[00:00] So noone knows then ? [00:00] * robert_ancell reads about GtkActionGroup [00:00] Corey: this is not really a place where people wold know [00:00] where would i found out then ? [00:00] hmmm [00:00] #ubuntu, maybe? [00:01] I also wish to know if in the next realise, maybe LAMP should should be pre-installed.... [00:01] #ubuntu I have tried [00:01] Corey: in terms of LAMP, that would be for the server guys, i would think [00:01] there is a product called Ubuntu server that is good for that [00:02] the desktop, not so much [00:02] Is there any wehre were you can put in requests for next editions [00:02] Corey: yes [00:02] rickspencer3: It appears you use them to logically group your actions, the example the docs give is having a group per document and joining all those actions together to make the menus. I've never used them though [00:02] Ubuntu has an open planning process [00:02] wheres that ? [00:03] Do you have the URL ? [00:03] https://wiki.ubuntu.com [00:04] Laney: i have an own version of that script running, the result is at http://217.11.53.243/new/versions.psp . it enhances seb128's version with comments. code available at https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~amoog/+junk/desktop-versions [00:04] Cheers I'll check it out [00:04] Ampelbein: Cool, I suggested that addition earlier [00:04] robert_ancell: I didn't find that doc, could you please me link? [00:04] but essentially, they are optional? [00:05] Laney: i don't know if that will work on people.ubuntu.com though. it needs mod_python enabled to dynamically generate the comments in html. [00:05] Ampelbein: find out how MoM does it? [00:05] rickspencer3: http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk/unstable/GtkActionGroup.html [00:05] rickspencer3: i guess so? [00:05] Laney: pretty much, yeah. the newcomment.py is "inspired" by MoM ;-) [00:05] then I'd guess it should be alright [00:06] robert_ancell: right, so I read through that, but it's not clear why you need actiongroups [00:06] I'll keep plugging, thanks [00:08] rickspencer3: let me know too :) [00:10] Laney: I'll have a chat with seb128 tomorrow, let's see what he thinks about it. [00:10] sweet [00:11] I guess I should do this update with a bzr merge [00:16] robert_ancell: I guess you nest actions in an action group element, but glade does not seem to support this :( [00:17] rickspencer3: it sounds like relatively new functionality. Probably don't want to mention it to quickly users [00:17] right [00:17] rickspencer3: We should probably make a cut down version of http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk-tutorial/unstable/ [00:18] except that I don't think we should tell people to use the DOM [00:18] I think you are supposed to inline XML [00:18] I think glade has not caught up with gtkbuilder yet [00:19] We need a gap document... [00:19] robert_ancell: do you think we should forget about actions and such for quickly? [00:19] just bind the controls right to signal handlers and forget all the action/action group stuff, I suppose [00:19] rickspencer3: yes, I think we should only mention basic functionality (let people find out about more advanced stuff themselves) [00:20] right, especially since the "advanced stuff" is totally half bakes wrt glade [00:21] rickspencer3: absolutely. Glade is aiming to support everything but it will take time [00:23] rickspencer3: Is there a wiki space for quickly? I think we need to write down what sort of applications a quickly user would create, then look at can we do that and how hard it would be [00:23] the whole system seems unnecessarily complex ... I think it should be a simple matter to build abstraction around it, but I just can't figure some of the stuff out [00:23] robert_ancell: please, be my guest [00:23] https://edge.launchpad.net/~quickly [00:24] you could add bluerpints and such [00:24] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Quickly [00:24] There's some strange relationships between actiongroups, actions, accellgroups, accellerators, and widgets [00:24] but no one has