PL9fwy3NUQKwZ52Wxrug71SHLnFjqhlVJc/Asntc6KqQXI_postprocess.srt

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Okay, good morning everybody. How are you? Yeah, I

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mean since I left you, I've been trying to

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diagnose why the sick was wrong, you know, why the

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rose was sick. And, you know, I have not reached,

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like, a certain diagnosis. So today, hopefully,

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you'll help me to tell me what made the sick, I

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mean, the rose very sick. Today, you know, we're

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going to continue discussing the poem, I mean, in

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terms of form. and in terms of imagery as well. So

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if we have some imagery, because I think we

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discussed the figurative

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language last time, did we? Okay, so let's do all

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of this together today, like we're going to look

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at everything today. And then we'll assign some

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time for symbolic interpretation. Okay. Oros thou

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art sick.

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Now, what kind of figure of speech is this? Oh

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Rose, thou art sick. Yes, please. It is a

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personification. Like the rose is perceived or is

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personified like a person who is sick. who's sick.

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Now, this is what we see in the poem. However,

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this is a multi-layer figure of speech. Like the

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rose itself, yes, it is like a person who's dead.

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But we ask ourselves, what does this rose stand

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for? So, you know, after all, it is a symbol. You

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know, we have symbolism. It is a personal

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vocation, oh rose, thou art sick. And you know,

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this personal vocation even is made clearer by the

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apostrophe, oh rose, thou art sick. The invisible

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worm that flies in the night, in the howling

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storm, has found out thy bed of crimson joy.

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Again, you know, the invisible worm is like what?

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Yeah, it's like an intruder, a person. This is

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another personification. An intruder who is

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invading the peaceful bed of the sick rose. has

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found out thy bed with crimson joy.

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Now, I think crimson joy, you know, what is it? It

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is oxymoron, because we have two contradictory,

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you know, ideas, two contradictory words. And his

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dark, secret love, it is a paradox. How come? You

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know, love is dark and secret. Does thy life

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destroy? So again, the rose is perceived like a

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person. If we are looking at the images, I think

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we have visual images, we have color images, we

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have kinetic images. Or roses that are sick.

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Usually roses are associated with which color?

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Red, oh rose, thou art sick. And red is always

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associated with emotion and passion. The invisible

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worm, the invisible worm. You know, the tricky

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thing, this is like, as we said last time, it is

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invisible, you know, but literally it is not

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invisible. So invisible, it is like, Yeah, one

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side of it, like it is there, you know, physically

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it is there, it has a shape, it has a form, but it

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is abrupt, it is invisible, we don't know, it is

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unpredictable, it is very precarious, very

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precarious. That flies, I mean, even if you look

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at the worm, the worm itself, has this disgusting

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form, shape, and its movement is slow. It is very

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slouching. But here, later, that flies. So it has

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both characteristics. It moves slowly. However,

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when it defines

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its target, it flies. And this adds more danger to

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it.

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In the howling storm, I mean, the night, of

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course, it is dark. So we have the image of

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darkness. It's a visual image. In the howling

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storm, we have a sound image, which, of course,

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onomatopoeia. And we, like last time, we imitated

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the voice. It was very funny. has found out the

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bed of crimson joy. Here, again, you have two

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visual images. Joy, you know, I mean, sorry. Joy,

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it's an abstract thing, but it's crimson joy. How

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come? How come joy is colorful? But we said, like,

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crimson also associated with, you know, pain. So

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we're talking about, you know, a crimson fever,

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it's fatal, painful joy. I don't think we have

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other images. Good. This is like what we call the

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special language of poetry, which we might need to

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use whenever we interpret. Now let's move to the

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meter, which is very interesting and I think It

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poses some challenge for us, like in the act of

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interpretation.

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Oros, as you see, thou art sick. You know?

