use another client, or webmail
[03:34] <Hobbsee> ogra: better to teach yourself to attach the attachments first, then write the email.
[03:34] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I think ogra is searching for a real mail client.  Mind you he didn't particularly find one IMO.
=== ScottK ducks.
[03:35] <Hobbsee> Scotta
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[03:35] <Hobbsee> ScottK: all mail clients suck.  some just suck a little less.
[03:35] <ScottK> We can all agree on that, I'm pretty sure.
[03:35] <ogra> ScottK, no, i'm trying to use what i deliver to my users so i can comprehend their errors and bugs :P
[03:35] <ScottK> Ah.
[03:36] <ScottK> That would be another reason.
[03:36] <ogra> and evco isnt that bad ...
[03:36] <ogra> *evo
[03:36] <Mithrandir> ogra: depends on whether you have many folders or not.
[03:36] <Mithrandir> it doesn't handle a couple of thousand folders, for instance.
[03:36] <ScottK> I tried it before I tried Kmail and didn't much like it.  I tried Kmail and just quit looking.
[03:36] <Hobbsee> kmail is the *only* kde app that manages to confuse me.
[03:37] <ScottK> Can evolution use maildir for it's mail store yet?
[03:37] <ogra> Mithrandir, i think in total i'm over 300000 mails atm stored in 45 folders
[03:37] <Hobbsee> ogra: that's seriously too much email....
[03:37] <ogra> it handles that quite well
[03:38] <ogra> Hobbsee, i like complete local mail archives (and oi love evos search options, TB cant cope here)
[03:38] <Hobbsee> ogra: true
[03:38] <ogra> speed is the only issue ...
[03:38] <ogra> but with that amount of mail its an issue with every mail app i guess
[03:40] <ScottK> ogra: I found switching from mbox to maildir helped significantly on speed.
=== ogra didnt use mbox since several years 
[03:40] <Mithrandir> ogra: I have ~12M across 1400 folders, down from about 6.5k folders which just took too long to check them all.
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[03:41] <ogra> ScottK, actually since i switched to evo which offered that as default back then
[03:41] <ScottK> OK.  Didn't know that about evolution.  Maildir/Mbox is a big performance difference application differences aside.
[03:41] <ogra> Mithrandir, oh, i only have one folder on the server that i check and leave sorting to filters ....
[03:41] <Mithrandir> yes, I filter into those folders.
[03:42] <ogra> s/one folder/one incoming folder/
[03:42] <ogra> but server sided i guess ...
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[03:43] <ogra> i leave the filtering to evo as well ...
[03:43] <tkamppeter> pitti, ping
[03:44] <pitti> tkamppeter: still here
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[03:51] <lifeless> what does 'policy timeout is not valid' when trying to suspend mean?
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[03:53] <Kmos> "running /scripts/init-bottom"
[03:53] <Kmos> it's part of which package?
[03:53] <lifeless> many
[03:53] <highvoltage> initramfs-tools
[03:53] <lifeless> its a directory of scripts
[03:54] <highvoltage> (amongs others, yes)
[03:54] <Kmos> bug 132289
[03:55] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132289 in Ubuntu "[gutsy]  segmentation fault during boot in /scripts/init-bottom" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132289
[03:55] <Kmos> it's about this bug
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[03:55] <ogra> Kmos, thats likely not even related to initramfs ...
[03:55] <ogra> something *inside* is having a segfault
[03:56] <ogra> to fix that bug you have to find out what exactly produces it
[03:56] <Kmos> ogra: it's kernel related
[03:56] <Kmos> ?
[03:57] <ogra> unlikely ... its likely an app dying in the initramfs
[03:57] <pygi> xhaker, poke?
[03:57] <xhaker> pygi, rock on
[03:57] <Kmos> ogra: what logs should I ask for ?
[03:57] <Kmos> kernel generala ?
[03:57] <Kmos> *general
[03:58] <stdin> Bug #131961
[03:58] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 131961 in initramfs-tools "segfault when booting 2.6.22-9-generic" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131961
[03:58] <xhaker> ogra, can it be udevd?