documented the relationship (that I can find) [00:25] just the interfaces for the individual classes [00:25] oh right, and accell paths [00:26] you need like six classes to set up simple key bindings [00:26] === asac_ is now known as asac === rickspencer3 is now known as rickspencer3-afk === asac__ is now known as asac [06:44] Good morning [06:45] kenvandine: they fit right now, but have zero i18n support [07:22] good morning pitti o/ [07:35] hey didrocks, bonjour [07:53] & good morning [07:53] hello crevette / [07:53] hey hey didrocks [08:02] morning everyone [08:10] Greetings everybody! [08:19] good morning there [08:24] hi seb128! [08:24] hey seb128 [08:24] hey didrocks [08:24] hey didrocks mvo [08:24] hello mvo [08:29] seb128: morning seb, check out the versions script.. [08:29] hello robert_ancell [08:30] seb128: my dear friend [08:30] seb128: I know you want to be my tester :-) [08:31] hey vuntz, yes? [08:31] robert_ancell, checking [08:33] * vuntz tests the bugs out of xephyr before using his seb128 joker [08:34] vuntz, what are you playing with? [08:35] just triaging some panel bugs [08:35] I can't reproduce http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=332054 and http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=570458 [08:35] Gnome bug 332054 in Panel "Autohide second panel at the top of the screen makes desktop icons jump" [Normal,New] [08:35] robert_ancell, trying to update but the server seems to not give any data today [08:35] ie it's hanging ... [08:35] ah, working now [08:36] waouh, lot of good work there! [08:37] :) [08:38] * seb128 run update to see the httml [08:38] html [08:38] waouh! [08:39] it's the one stop desktop shop [08:39] seb128: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=576865 is a bug in some Ubuntu patch, fwiw [08:39] seb128: can you update the online version, please? :) [08:39] Gnome bug 576865 in general "gnome-panel crashed with SIGSEGV in IA__gtk_widget_hide()" [Critical,Resolved: notgnome] [08:39] didrocks, pitti, mvo: http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/versions.html [08:40] seb128: I think you missed my last push, it gets the non GNOME stuff too [08:40] ^ check out, robert_ancell rocked today [08:40] nice [08:40] seb128: waow, nice ^^ [08:40] awesome! [08:40] the ordering is much better now, and bug links FTW [08:40] congrats robert_ancell ;) [08:40] robert_ancell: *hug* [08:40] thanks all! [08:41] robert_ancell, I've revision [08:41] 15 [08:41] what is the bzr command to list revision? [08:42] bzr log | less? ;-) [08:42] robert_ancell: list what? [08:42] I have 18 [08:42] did you push your changes? [08:42] pitti: list the revision [08:42] I pushed them as you were downloading. they seem all pushed [08:42] * seb128 pulls again [08:43] that's being sloooow today for some reason [08:43] pitti: what was the issue with the builds last night? [08:43] what issue? [08:43] robert_ancell: bzr log|head or bzr info -v [08:43] robert_ancell: new binutils was uploaded, should be fixed now [08:43] pitti: The logs were gone when I woke up so I couldn't see that the problem was with gnome-games [08:43] s/that/what [08:44] robert_ancell: I mailed you the two "real" FTBFSes [08:44] if there is no log that's because there is a new build? [08:44] the others were just binutils fallout and were retried [08:44] pitti: the links in the emails were dead [08:44] right, because of the mega give-back [08:44] robert_ancell: just delete them [08:44] the build logs are cleaned when the builds are retried [08:45] ok, bzr just hang on me today [08:45] * seb128 kicks launchpad [08:45] robert_ancell: you can ook at https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-games -> click on top version to get the current logs [08:46] pitti: i see now, thanks [08:46] *shrug*, 160 bug emails during the night [08:46] and -discuss is crazy too today [08:47] seb128: I think you can almost mark all of them as read... a lot of trolls... :/ [08:47] didrocks, I did go through those quickly yes [08:48] I'm pondering un-subscribing [08:48] the ratio signal noise