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Oros, thou art sick. As you see, there is scansion

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here. Oros, You know, stressed syllables. It

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started by two. You know, the poem, if you know,

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the meter of the poem is, and his dark secret

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love, which is like anabast. It is anabast. Two

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unstressed followed by one stress. Like here, this

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is the meter. and his dark secret love and his

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unstressed, unstressed, dark, strict, secret, two

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syllables, unstressed, and then love. This is the

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meter. What is happening here? There is, you know,

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what they call substitution. Like sometimes, you

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know, the anabas is substituted by another meter,

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by iambic or a spondee as it is happening here. Oh

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Rose, now why? Why? This is like we have to

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answer. Oh Rose, thou art sick. Why it is too

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stress? See? Think about it. The invisible world,

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If you look at the invisible, it is here, the in,

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it is one syllable. So it is unstressed.

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The invisible worm, unstressed, the in,

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it's one syllable. If we look at it like this,

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V, N, you know, and then visible, you know, this

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is like iambic, you know, it is unstressed. Then

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you have visible, you know, visible, visible to

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unstressed, you know, visible, sorry, to

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unstressed, and then stressed. So anabast. The

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same is happening here. That flies, you know, that

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flies, that flies in the night, in the night, you

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know, it is أنا بس. So we have two iambic

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substituted here. Then here, as you see, it is

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again what? Yes, أنا بس and then iambic. So it is

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reversing. Has found out thy bed, it is the same.

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Has found, it is anabas, and then iambic. Of the

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crimson joy, this is the only iambic.

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So it's pure iambic of, as you see, of crimson

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joy. And then this is like, you see what? And it's

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dark. This is the pure anabas.

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So it is foregrounded. It is foregrounded. Does

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thy life destroy? It is, you know, similar to this

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line. It is too unstressed. It is unabashed

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followed by, you know, iambic. So what is this?

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It's really weird. It is strange. But usually in

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stylistics, we have something called

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foregrounding. You know what's foregrounding?

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Putting in the focus. You are taking stylistics.

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Today. Today. You are taking foregrounding. And

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foregrounding also is achieved by deviation.

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Because this deviates from the norm of the poem.

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These are the pure stylistic features. So what do

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you think? Why? Iambic has to do with melody, with

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musicality.

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Anabas has to do with sadness, subtlety, something

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like this. So what do you want to say? Why? And

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his dark secret love. He wants to evoke a certain

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mood. Yeah, he wants to?

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What mood do you think?

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Yes,

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I think here it's like the foreground is like

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because this is the most central. So we keep

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asking ourselves, how come? you know, is love

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which is always bright. It is very important, like

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to stress the importance. This is the most

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important line in the poem. Without understanding

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this, you will never understand any

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interpretation. I mean, you know, you'll never

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account very well for any interpretation. Your

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interpretation will be very weak. And his dark

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secret love, you know, look here, and his dark

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secret, you see, and his dark secret love does thy

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life destroy. You see, you have six syllables and

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it goes like this, and his dark secret love. You

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know, the riddle invites us to meditate, to think

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about this, and his dark secret love does die

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alive, destroy. But, you know, here again, why is

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it iambic pentameter? Yes?

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So even in the future we have violence. So yes,

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again, you know, you want to say like, the whole

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poem, the dominant atmosphere of the poem is like

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paradoxical. We have contrast, so this is part of

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the whole scheme, just giving us, you know,

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contrasting elements and inviting us to make sense

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of these contrasting elements. You see? Yeah, and

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those two lines, maybe he's doing the

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foregrounding. He's shedding light and focusing on

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these two lines, on the paradox and the axiom. The

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fact that there's something contradictory that we

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need to figure out. Yes. But let's go back to the

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beginning, you know. Oh, Rose. Oh, Rose. Why do...

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This is a spondee, what we call a spondee. Why?

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Oh, Rose, like... Oh, Rose. You know? Oh, Rose.

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They were sick. You know? It carries with it what?

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A sense of shock. Oh, Rose. They were sick, you

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know? They were sick. Look at the anabas. They

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were sick. Like you're shocked. And then you say

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with bitterness, with a sense of bitterness, they

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were sick. You see? I think we can account for

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this. We can account for this. But I don't want to

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go deeper. I just want you to see this is the most

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musical because we said like Ayambic, it is very

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melodious. So what does he say of crimson joy? Is

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he sarcastic? Is he sarcastic? Because this is not

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something which invites or which reflects an

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atmosphere of happiness, real happiness. So, given

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all these poetic aspects, I think it is very

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important, like, when we interpret, we take them

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into consideration. Yes, I want to say something.