[03:58] <pygi> xhaker, pm
[03:58] <ogra> as i said, i doubt thats kernel related, to debug that you need to enter the initramfs during boot and find out whats dying ...  Kmos, thats a pretty advanced bug
[03:59] <Kmos> :(
[03:59] <Kmos> ogra: can you take care of it ? =)
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[03:59] <ogra> Kmos, no
[04:00] <ogra> (i'm working fulltime on other stuff already but i assume the right people have seen it already)
[04:00] <Kmos> i hope so :)
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[04:04] <Kmos> stdin: bug 132385 another seg fault
[04:04] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132385 in Ubuntu "Kubuntu shows three mysterious segfaults on VT1." [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132385
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[04:04] <stdin> Kmos: same bug
[04:04] <Kmos> :))
[04:05] <Kmos> stdin: dupe done, thx
[04:05] <jdong> but but... that one is for *kubuntu*
[04:05] <ice-phoenix> hi
[04:05] <jdong> ;-)
[04:05] <jdong> lol
[04:05] <ice-phoenix> can someone help me with kubuntu
[04:05] <Hobbsee> !jdong | jdong
[04:05] <ubotu> jdong: jdong is Hobbsee: jdong: yes, but you're FULL OF CRACK!
[04:05] <jdong> :)
[04:05] <Hobbsee> ice-phoenix: you probably want #kubuntu
[04:05] <jdong> how is everyone doing?
[04:05] <ice-phoenix> tnx
[04:07] <lamont> Keybuk: thoughts on 132536?
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[04:10] <lamont> pitti: requestsync doesn't like me
[04:11] <Hobbsee> lamont: why?
[04:11] <lamont> because I didn't have a deb-src line, I'm betting
[04:12] <Hobbsee> that'll do it
[04:12] <tkamppeter> pitti, I think we should put the 20_...nonroot... patch back into system-cups-manager. It makes the tool more universal. For example on systems without local CUPS daemon (pointing to a server via client.conf) s-c-p will work only with the patch. We should rename the patch to tell what it really does.
[04:12] <lamont> tkamppeter: as long as the name isn't 20_gaping_security_hole.patch
[04:14] <lamont> Hobbsee: that and the fact that apt-cache madison doesn't seem to find things with ~ in the name or some such
[04:15] <Hobbsee> lamont: it doesnt use apt-cache madison anymore, afaik
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[04:15] <Hobbsee> lamont: it uses rmadison -u ubuntu and rmadison
[04:15] <lamont> OTOH, that's just me hacking around the fact that dinstall hasn't run yet, so I'm using the local version, which is a backport to dapper
[04:15] <lamont>  raise Exception('apt-cache madison does not contain %s/%s' % (sourcepkg, release))
[04:15] <lamont> bad requestsync
[04:15] <lamont> lying
[04:16] <jdong> wait, apt-cache madison doesn't find what?
=== jdong has been using that command forever
[04:16] <lamont> jdong: it could be requestsync lyiung
[04:16] <jdong> could be
[04:16] <jdong> apt-cache madison has never failed on me
[04:16] <jdong> knock on wood
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[04:17] <Hobbsee> lamont: you're using feisty, i take it?
[04:17] <Hobbsee> hiya calc
[04:17] <lamont> -mix.mmjgroup.com 1374: apt-cache madison postfix/2.4.5-3~0.6.06
[04:17] <lamont> -mix.mmjgroup.com 1375: apt-cache madison postfix | grep 2.4.5-3~0.6.06
[04:17] <lamont>    postfix | 2.4.5-3~0.6.06 | http://archive.mmjgroup.com  Packages
[04:17] <lamont>    postfix | 2.4.5-3~0.6.06 | http://archive.mmjgroup.com  Sources
[04:17] <pitti> lamont: hm, I thought it would use rmadison nowadays
[04:17] <Hobbsee> pitti: it does.
[04:17] <pitti> lamont: are you on feisty then? that one still used apt-cache madison IIRC
[04:17] <lamont> pitti: remind me where to freshen requestsync from?
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[04:18] <pitti> tkamppeter: alright, makes sense
[04:18] <StevenK> From devscripts
[04:18] <lamont> because I'm running ~/bin/requestsync still...
[04:18] <lamont> and yes, feisty
[04:18] <StevenK> lamont: I can put a copy on a webserver, if you wish
[04:18] <Hobbsee> lamont: http://wedontsleep.org/~sarah/requestsync
[04:18] <lamont> nah
[04:18] <pitti> copying
[04:18] <pitti> lamont http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/scripts/requestsync
[04:18] <pitti> tkamppeter: I'll rename it then and put it back
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[04:19] <lamont> requestsync postfix 2.4.5-3~0.6.06
[04:19] <lamont> Unknown option: u
[04:19] <lamont> is that bad?