is too high nowadays [08:49] fortunately, I have two hours a day of transportation, that enables me to do/triage this paperwork thanks to my gphone ^^ [08:49] urg, that's quite a lot [08:49] ok, launchpad doesn't reply, reconnection to see if that's an issue there [08:50] seiflotfy: "urg, that's quite a lot" -> Paris... ^^ [08:50] oupss, sorry seiflotfy [08:50] seb128: hm, bzr push hangs for me as well [08:50] pitti, ok thanks [08:50] robert_ancell, I will get your new revisions and update the page when they fix launchpad [08:51] seb128: cool [08:51] robert_ancell, anyway good job, the page looks much better now ;-) [08:51] robert_ancell, btw how do you get versions for non GNOME components? [08:51] I'm curious [08:51] didrocks, I thought you were working for cano, as I see you working a lot of time on packaging during the dauy [08:51] :) [08:51] you look to the upstream tarballs? [08:51] seb128: scan the pages for tarball names [08:51] seb128: messy but works [08:52] crevette: no, I'm just "effective" enough in my daily work so that people don't remark this :p [08:52] robert_ancell, you code the urls for each component in the source? [08:52] didrocks, make me think about my job before canonical ;-) [08:52] seb128: yes, each package has a URL. The GNOME packages all have the same URL and it uses vincents list instead for them [08:52] seb128: :-) [08:53] robert_ancell, ok good, I know about the GNOME versions I did this one ;-) [08:53] now we just need a way to run that script regularly somewhere [08:53] seb128: I think we should split the script into two so it can scan for upstream versions each day and scan for LP bugs each time it is run [08:53] I'm not sure where somewhere is yet though [08:54] robert_ancell, yeah I was thinking about something like that too, though maybe versions more often than 1 day on new GNOME days [08:54] agreed [08:55] pitti, mvo: any idea where I could run the versions script? [08:55] seb128: I'd use rookery [08:55] rookery can't connect to ftp.debian.org [08:56] seb128: works fine for me [08:56] weird [08:56] pitti@rookery:~$ wget http://ftp.debian.org/debian/README.html [08:57] $ lftp ftp.debian.org [08:57] lftp ftp.debian.org:~> debug 3 [08:57] lftp ftp.debian.org:~> ls [08:57] ---- Connecting to ftp.debian.org (130.89.149.226) port 21 [08:57] **** Socket error (Connection refused) - reconnecting [08:57] seb128: ah, I guess the firewall allows http, but not ftp [08:58] oh [08:58] ok, that's easy then ;-) [08:59] indeed, my experimental sources were using ftp, works when using http now [09:05] * pitti -> dentist, bbl [09:07] pitti, good luck [09:08] bzzzzZZZzz [09:11] robert_ancell - i assigned bug 388263 to myself. i already started it sometime ago, but it got sidelined due to other committments [09:11] Launchpad bug 388263 in gnome-panel "Update to 2.26.2, merge with Debian" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/388263 [09:12] * chrisccoulson thinks all that green is too bright for his eyes [09:13] chrisccoulson: cool, I started working but ended up a bit lost :) [09:13] robert_ancell - it's quite a lot of work [09:15] robert_ancell, ok, update works now [09:17] http://people.ubuntu.com/~seb128/versions.html updated [09:18] chrisccoulson: less green for you now :) [09:18] robert_ancell, maybe we could split the page in 2 tables? [09:18] there is some weird components you added there [09:18] ie poedit? [09:19] I dunno, I was just added stuff into extras that I had installed... I want to make the extras stuff invisible by default and have a toggle at the top of the page [09:19] or blender? [09:20] anyway it's already much better [09:20] we can do tweaking on the way if required [09:20] I will set a cron job today to update the list [09:20] We should look at poularitycontest and make the top installed stuff able to be shown [09:20] well, I think we have enough to do already [09:20] Absolutely, it's always a work in progress. [09:20] so we should probably limit that to components we work on [09:20] or have 2 pages, one for ubuntu-desktop and one for extra