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Yes, please. Since he started with A Rose Thou Art

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Set, we see that there is the, I think it is the

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conclusion of the whole story. So he started it

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from the end, and then he goes back to the reason

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why it is that. Yes. So I think for the five lines

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at the beginning of the story, there is a kind of

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infusion between the iambic and the anapasitic

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diameter. And then he started at the end to give

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us, I think, every meter alone. So here of Crimson

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Joy, it is the iambic one. So he has given us the

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reason. When it is so emotional, but it is, I

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think, a negative emotion. And this is what we

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mean by sarcastic. He's sarcastic. Yes, and then

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the other line, and his dark secret love, it is

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Anabaptistic also. So this is another conclusion

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for the first one, terms of joy, which is, I

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think, it is so destructive. Yeah, and it is the

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only Anabaptist here in the whole poem. It is the

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only Anabaptist. But it is the corner, I mean, it

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is the basis of the whole poem. Yes, very good.

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Yes, I like this is you know, the main reason

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Look, this is the value of having two teachers,

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you know, we're complementing each other. Okay.

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Yes It is here like to focus like to say yes You

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know, this is the main reason it is dark secret

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love Yes Okay, let's a little bit immersed in the

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symbolic interpretations. The rose, the invisible

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world. So we have two, you know, like two main

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symbols. Of course, we have the night, we have the

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howling storm, we have, you know, the bed. What

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else? You know, we have these things. So the rose

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stands for what? Yes? Nature.

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Nature. And they were? Industrial revolution. Can

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you tell me, like, can you elaborate a little bit?

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Do you agree with her, like, about this

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interpretation? Which is very strong. If we are

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looking back at the age of, you know, or the 18th

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century, let's say, you know, the age of Blake.

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Yes?

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Okay, let's say, yes, we do agree with you. The

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rose, you know, stands for nature, which was

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abused by? The industrial revolution. The

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industrial revolution, and we mean pollution, you

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know, and the smoke of factories, et cetera. But

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here, if you come up with this interpretation, you

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might need to look at dark secret love and the

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crimson joy. How?

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You see? You see. Okay. If you, like, you need to

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use these two images. Yes? Maybe it represents...

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No, let us stick to her. You see? Let us stick to

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her interpretation. How come, like, you know,

241
00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:38,840
this, you know, the industrial revolution... What

242
00:18:38,840 --> 00:18:41,140
does industrial revolution in nature have to do

243
00:18:41,140 --> 00:18:42,140
with dark secret love?

244
00:18:45,290 --> 00:18:47,830
Well, people were indeed like, they were crazy

245
00:18:47,830 --> 00:18:49,910
about industrial revolution. They were moving from

246
00:18:49,910 --> 00:18:52,670
the countryside. Yeah, excellent. They were really

247
00:18:52,670 --> 00:18:55,350
excited. They were getting into it. They were

248
00:18:55,350 --> 00:18:57,930
really involved. From the outside, you know,

249
00:18:57,990 --> 00:19:01,190
because it meant, you know, mainly the industrial

250
00:19:01,190 --> 00:19:06,430
revolution was meant to enhance the welfare of

251
00:19:06,430 --> 00:19:12,250
human beings. So ostensibly, it was for the

252
00:19:12,250 --> 00:19:17,010
service of humanity. But what happened, you know,

253
00:19:17,190 --> 00:19:20,570
like, but what is like what like whenever we have

254
00:19:20,570 --> 00:19:23,630
mechanization and whenever we have machines, do

255
00:19:23,630 --> 00:19:26,270
you think, you know, the main purpose of those who

256
00:19:26,270 --> 00:19:30,590
started like to enhance the, you know, to enhance

257
00:19:30,590 --> 00:19:36,690
the life of people or Yes. So most of these

258
00:19:36,690 --> 00:19:40,370
projects, you know, were just making money. And

259
00:19:40,370 --> 00:19:46,330
they might not care about the consequences. So

260
00:19:46,330 --> 00:19:48,910
those who invented the machines, okay, they

261
00:19:48,910 --> 00:19:52,210
wanted, you know, like mainly they wanted to make