[04:20] <Hobbsee> lamont: why specifying -u?
[04:20] <lamont> Hobbsee: that's the latest requestsync from you and pitti
[04:20] <lamont> running on feisy...
=== lamont backports the gutsy package
[04:20] <Hobbsee> lamont: sounds like rmadison screwup
[04:20] <pitti> lamont: aah
[04:20] <pitti> lamont: rmadison -u -> you need gutsy's version
[04:21] <tkamppeter> pitti, thanks.
[04:22] <Hobbsee> lamont: i presume you've already got it, but http://wedontsleep.org/~sarah/rmadison FWIW
[04:22] <pitti> tkamppeter: \o/ I mastered to convince s-c-p to print a page size specific custom test page
[04:27] <lamont> I want an option to edit the requestsync message before it gets signed
[04:27] <tkamppeter> pitti, you mean that you have a Ubuntu test page .ps file which prints on any page size like the original CUPS test page?
[04:28] <pitti> tkamppeter: I did it in a rather generic way
[04:28] <pitti> tkamppeter: s-c-p now checks whether there is a file /usr/share/s-c-p/testpage-<papersize>/ps
[04:28] <pitti> tkamppeter: it reads the papersize from the PPD
[04:29] <pitti> tkamppeter: if the papersize is not set, or there is not test page for that papersize, it falls back to the cups default test page
[04:30] <pitti> tkamppeter: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/04_custom_test_pages.patch -> WDYT?
[04:30] <tkamppeter> I think it is a good idea. Send me the patch and I will apply it upstream.
[04:31] <lamont> and then he forgets to add the text that was why he couldn't use the script.
[04:31] <lamont> the postfix sync request should include the fact that it's currently in incoming...
[04:31] <pitti> tkamppeter: I'll send it to Tim with some explanations
[04:31] <lamont> pitti: my bad. ^^
[04:31] <pitti> lamont: ah :)
[04:31] <pitti> lamont: just send it as a bug followup
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[04:32] <pitti> tkamppeter: the nonroot patch should go to upstream then; it didn't look Ubuntu specific at all
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[04:35] <tkamppeter> pitti, have upstreamized the 20_... patch now.
[04:36] <pitti> tkamppeter: ah, you have commit access, right :)
[04:36] <tkamppeter> pitti, I am upstream of s-c-p since last week, too. Did I not tell you?
[04:36] <pitti> tkamppeter: you did, but I wasn't aware of that ATM :)
[04:37] <tkamppeter> pitti, so you can send the patch to me and I upstreamize it.
[04:37] <pitti> tkamppeter: is http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/04_custom_test_pages.patch good for you? Or shall I mail you and Tim for comments from him, too? (might be better)
[04:41] <tkamppeter> pitti, I will try it-
[04:42] <tkamppeter> pitti, but note that Tim has fixed a lot of issues after I have done the last package we are 5 SVN revs further now.
[04:43] <pitti> tkamppeter: ok, I'm doing an upload now with the ubuntu test pages and bug 107766 fixed
[04:43] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 107766 in system-config-printer "system-config-printer adds menu item the same as gnome-cups-manager's menu item" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/107766
[04:45] <tkamppeter> pitti, I have applied your test page patch to s-c-p installed into my system and it ptints the original CUPS test page on my A4 laser and on my small 10x15 photo printer.
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[04:46] <tkamppeter> Should the A4 laser not print a special test page?
[04:46] <pitti> tkamppeter: right, that's fine
[04:46] <pitti> tkamppeter: of course you need the actual files, too :)
[04:46] <pitti> tkamppeter: I put them into the s-c-p package now
[04:46] <pitti> tkamppeter: just put a .ps file into /u/share/s-c-p/testpage-a4.ps
[04:47] <pitti> tkamppeter: (if your printer paper size is configured as a4)
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[04:50] <pitti> tkamppeter: if there's good new stuff upstream, we can look into updating the package a couple of more times, no problem
[04:52] <tkamppeter> pitti, test page patch is upstreamized now.