components [09:21] the other are nice to track but not a priority to work on for us [09:21] Sure [09:21] I tried to put everything in default_packages that is in the default desktop install [09:22] stupid question: where's the show desktop button on the default panel on ubuntu? [09:22] right [09:22] vuntz, top right corner? [09:22] hum [09:23] ignore me, I'm not sure [09:23] rather bottom left in fact I think ;-) [09:23] so like upstream? [09:23] yes [09:23] okay... So I don't understand http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=540147 :-) [09:24] Gnome bug 540147 in Show Desktop Button "show desktop on the left side" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed] [09:24] vuntz, the guy says he's using mandriva [09:24] yeah, but they said they were using upstream defaults... [09:25] asking to mandriva people now [09:25] bye all [09:25] robert_ancell, bye [09:28] seb128: maybe we should differentiate "open task" (opened bug, in progress state") and "ready to sponsor" (bug in triaged state) in versions.html? Because here, we have no clue that bug-buddy is actively updated bu huats for instance, and if he opened a bug, you don't know if it's ready to be sponsored or not. [09:28] didrocks, open a bug when you start on something subscribe sponsors when ready? [09:29] we can easily look for the sponsor team being subscribed or not [09:29] seb128: yes, also. We just have to put this information in the page. I can do it tonight. [09:29] cool [09:53] dpm, hello [09:54] dpm, could you have a look to bug #357678 and try to make sure it gets fixed in the next italian language pack update? [09:55] Launchpad bug 357678 in evolution "event time cannot be specified any more" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/357678 [09:55] it's a frequent issue for italian users apparently [10:02] if noone mind, I can take the metacity sponsoring [10:02] mvo, go for it, there is another update? pitti did an upload yesterday I think, check before if that was just a bug not closed or an another change [10:03] oh ftbfs fix, ok good [10:03] seb128: its one from robert, it was not commited yet, fixes a build failure [10:03] cool [10:03] * mvo uploads [10:03] mvo: hi [10:04] mvo: do you have a minute or five today to discuss something on third party stuff? [10:04] asac: sure [10:04] asac: phonecall? [10:05] mvo: yes. what time would be best (not right now please)? [10:05] seb128: hi, I'm reading the bug report right now... [10:06] dpm, thanks [10:06] vuntz - iwas thinking about taking a look at fixing gnome bug 164057 if no-one else is interested in working on it. what are your thoughts on how it should behave? [10:06] Error: Could not parse XML returned by Gnome: not well-formed (invalid token): line 76, column 27 (http://bugzilla.gnome.org/xml.cgi?id=164057) [10:07] ugh [10:07] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=164057 [10:07] Error: Could not parse XML returned by Gnome: not well-formed (invalid token): line 76, column 27 (http://bugzilla.gnome.org/xml.cgi?id=164057) [10:07] asac: after lunch? I don't really mind the time as long as its not too late [10:08] chrisccoulson, there is a bug which has a patch to add a gconf key somewhere [10:09] chrisccoulson, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=549788 [10:09] mvo: when is lunch in your world? [10:09] Gnome bug 549788 in Panel "Make MAX_ITEMS_OR_SUBMENU a gconf key" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed] [10:09] seb128: thanks, was just checking today; I have two followup sessions with real bzzzzzz now, though :/ [10:09] seb128, mvo: metacity yesterday was FTBFS, this will probably be the fix [10:09] so go for it [10:09] pitti, checking what? I switched context since I pinged you I think ;-) [10:10] chrisccoulson: no strong opinion. Calum's idea was nice, except that we'd need to put the most used locations inline. And we don't have the notion of "most used" [10:10] seb128: dentist [10:11] oh right [10:11] pitti, good ;-) [10:11] not so much for the bzzzzzz though [10:11] two ancient fillings need to be