262
00:19:52,210 --> 00:19:57,610
some money. Look in America, the North invaded the

263
00:19:57,610 --> 00:20:00,470
South because of money, because they wanted to

264
00:20:00,470 --> 00:20:04,170
sell their machines. I think also the war against

265
00:20:04,170 --> 00:20:07,810
Iraq was to sell, you know, weapons for, you know,

266
00:20:08,370 --> 00:20:15,550
yeah. So you see what I mean? Yes. From the

267
00:20:15,550 --> 00:20:20,630
outside, it was for you know, the service of

268
00:20:20,630 --> 00:20:24,070
humanity, but honestly, like the, if you look

269
00:20:24,070 --> 00:20:28,850
back, you might find that, you know, the real

270
00:20:28,850 --> 00:20:34,130
reasons were not like that. So, people are

271
00:20:34,130 --> 00:20:39,450
fascinated, again, crimson joy. You enjoy, you

272
00:20:39,450 --> 00:20:44,130
have the washing machine, you know, you enjoy how

273
00:20:44,130 --> 00:20:49,830
it is very fast, how it is very speedy. Yes, you

274
00:20:49,830 --> 00:20:53,750
might not be aware of like the hidden things, you

275
00:20:53,750 --> 00:20:57,150
know, in it. And then, I don't know, like, I'm not

276
00:20:57,150 --> 00:21:00,230
warning you, but everything is safe. But imagine

277
00:21:00,230 --> 00:21:03,070
it has, you know, something we don't know, it

278
00:21:03,070 --> 00:21:06,170
might be very dangerous. Yeah, that's why it's

279
00:21:06,170 --> 00:21:09,510
invisible more. Because it's a sight we don't

280
00:21:09,510 --> 00:21:12,850
really notice and we don't be aware of. Yes,

281
00:21:12,910 --> 00:21:14,510
because the invisible... That's why it's

282
00:21:14,510 --> 00:21:16,870
invisible. Because it looks good.

283
00:21:20,030 --> 00:21:25,710
Good. So if you want like this is how we need to

284
00:21:25,710 --> 00:21:31,570
warrant to justify our interpretation. These are

285
00:21:31,570 --> 00:21:34,630
very central to any interpretation. Let's move to

286
00:21:34,630 --> 00:21:39,410
another interpretation. Yes? It can be represented

287
00:21:39,410 --> 00:21:39,970
as

288
00:21:50,190 --> 00:21:51,630
Innocence. Yeah,

289
00:21:56,770 --> 00:22:02,450
we can say, you know, like the innocence of people

290
00:22:02,450 --> 00:22:06,860
because the countryside people were innocent. And

291
00:22:06,860 --> 00:22:11,780
when industrialization intruded the countryside,

292
00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:18,420
that innocence was lost. Even new values emerged,

293
00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:21,720
new materialistic values emerged. So the whole

294
00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:25,420
innocence was lost. And all of that was for the

295
00:22:25,420 --> 00:22:30,590
service of humankind. for what it works, like the

296
00:22:30,590 --> 00:22:32,990
sons of innocence and experience, for example, the

297
00:22:32,990 --> 00:22:34,670
chimney sweeper and the other one for the

298
00:22:34,670 --> 00:22:36,710
children. When they're innocent, they're playing,

299
00:22:36,910 --> 00:22:39,630
they're joyful in the countryside. And then when

300
00:22:39,630 --> 00:22:41,670
they go into the city, they become chimney

301
00:22:41,670 --> 00:22:44,950
sweepers and it becomes all about them. Yeah, so

302
00:22:44,950 --> 00:22:48,750
we have like transformation in, you know, human,

303
00:22:49,130 --> 00:22:52,470
in the values of society. Yes, please. According

304
00:22:52,470 --> 00:22:55,470
to the ruling characteristics of his age, like for

305
00:22:55,470 --> 00:22:58,470
their narcissism, he was against them, he was

306
00:22:58,470 --> 00:23:02,070
running for enemies and it was normal to him. But

307
00:23:02,070 --> 00:23:05,550
they were here about just like the society and

308
00:23:05,550 --> 00:23:07,650
like their nature and rules.