[04:52] <pitti> \o/
[04:52] <pitti> my first s-c-p patch
[04:52] <tkamppeter> pitti, I really thought about repackaging from upstream now, as Tim has donme a lot:
[04:53] <pitti> tkamppeter: sure, if you feel like it
[04:53] <tkamppeter> Fixed bug 131848
[04:53] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 131848 in system-config-printer "system-config-printer.py crashed with RuntimeError in save_serversettings()" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131848
[04:53] <pitti> tkamppeter: please wait until my current upload hit the mirror (in about 50 minutes)
[04:53] <tkamppeter> fixed bug 132227
[04:53] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132227 in system-config-printer "Configuring a new printer should be easier and have better defaults" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/132227
[04:53] <pitti> tkamppeter: wow! I filed that only two hours ago
[04:54] <tkamppeter> Fixed redraw issues and added "Please wait" messages.
[04:54] <pitti> oh, no, I mixed that up with the 'default selection' bug
[04:55] <tkamppeter> Improved model matching
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=== Hobbsee looks for alberto milone's contact info
[04:57] <tkamppeter> pitti, I do not need to wait for the mirrors, I download the sources directly from the Launchpad. is 0.7.71+-svn1399-0ubuntu2 the newest one.
[04:57] <evand> Hobbsee: https://launchpad.net/~albertomilone/ ?
[04:57] <pitti> tkamppeter: right, that would work
[04:58] <Hobbsee> evand: ah, that one.  thanks
[04:58] <evand> you're welcome
=== Hobbsee goes to whinge
[04:59] <Keybuk> lamont: bogus
[04:59] <Hobbsee> greetings, Keybuk
=== dobey kicks launchapd
[05:00] <Keybuk> oh wait, maybe it isn't
[05:00] <pitti> tkamppeter: TTYL, I need to disappear for some two hours
[05:02] <Keybuk> iwj: udev doesn't build, FTBFS in watershed/libnettle somewhere
[05:03] <Keybuk> lamont: why does there need to be a /usr/lib/libvolume_id.so ?
[05:05] <lamont> well, if you want things to use it...
[05:05] <infinity> Keybuk: To link against it..?
[05:05] <Keybuk> what's wrong with /lib/libvolume_id.so :)
[05:05] <lamont> that's not used by ld
[05:06] <lamont> is used by ld.so
[05:06] <infinity> Keybuk: The same thing that would be wrong with shipping /lib/libc6.so
[05:06] <lamont> so the library package delivers /lib/libvolume_id.so, and the -dev package delivers the symlink in /usr/lib/libvolume_id.so
[05:07] <lamont> Keybuk: see "debian-policy 8.4 Development files"
[05:08] <Keybuk> ahh
=== Keybuk just copied all this from Debian at the time; I never looked too hard :p
[05:09] <lamont> interesting, since ubuntu udev versions are all >>>>> debian versions (which have a 0. in front of the ubuntu version)...
[05:10] <Keybuk> yeah I changed the version :)
[05:10] <lamont> any future need I have for versioned depends on udev?  we'll just forget about that
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[05:11] <lamont> actually, it'll just mean that I hack debian/rules to notice that we're on ubuntu, and manually verify that a late enough version is installed, or fail.  somehow, I'm not really looking forward to that
[05:11] <iwj> Keybuk: Oh, really ?
[05:12] <Keybuk> iwj: dunno, it builds ok this time
[05:12] <Keybuk> strange thing
[05:12] <iwj> Hrm.
[05:12] <Keybuk> I'll upload if, if LP mails me, I'll bug you again :p
[05:12] <lamont> Keybuk: util-linux currently build-depends: libvolume-id-dev (>=0.113)
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[05:13] <lamont> which ubuntu always meets.  since dapper.
[05:13] <lamont> so WTH did we gratuitously make our version >>>> debian?
[05:14] <lamont> it's not like we can go back
[05:14] <Keybuk> because upstream asked us to
[05:14] <Keybuk> and our udev packages are so different anyway that everything that touches it needs to be checked
[05:14] <Keybuk> so it wasn't a bad thing
[05:16] <lamont> ok.  I'll believe you
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[05:17] <dobey> hey, does Scott James Remnant ever pop on irc?
[05:17] <Keybuk> no :)
[05:17] <lamont> the .so thing showed up when I was debdiffing the merged util-linux source
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[05:17] <lamont> dobey: only his brother does, as Keybuk.