replaced [10:12] I will probably have some of those soon too [10:12] haven't been to the dentist for 3 years, was about time [10:12] indeed [10:13] I tend to go once a year for checking [10:14] *shrug*, users complaining about logout sound not working [10:14] pitti, I went there two weeks ago, didn't went to see him for 5 years (shame) [10:14] I was happy when i told me "no problem" [10:14] :) [10:15] lucky you! [10:15] seb128: feature! [10:15] pitti, "who cares"? ;-) [10:15] the hundredpapercut is creating lot of noise for sure [10:15] everybody claim having paper cut issues now [10:23] crevette: do you know http://www.blueman-project.org/ ? [10:23] thanks seb128 [10:23] asac, I heard of it [10:24] vuntz - yeah, i like calum's idea too. i don't know how you define "most used" either really though [10:25] also, the bookmarks menu collapses in the same way too doesn't it? [10:25] crevette: I think we need a package so we can test/compare [10:25] I seen a packaging in a PPA [10:25] crevette: i tested gnome-bluetooth and asked me about a few things, which blueman seems to have addressed [10:26] especially wrt to DUN networks [10:27] crevette: any clue about that PPA? [10:27] I confess I don't do networking with bluetooth, so I can't say :), my use-case is quite limited [10:27] https://edge.launchpad.net/~blueman/+archive/ppa [10:27] debian bug 448153 [10:27] Debian bug 448153 in wnpp "ITP: blueman -- GTK+ bluetooth management utility for GNOME" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/448153 [10:30] thx [10:30] brb [10:32] which team is owning UNR? is that us? [10:32] or mobile? ... or noclue? [10:40] asac: mobile [10:40] asac: so, David Mandala [10:42] thx [10:59] so, after a gpu hang and a reboot, my pointing device (trackpoint) is no longer detected :-/ [10:59] it seems to not be in hal anymore [10:59] there is no input device for it [11:01] seems like a kernel problem, but my kernel hasn't changed [11:01] scary. maybe you to powercycle your machine completely? [11:02] yeah, I'll try that [11:05] asac, yep, that fixed it [11:11] good. so i can get the latest bits without loosing my pointer ;). thanks! [11:11] * asac upgrades [11:19] crevette: seems we have blueman already ;) [11:19] https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/blueman [11:19] came from debian a few days ago [11:22] hm, today's live CD didn't build, because of empathy [11:22] http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/livefs-build-logs/karmic/ubuntu/latest/livecd-20090618-i386.out [11:22] kenvandine: ^ seems some more MIRs are in order [11:23] yeah [11:27] wow. so blueman is kind of impressive ;) [11:28] asac: better than gnome-bluetooth? [11:30] indeed, just looked at the screenshots === seb128_ is now known as seb128 [11:35] whiteboard change emails are the suck they don't tell you what changed [11:37] first time i have the feeling that bluetooth just worked (now we just need a better volume applet that covers more features from pavucontrol - like moving streams) [11:37] created a dialup network for my phone and it just showed up in NM ;) [11:37] do we know what is planned for the volume applet this cycle? [11:37] seb128: ? [11:38] asac: we will switch to the new pulseaudio upstream one [11:38] seb128: is that somewhere to test? [11:39] asac: sudo apt-get install gnome-volume-control-pulse [11:39] asac: are you speaking about the applet or the mixer dialog? [11:40] asac: gnome-volume-control-settings is the new upstream dialog [11:40] thanks. i will just check both [12:30] ugh, review queue empty once again [12:30] I think now I reviewed all karmic-targetted specs at least once [12:31] asac: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-audio-experience says we're going to use the puse-enabled mixer === asac_ is now known as asac [12:32] lunch o'clok [12:35] pitti: enjoy [12:35] * seb128 just back from lunch [13:02] pedro_: ola! [13:03] salut seb128! [13:58] crevette: I just checked the Debian/Ubuntu obex-data-server diff, looks like it's mostly just noise and we can sync [13:58] ah okay, true