309
00:23:23,620 --> 00:23:29,900
So his poetry which was rejected Okay,

310
00:23:30,300 --> 00:23:35,740
so his poetry is like what? It's the sick rose and

311
00:23:35,740 --> 00:23:39,680
he's lamenting the fact that his poetry is not

312
00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:42,940
accepted You know

313
00:23:46,750 --> 00:23:49,470
It's a good idea, but it needs hard work to

314
00:23:49,470 --> 00:23:52,510
justify. You see what I mean? It's good. I like it

315
00:23:52,510 --> 00:23:59,390
very much. You know? Yes? It's the woman. Yeah,

316
00:23:59,530 --> 00:24:02,990
like this is what most of the critics would say.

317
00:24:03,510 --> 00:24:05,950
And sometimes I say it could be a man, this cross.

318
00:24:06,150 --> 00:24:09,430
Because if you are taking Judy the Obscure,

319
00:24:10,890 --> 00:24:16,410
Hardy's last novel, Judy was a man. You know, who

320
00:24:16,410 --> 00:24:21,950
was like destroyed by a woman. So you can look at

321
00:24:21,950 --> 00:24:26,710
this both ways. Of course, any illegal, any

322
00:24:26,710 --> 00:24:30,730
illicit relationship might lead to this

323
00:24:30,730 --> 00:24:34,230
destruction. Destruction of fame, destruction of

324
00:24:34,230 --> 00:24:37,620
reputation. And you know, we said last time,

325
00:24:38,000 --> 00:24:41,540
satanic things, satanic things, we as Muslims, we

326
00:24:41,540 --> 00:24:45,500
know we are immune against such atrocities, such,

327
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,380
you know, misbehavior. Why? Because we know how

328
00:24:49,380 --> 00:24:52,960
Satan usually decorates things, makes them

329
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:59,000
beautiful, you know, and then, like, makes people

330
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:03,690
fall in the snares, you know. It's a kind of You

331
00:25:03,690 --> 00:25:06,090
know, attraction, it's a kind of... And then what

332
00:25:06,090 --> 00:25:10,610
happens after that? Remorse, regret, and you

333
00:25:10,610 --> 00:25:13,530
know... Life destroyed. Yeah. So this is like the

334
00:25:13,530 --> 00:25:15,490
crimson joy, which is, you know, very terrible.

335
00:25:15,630 --> 00:25:21,690
It's very destructive joy. But I want to, you

336
00:25:21,690 --> 00:25:26,650
know, stretch it more. And we mentioned last time

337
00:25:26,650 --> 00:25:27,990
teachers and students.

338
00:25:31,510 --> 00:25:35,930
Does this like teachers and students? You are the

339
00:25:35,930 --> 00:25:43,210
roles, yes? You are the roles. And now not us, not

340
00:25:43,210 --> 00:25:47,190
other people, you know? Okay, and you can be vice

341
00:25:47,190 --> 00:25:53,550
versa. So how? How come? How come be like the

342
00:25:53,550 --> 00:25:57,690
students? Be like a rose, they are made sick.

343
00:25:57,750 --> 00:26:00,370
Maybe if they're corrupt, like sometimes when you

344
00:26:00,370 --> 00:26:03,170
talk about corrupted educational system, right?

345
00:26:03,510 --> 00:26:05,710
And you have like really bright students, but you

346
00:26:05,710 --> 00:26:07,870
have the system itself, the educational

347
00:26:07,870 --> 00:26:10,990
methodology, the teachers, everything is not

348
00:26:10,990 --> 00:26:13,590
really good, something that is actually harmful.