[05:17] <dobey> ah
[05:18] <Hobbsee> Keybuk: you really should change the real name on your client, to fool people.
[05:19] <Hobbsee> it's *far* more fun that way
=== lamont was wondering why Hobbsee was sending him off to some sarah's public_html tree
[05:19] <lamont> although only for about 10 seconds
[05:19] <Hobbsee> lamont: :)
[05:20] <Hobbsee> lamont: it's a good dumping ground.  the server is actually StevenK's, which i have a shell account on.
[05:24] <tkamppeter> doko, ping
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[05:28] <doko> tkamppeter: pong
[05:30] <tkamppeter> doko, biff, can you upload the new system-config-printer packages which I mention in my mail? Thanks.
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[05:32] <russ_> hi :) Anyone know there way around the file structure for Python on Ubuntu?
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[05:37] <russ_> My Question is:  I want to install a Python library, I know how to do this in Windows (c:\Python25\lib\) where do I put it in Ubuntu?
[05:38] <ScottK> russ_: This channel isn't for support.  I'll help you with your problem in #ubuntu-motu if you come over there.
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[05:39] <russ_> ah ok, sorry for coming to the wrong place :-S
[05:39] <russ_> thanks
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[05:43] <doko> tkamppeter: done
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[05:48] <tkamppeter> Thanks, doko, the two bugs got automatically closed now.
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[05:49] <slestak_> cjwatson: do you need any testers for your recent putty port?
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[05:50] <bddebian> Heya
[05:51] <Hobbsee> slestak_: he's on leave
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[05:51] <slestak_> Hobbsee: k, thx.
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[06:10] <ScottK> It looks like soyuz fell over on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/zekr/0.5.1.dfsg-0ubuntu1 - " Failed to upload".  I'd appreciate it if an archive admin would have a look at it.
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[06:29] <\sh> mvo, ping
[06:29] <\sh> mvo, you wanted to have the .xsession-logfile for the problem I have with the radeon card: http://de.pastebin.ca/658429
[06:30] <\sh> lspci gives me: 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV350 AQ [Radeon 9600] 
[06:30] <\sh> 01:00.1 Display controller: ATI Technologies Inc RV350 AQ [Radeon 9600]  (Secondary)
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[06:31] <\sh> brb
[06:35] <\sh> back
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[06:36] <mvo> \sh: thanks
=== Hobbsee hugs mvo in greeting
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[06:37] <Hobbsee> :)
[06:37] <\sh> mvo, i tried just now to use the PCI 1:0:1 (secondary controller) but this doesn't work at all
[06:38] <mvo> \sh: can I have the ouput of glxinfo and "LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1 glxinfo" please as well? it looks like for some reason your card does not support the subset of features that compiz requires. you use the "ati" or "radeon" driver I assume?
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[06:38] <\sh> mvo, ati oss driver
[06:39] <\sh> mvo, glxinfo http://de.pastebin.ca/658439
[06:40] <\sh> mvo, glxinfo with libgl_always_indirect setting: http://de.pastebin.ca/658441
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[06:41] <mvo> \sh: can you put /var/log/xorg.0.log somewhere too? my current theory is that your card is simply not support with propper 3d
[06:41] <geser> \sh: did the drm module load the r300 microcode? (see in dmesg)
[06:41] <Riddell> mvo: when I compile update-notifier it puts the gconf .schema file in /etc/gconf/schemas/ instead of /usr/share/gconf/schemas/
[06:42] <\sh> mvo, http://de.pastebin.ca/658447 xorg log
[06:43] <\sh> geser, moment I check
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=== Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-devel.log
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-devel: Development of Ubuntu (not support, even with gutsy; not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper/edgy/feisty, #ubuntu+1 for gutsy support | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | Tribe 4 released
=== Topic (#ubuntu-devel): set by pitti at Thu Aug  9 16:01:54 2007
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[08:33] <attunix> Isn't there a command where if I have multiple boot screens installed, it lets me choose which one? Because I did sudo apt-get install ubuntustudio-desktop. Later, I removed it, but the boot screen (with the loading bar) remained. Please help.
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[08:47] <xhaker> doko, eclipse 3.3?
[08:48] <doko> xhaker: go ahead
[08:49] <xhaker> doko, do you have any plans to push it into gutsy?