there is my name on it :) [13:58] * pitti is currently checking the merges list [13:58] I trust on you, go ahead !! [13:59] crevette: this is the only weird change: [13:59] + install -D -m 0644 $(CURDIR)/data/obex-data-server.conf $(CURDIR)/debian/obex-data-server/etc/dbus-1/system.d/obex-data-server.conf [13:59] ^ i. e. debian does _not_ have this line [13:59] my Q is, why does obex-data-server need a system d-bus configuration file in the first place? [13:59] isn't this per-user? [13:59] on the session bus? [13:59] there is both but we use session bus [14:00] crevette: do you care about this? if not, I'd just sync [14:00] I'm not sure I understand the impact, I would sync [14:00] * crevette hides [14:00] * pitti pushes button [14:00] and I'd blame filippo :) [14:00] it's all in bzr, so if we ever need the change, we just reapply it [14:04] pitti: I commented on desktop-karmic-bug-workflow [14:04] I'm not sure about the "needs info" button [14:05] ie should we really triage those bugs or just flag those as "need to get extra informations to be useful" [14:05] seb128: I think those details probably don't need to get firmly fixed in the spec anyway [14:05] ok [14:05] this power-triager-tool will be an evolving project anyway [14:05] otherwise the spec looks alright to me [14:05] seb128: thanks for review [14:05] you're welcome [14:06] it's a bit unfortunate that it mixes workflow with writing a new tool [14:06] right [14:06] but *shrug*, I won't fuss about the tool, as long as it does what you need :) [14:06] ;-) [14:09] didrocks: can you please check your vino merge? or whether we can sync? [14:10] pitti: there is a sponsoring request from Laney for that I think [14:10] hey rickspencer3 [14:10] seb128: hm, it doesn't appear on https://merges.ubuntu.com/main.html; other merges do [14:10] but maybe that needs to be done manually [14:10] hey rickspencer3 [14:10] rickspencer3: thanks for the burndown fixes, looks better now (http://piware.de/tmp/desktopteam-burndown-karmic.png) [14:10] hi pitti, hi seb128 [14:15] pitti, we should drop the recommends for elepathy-butterfly imho [14:15] kenvandine: that works for me, too [14:15] so we need the farsight stuff [14:16] pitti, i can't do it until the weekend though... actually taking vacation today/tomorrow :) [14:16] kenvandine: ah, enjoy [14:16] pitti, wanted to fill you in on u1 though [14:16] Guys query on empathy are you going to include the irc package for it or not as it isn't in by default currently? [14:16] kenvandine: doing an upload to drop butterfly then [14:17] ubuntuone-client and ubuntuone-storage-protocol is in REVU now [14:18] nice [14:18] pitti: why dropping butterfly? [14:18] kenvandine: ^ [14:18] Zdra, it brings in more deps, and haze seems to satisfy the need for now [14:19] pitti: kenvandine: not that butterfly in karmic is unusable, latest release fix most issues [14:19] Zdra, it didn't work last time i tried it :) [14:19] well... haze worked better [14:19] they just had a release yesterday I think [14:19] or the day before [14:19] Zdra, file a bug if you want us to reconsider that, and i will look at it after my vacation :) [14:19] Zdra, just assign it to me [14:19] * kenvandine needs to run though... later folks! [14:20] kenvandine: That's fine for me [14:20] well we don't need a strong decision on it now [14:20] we can play with both and see how they work [14:20] davmor2: telepathy-idle shold be there by default [14:20] kenvandine: in fact I'm looking for comparaison between haze-msn and butterfly [14:21] can versions.html be made to update more often? [14:21] kenvandine: In empathy we made the choice to privilege butterfly but we could reconsider [14:21] Laney: it's not made to update at all right now [14:21] pitti: I'm not seeing irc as an account option and idle is only suggested and not recommended [14:21] seb128: Oh, s/more often// then :) [14:21] Laney: still fixing some issues before having it running regularly [14:21] got it [14:21] unless that has changed [14:22] pitti: that's from upgrade I'm about to check a cd now [14:22]