349
00:26:13,770 --> 00:26:17,530
It's destructive rather than instructive. The ways

350
00:26:17,530 --> 00:26:20,690
that they use are actually destroying the

351
00:26:20,690 --> 00:26:27,100
students' mentality, ability to think, the desire

352
00:26:27,100 --> 00:26:31,200
to learn, so it can be destructive. Yeah, and like

353
00:26:31,200 --> 00:26:33,220
how can... They go to schools and they're

354
00:26:33,220 --> 00:26:35,560
expecting to learn, but they end up hating

355
00:26:35,560 --> 00:26:38,400
schools. And when they, you know, these students,

356
00:26:38,540 --> 00:26:42,220
the same students might pass, you know, and they

357
00:26:42,220 --> 00:26:45,500
become very jovial, very happy, but when they want

358
00:26:45,500 --> 00:26:49,420
to go and find a job, you know, they don't. You

359
00:26:49,420 --> 00:26:51,200
know why? Because they were not trained very well

360
00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:51,800
for the job.

361
00:26:56,100 --> 00:26:59,940
holding and destructive ideas and beliefs from

362
00:26:59,940 --> 00:27:03,000
other cultures to destroy our own cultures and

363
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,440
beliefs. Yes, very good. And you know, all of

364
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:08,640
this, you know, is given the shape of progress,

365
00:27:08,980 --> 00:27:11,620
of, you know, wisdom, of fascination, you know.

366
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:12,300
Good.

367
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:22,320
Again, like parents and children. Parents and

368
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:26,960
children. If you spoil your children, it's joyful

369
00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:31,300
to be spoiled and to have all this. How come? Yes,

370
00:27:31,420 --> 00:27:33,940
yes. It's joyful, but at the same time it ends up

371
00:27:33,940 --> 00:27:39,040
being destructive also. You end up being alone.

372
00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:45,780
How would you characterize dark secret love? Do

373
00:27:45,780 --> 00:27:48,600
you think like parents might hold this kind of

374
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:52,520
love to their kids? Yes. Yes. Maybe when the

375
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:55,480
parents love their children very much, they will

376
00:27:55,480 --> 00:28:01,360
keep them in the house. There is no there is no

377
00:28:01,360 --> 00:28:03,140
when parents are

378
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,280
they go to the outside, they will find another

379
00:28:10,280 --> 00:28:16,340
word, not like the word they imagined in their

380
00:28:16,340 --> 00:28:19,480
mind. So they will destroy them. Yeah, I mean,

381
00:28:19,940 --> 00:28:22,660
overprotection, over love, this is what we call

382
00:28:22,660 --> 00:28:25,880
perverted love. Perverted love. You know what it

383
00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:28,180
means? Upside-down love. Perverted.

384
00:28:34,250 --> 00:28:37,490
And this could be one of the many themes of the

385
00:28:37,490 --> 00:28:42,790
poem. Perverted, it is upside down. How come? You

386
00:28:42,790 --> 00:28:47,910
know? Yes, you're right. If we tend to love our

387
00:28:47,910 --> 00:28:50,930
kids or even our students too much to the extent

388
00:28:50,930 --> 00:28:56,170
that we put up with their mistakes. We tolerate

389
00:28:56,170 --> 00:28:59,790
their mistakes. We don't care when they commit

390
00:28:59,790 --> 00:29:03,670
mistakes. So they develop and we always make

391
00:29:03,670 --> 00:29:07,250
available everything they need. We don't let them

392
00:29:07,250 --> 00:29:12,790
think or fret how to find like what they need. So

393
00:29:12,790 --> 00:29:17,800
they will develop into very dependent you know,

394
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,920
personalities. And this is like, we're harming

395
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:25,000
them, we're destroying them. When they go on their

396
00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:31,380
own, like in life, they will be unable to manage.

397
00:29:32,220 --> 00:29:35,780
You see what I mean? Good. What other

398
00:29:35,780 --> 00:29:41,740
interpretations do you have for this? So far we

399
00:29:41,740 --> 00:29:48,180
mentioned Nature and you know,

400
00:29:50,860 --> 00:29:59,860
love and pure love and what? I think if you love,

401
00:30:00,280 --> 00:30:03,940
you describe by jealousy. Very good. Yeah,

402
00:30:04,140 --> 00:30:07,560
jealousy. Nobody has talking about jealousy.