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[08:50] <doko> xhaker: sure, if you have packages ready
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[08:52] <xhaker> doko, sorry i don't have any. i was passing my eyes through the archives and checking the packages i use most so i can see if i help there
[08:52] <xhaker> doko, do you think it'd be hard to make a package for eclipse using the previous version sources?
[08:53] <doko> xhaker: talk with man-di on #ubuntu-java
[08:54] <xhaker> thanks :)
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[08:54] <iwj> OMG it works and I'm going to upload it.  I wonder where all the bugs are ?
[08:55] <iwj> (it = dpkg-triggers)
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[09:06] <Seveas> iwj, scary... :)
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[09:17] <ion_> iwj: Yay!
=== ion_ high-sixes iwj
[09:18] <sabdfl> yowser
[09:18] <sabdfl> did we just drop dselect from main or from u-desktop?
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[09:18] <attunix> How do I install the ubuntustudio-desktop file? Apt-get gives me "E: Couldn't find package ubuntustudio-desktop."
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[09:19] <tkamppeter> pitti, you're back?
[09:20] <pitti> tkamppeter: almost, back in ten
[09:21] <iwj> ion_: It's just tricking me, I think.  I'll upload it and then tomorrow morning there'll be howls of protest in my inbox and irc client.
[09:21] <tkamppeter> pitti, doko has uploaded my newest s-c-p package. Now it is really nice, "Please wait" pop-ups and no non-redrawing freezes.
[09:22] <ion_> iwj: :-)
[09:23] <ion_> Perhaps i should document my thoughts about how the s-c-p UI should be improved.
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[09:24] <ion_> just for consideration.
[09:27] <bryce> \sh_away: great to hear - was reinstalling mesa what did it?
[09:27] <tkamppeter> ion_, report your s-c-p improvement suggestions as a bug on Launchpad. Tim Waugh is bug contact of s-c-p and so he will get notified immediately.
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[09:30] <tbf> what's the reasoning behind installing .la files
[09:30] <tbf> ?
[09:31] <Mithrandir> none, we should remove them from the face on the planet.
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[09:32] <tbf> Mithrandir: well: $ dpkg-query -S libgtk-x11-2.0.la
[09:32] <tbf> libgtk2.0-dev: /usr/lib/libgtk-x11-2.0.la
[09:33] <tbf> does gutsy still install them?
[09:33] <Chipzz> tbf: that's a bug; unfortunately, the .la files have to be removed in a specific order
[09:34] <Chipzz> iirc top-to-bottom
[09:34] <Chipzz> which means that a package like gtk+ which is very low in the stack will be one of the last packages to have that bug fixed
[09:36] <tbf> Chipzz: ah. ok.
[09:37] <verwilst> if i do an apt-get source linux-source-2.6.22, do i need to do a debuild?
[09:37] <verwilst> will that build all the kernels?
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[09:43] <pitti> tkamppeter: cool
[09:45] <tkamppeter> pitti, did you already go through the MIR for cups-pdf?
[09:46] <pitti> no, not yet
[09:48] <tkamppeter> pitti, I would like to close this blueprint before the UVF.
[09:55] <xhaker> hmm
[09:55] <xhaker> UVF for main and universe are simultaneous?
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[09:56] <shaya> what package does one report bugs in the live cd in
[09:57] <shaya> basically, it wont work reliably on my Abit IP35-Pro motherboard (P35 chipset) if it doesn't boot w/ irqpoll option
[09:57] <mjg59> shaya: kernel
[09:57] <mjg59> linux-source-2.6.22 (assuming you're testing gutsy)
[09:57] <shaya> yes
[09:57] <shaya> it dumps to the initrd shell
[09:57] <shaya> some sata errors that are hard  to catch w/o serial console
[10:00] <shaya> filing
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[10:02] <shaya> filed
[10:02] <shaya> if you need more info, feel free to ask
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[10:41] <verwilst> is there a way, during a debuild of linux-source, to build only 1 kernel
[10:41] <verwilst> ?
[10:41] <verwilst> now it's building all of them :)
[10:41] <verwilst> which will take ages
[10:42] <mdke> verwilst: maybe try #ubuntu or #ubuntu-kernel for that question
[10:42] <verwilst> okido
[10:42] <ijuz__> you can delete some config files
[10:43] <ijuz__> there is this directory with the config.generic and for other archs/cpu-arch just delete the ones you don't want
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[11:02] <alex-weej> mvo: are you sure you merged my patch into the new version of notification-daemon properly? i'm still getting the old pie chart with -ubuntu6
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[11:12] <mvo> alex-weej: hrm, it should be in, I can have a look tomorow
[11:12] <alex-weej> i just got the latest source package
[11:12] <alex-weej> changelog entry is there
[11:13] <alex-weej> same old 01_ubuntu_theme.patch
[11:13] <mvo> hmmmm
[11:13] <mvo> is the version on launchpad ok?
[11:13] <alex-weej> the version on launchpad?
[11:14] <alex-weej> i'm sorry i only see a package for feisty on launchpad
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[11:17] <mvo> alex-weej: I mean, the patch you added on LP is ok? its different and all?
[11:17] <alex-weej> that would have been a pretty big error on my half if i uploaded the old version... let's see
[11:18] <alex-weej> mvo: no it's right: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8822330/01_ubuntu_theme.patch
[11:18] <alex-weej> bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/notification-daemon/+bug/132512
[11:18] <mvo> alex-weej: ok, then it was my bad :( sorry for that, I will do a new version tomorrow
[11:18] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 132512 in notification-daemon "New pie chart code for the Ubuntu Notification Daemon theme" [Undecided,Fix released] 
[11:18] <alex-weej> mvo: no problem
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[11:46] <bo0bi3> hey ro0m
[11:52] <calc> asac: tested tribe-4
=== asac listens
[11:53] <calc> asac: its still hosed, i'm starting to think its the kernel
[11:53] <asac> calc: so wpa psk still doesn't work?
[11:53] <asac> or open net?
[11:53] <calc> asac: i tested using a recompiled version of feisty wireless-tools and wpasupplicant and even then it wouldn't work
[11:53] <calc> on an open net
[11:53] <calc> didn't work for a aes wpa2 either
[11:53] <asac> ok
[11:53] <asac> open net is known to be broken
[11:53] <calc> tribe-4 as is didn't work either
[11:54] <calc> for me to test the kernel though means i will need to actually install it (ugh) ;)
[11:54] <asac> so far i have received just one negative on wpa with broadcast ssid
=== ajmitch has been having issues with wpa psk & NM recently as well
[11:54] <asac> calc: http://ipw3945.sourceforge.net/
[11:54] <asac> read changes 1.2.1
[11:54] <asac> (we have 1.2.0)
[11:54] <asac> i think that will cure the open net scenario
[11:54] <ajmitch> asac: has this only been with ipw3945 so far?
[11:54] <asac> * Fix driver not make associate request when required
[11:54] <asac> * Fix iwconfig essid any doesn't associate problem
[11:54] <calc> asac: i also completely firmware reset both of my routers today for other reasons, so it shouldn't be an issue with them
[11:54] <asac> ajmitch: most issues we have are ipw3945
[11:55] <ajmitch> asac: ok, my ipw2200 problems may be different then :)
[11:55] <calc> asac: are we able to get an updated ipw3945 driver?
[11:55] <ajmitch> given that I was able to associate & get an ip address a couple of times
[11:55] <asac> ajmitch: i want to hear as much info as possible
[11:55] <calc> ajmitch: maybe... we don't know what is the causing the problem yet though
[11:55] <calc> ajmitch: i can occassionally get an address, but not today
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[11:56] <calc> ajmitch: its very uncommon for me to get an address under gutsy though
[11:56] <ajmitch> asac: at one point it was just repeatedly asking for the key, I haven't often been using my laptop at home though
[11:56] <asac> calc: I asked a few days ago in #ubuntu-kernel on how to prepare a test-package, but didn't get an answer
[11:56] <calc> ajmitch: seen that myself under gutsy tribe3 also
[11:56] <ajmitch> it had been very stable until recently
[11:56] <asac> calc: i will try mailing-list after feature-freeze
[11:56] <calc> should i be able to run the old feisty kernel on gutsy still?
[11:56] <calc> if so i can try doing that on this box
[11:56] <ajmitch> though my laptop went about 4-5 weeks without a dist-upgrade
[11:56] <asac> ajmitch: thats hard to say then
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[11:57] <ajmitch> asac: I can test again tonight
[11:57] <asac> ajmitch: a tighter regression window would be more helpful
[11:57] <asac> ajmitch: can you try to downgrade if you see the issues with latest?