403
00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:13,180
Nobody has talking about, you know, talked about

404
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:22,360
Yes. No, I mean, hypocrisy, you know, the

405
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:26,840
hypocrites, sometimes friends, like two friends

406
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,520
who are, you know, one friend is making an

407
00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:34,380
advantage of the other. And this friend, like,

408
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:40,960
pretends to be a friend, but his, you know,

409
00:30:41,860 --> 00:30:47,060
motives are sinister. So you might find some

410
00:30:47,060 --> 00:30:53,620
people whom you don't see as pernicious. You don't

411
00:30:53,620 --> 00:30:59,600
see them harmful, but they are the invisible. They

412
00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:03,780
work very hard to destroy you. It happens. Some

413
00:31:03,780 --> 00:31:07,480
people are devilish. Evil is there. So we have to

414
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:12,140
be very careful. We have to, you know, make sure

415
00:31:12,140 --> 00:31:16,460
that the motives of those people are genuine, you

416
00:31:16,460 --> 00:31:21,300
know. Yeah. Yes, Hidayat, what do you want to say?

417
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:32,860
Yeah, which is the interpretation of life. most

418
00:31:32,860 --> 00:31:38,920
honorable interpretation of the parenthood. Okay,

419
00:31:39,060 --> 00:31:42,460
you like this interpretation. But here, yes?

420
00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:47,080
Another interpretation, when exaggerating

421
00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:53,380
confidence in someone. Confidence is a good thing,

422
00:31:53,500 --> 00:31:57,180
but when it arises in someone, it will destroy

423
00:31:57,180 --> 00:31:58,600
him. It becomes pride.

424
00:32:02,330 --> 00:32:08,410
Okay, so Blake wrote poetry which invited us to

425
00:32:08,410 --> 00:32:12,810
think, to imagine. And that was something against

426
00:32:12,810 --> 00:32:17,630
the expectation, the norm of the time. That, you

427
00:32:17,630 --> 00:32:20,490
know, was a revolutionary way of writing poetry.

428
00:32:21,010 --> 00:32:24,030
It is revolutionary. As you see, he's not

429
00:32:24,030 --> 00:32:27,330
following. And even the rhyme, it is, we don't

430
00:32:27,330 --> 00:32:32,290
have the heroic couplet. You see? So it is A, B,

431
00:32:32,470 --> 00:32:35,390
C, D, you know. We don't have the heroic couplet.

432
00:32:35,970 --> 00:32:39,570
We don't have the rules, you know, like the poetic

433
00:32:39,570 --> 00:32:45,150
diction. Okay? And it's poetry which invites us to

434
00:32:45,150 --> 00:32:51,170
think, to imagine. What is the theme? It's giving

435
00:32:51,170 --> 00:32:54,750
space to the reader. Yes. And what is he writing

436
00:32:54,750 --> 00:32:58,430
about? He's writing about, not Belinda, not

437
00:32:58,430 --> 00:33:02,690
Ashtiful, like great people. He's talking about a

438
00:33:02,690 --> 00:33:08,430
rose, a rose, you know? A simple, you know, plant,

439
00:33:08,990 --> 00:33:13,430
a rose. So, I mean, the topic or what is he

440
00:33:13,430 --> 00:33:15,850
talking about is simple, something drawn from

441
00:33:15,850 --> 00:33:22,130
nature. Now, I think this is a revolutionary way.

442
00:33:22,890 --> 00:33:27,650
As you see here, he is writing in a fashion which

443
00:33:27,650 --> 00:33:30,910
is not in agreement with the expectation of the

444
00:33:30,910 --> 00:33:39,730
time. That's why he was stigmatized as mad. But we

445
00:33:39,730 --> 00:33:48,040
cannot understand Blake until we, like, go through

446
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:53,840
other poems. And next time I think we're doing The

447
00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:57,020
Tiger. It seems like everybody's fascinated with

448
00:33:57,020 --> 00:34:04,560
The Tiger. Okay. So I think The Tiger is another

449
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:07,160
one. Did you teach any like when you were teaching

450
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:13,800
Blake? The Tiger? What did you teach? London. The

451
00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:15,940
Chartered Streets. Yes.

452
00:34:20,270 --> 00:34:25,270
The Tomb Sweeper, The Black Boy, The Lamb.