[11:57] <ajmitch> which part? kernel, n-m?
[11:57] <asac> nm
[11:57] <asac> until you find that it works
[11:57] <ajmitch> ok
[11:57] <calc> too bad there isn't a way to install gutsy at a day granularity to go back and find when it broke
[11:57] <calc> would take a lot of disk space to keep that many debs around though
[11:58] <asac> calc: i think with vmware you could do daily snapshots
[11:58] <stgraber> asac: are you sure we are running 1.2.0 in current Gutsy ? (modinfo tell me : version:        1.2.1mp
[11:58] <stgraber> )
[11:58] <calc> i couldn't compile old nm on gutsy, but it fails with old wireless-tools/wpasupplicant even at the ifup level
[11:58] <stgraber> (and crappy copy/paste as usual)
[11:58] <calc> asac: how would i get the old daily snapshots though?
[11:58] <asac> stgraber: i am not 100% sure ... from what i know we have 1.2.0 + a backport of the security issue fixed in 1.2.1
[11:58] <calc> asac: i mean going back in time and getting old gutsy debs to track it down
[11:59] <asac> calc: you can manually get them from launchpad iirc
[11:59] <stgraber> oh, I would need to give 1.2.2 a try when I have a moment then
[11:59] <calc> asac: that would be very time consuming in case the problem isn't something we think it is
[11:59] <asac> calc: which version did you try to compile?
[11:59] <asac> stgraber: you sure 1.2.1 is 1.2.1?
[11:59] <guignome> a filesystem with versioning could maybe do that
[12:00] <calc> 0.6.4-6ubuntu7 <- i think it was that one
[12:00] <calc> i just recompiled current gutsy against old libiw since it didn't work
[12:00] <stgraber> asac: no, that's what modinfo tell me but the kernel guys can show whatever they want :)
[12:00] <asac> stgraber: yes ... from what source is that shipped from again?
[12:00] <calc> you know i'm going to verify that using ifup works on the feisty cd also
[12:00] <asac> stgraber: let me look into that changelog again
[12:00] <calc> since i haven't tested that yet
[12:01] <mdke> is the current daily-live reasonably usable?
[12:01] <mdke> anyone know?
[12:01] <stgraber> asac: it's in : linux-ubuntu-modules-2.6.22-8-generic
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[12:02] <calc> i'll be back in a few minutes, verifying that feisty cd works like i expect it to
[12:02] <asac> stgraber: thanks ... with s/-8-/-9-/ it works :)
[12:03] <asac> stgraber: hmm according to changelog of that its 1.2.1
[12:03] <asac> maybe 1.2.0 fixes things for us ;)
[12:04] <stgraber> asac: with -9 I have no suspend to ram :)
[12:04] <Lure_> asac: anything else I can do to help solve bug 126494 ?
[12:04] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 126494 in network-manager "wired network shown as disabled after boot" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/126494
[12:04] <asac> stgraber: if i read the changes for 1.2.1 on http://ipw3945.sourceforge.net/ they just look too much related to be a coincident
=== stgraber agrees
[12:05] <asac> 1. Fix driver not make associate request when required
[12:05] <asac> ...
[12:05] <asac> n. Fix hardware/software RF kill switch problem during module loading time
[12:05] <asac> i mean it reads like i read reversed bugs here ;)
[12:06] <stgraber> :)
[12:06] <asac> in about box on that page it reads:
[12:06] <asac> (any version ending in .0 is 'stable')
[12:06] <asac> maybe we are not supposed to use 1.2.1?
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[12:08] <stgraber> asac: what's feisty's version ?
[12:08] <stgraber> asac: 1.2.0 ?
[12:09] <asac> 1.2.0mp
[12:09] <asac> however i always received claims that feisty stopped to work with some upgrade
[12:10] <asac> s/always/also/
[12:11] <asac> stgraber: can you try?
[12:12] <stgraber> I'd need a livecd with latest feisty kernel on it to test
[12:12] <asac> maybe you can build modules with old ipw?
[12:13] <asac> in gutsy?
[12:14] <calc> asac: disregard my earlier report, i determined i was doing something wrong with feisty cd, testing on gutsy again now