453
00:34:29,470 --> 00:34:36,530
Yeah, it folds. You see, the songs of innocence

454
00:34:36,530 --> 00:34:41,790
are the songs of experience. Like here, this is

455
00:34:41,790 --> 00:34:45,170
how he saw the word. He saw the words in

456
00:34:45,170 --> 00:34:47,630
dichotomy. But did he see there that they were

457
00:34:47,630 --> 00:34:49,450
complementary? The song of innocence? I mean

458
00:34:49,450 --> 00:34:53,150
innocence and experience? In what sense?

459
00:34:59,570 --> 00:35:02,190
Yes, in order to complete. Because he actually, in

460
00:35:02,190 --> 00:35:04,170
the sense of innocence, he is interested in the

461
00:35:04,170 --> 00:35:07,690
childlike vision. I think it is the innocence time

462
00:35:07,690 --> 00:35:10,310
of the children before they are getting corrupted

463
00:35:10,310 --> 00:35:13,830
by the experience, before they are becoming

464
00:35:13,830 --> 00:35:16,710
adults, and I think they are immersed in life and

465
00:35:16,710 --> 00:35:19,610
getting more experience in it. And then he came

466
00:35:19,610 --> 00:35:21,750
back to, I think- So does he mean by the

467
00:35:21,750 --> 00:35:24,610
experience, like, you know, the learning of the

468
00:35:24,610 --> 00:35:27,230
time, the religion of the time, which was full of

469
00:35:27,230 --> 00:35:31,520
hypocrisy? This is experience, the experience like

470
00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:34,760
which is spoiled, you know? And this is what made

471
00:35:34,760 --> 00:35:37,160
him, I think, you know, because he, you know,

472
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:41,160
Blake was confused during his time because he

473
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:44,160
looked at Christianity and those who were supposed

474
00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:48,400
to be, you know, like good people, virtuous people

475
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:52,340
were devilish, satanic, were corrupted. I mean,

476
00:35:52,400 --> 00:35:55,800
the church during his time was corrupted. And

477
00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:58,340
that's why he wrote something called The Marriage

478
00:35:58,340 --> 00:36:02,680
Between Earth and Heaven, I think, you know, in

479
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:05,460
which, like in the hell, like they were, you know,

480
00:36:05,500 --> 00:36:09,140
the good and the bad were walking hand in hand.

481
00:36:09,870 --> 00:36:15,430
Yes, it is very central, as we mentioned in his

482
00:36:15,430 --> 00:36:18,970
philosophy, that without contraries, there is no

483
00:36:18,970 --> 00:36:25,570
progression. Yes, Blake saw that we need

484
00:36:26,210 --> 00:36:29,290
experience, which represents order. We need

485
00:36:29,290 --> 00:36:32,250
innocence, but there should be a balanced

486
00:36:32,250 --> 00:36:36,010
relationship between them. Otherwise, if

487
00:36:36,010 --> 00:36:41,270
experience is too much, like in this, you know, so

488
00:36:41,270 --> 00:36:44,660
what happens? It leads to destruction. You know?

489
00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:47,460
And again, also the tiger, it leads to

490
00:36:47,460 --> 00:36:50,300
destruction. So there should be a kind of balance

491
00:36:50,300 --> 00:36:53,520
in order to have like a good human being. But

492
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:56,980
after all, this is, you know, a free voice. This

493
00:36:56,980 --> 00:36:59,680
is the voice of individual who is very creative.

494
00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:03,760
You know, we have a voice which was denied during

495
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:08,500
the 18th century. I'm going to teach them the

496
00:37:08,500 --> 00:37:12,660
tiger, tiger, tiger, burning bride. And this is

497
00:37:12,660 --> 00:37:15,400
next time we're doing. So I think the sick rose

498
00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:17,620
and the tiger are from the songs of experience.

499
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:20,540
Yes, experience. We're not teaching any other. You

500
00:37:20,540 --> 00:37:23,000
know, because this, we leave this to romanticism,

501
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:26,520
you know? Okay. Okay. Thank you very much for

502
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:29,300
listening to us. You know, do you have any

503
00:37:29,300 --> 00:37:31,500
question? No. Okay, thank you.