From: kennejs@a.cs.okstate.edu (KENNEDY JAMES SCOT)
Subject: Re: A universal RIGHT to bear arms? NOT!
Organization: Oklahoma State University, Computer Science, Stillwater
Lines: 73

nathan@laplace.biology.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette) writes:
>In article <1993Apr2.080842.3554@a.cs.okstate.edu> kennejs@a.cs.okstate.edu  
(KENNEDY JAMES SCOT) writes:
> gary@ke4zv.uucp (Gary Coffman) writes:
>> >In article <1993Apr1.173759.4636@cs.yale.edu>  
nathan@laplace.biology.yale.edu writes:
>> >>In article <C4sK5w.Lsr@ms.uky.edu> miles@ms.uky.edu (Stephen D. Grant)  
writes:
>> >>> nathan@laplace.biology.yale.edu (Nathan F. Janette) writes:
>> >> >
>> >>> >I suppose that's true if you maintain that AK-47s and AR-15s are hunting
>> >>> >weapons.  I think they are fun to "plink" cans/targets/random VC with,
>> >>> >but not suitable for "real" hunting.  
>> >>> 
>> >>>  Wrong. Both are legal to hunt with here in Kentucky. I have a picture of
>> >>>  a friend with a nice 8-point buck which he shot with his AR-15 rifle.
>> >>
>> >>I don't think many deer hunters would condone your friends choice of
>> >>rifle. 
> 
>> >I must agree with Nathan. As a deer hunter, I find it inhumane to use
>> >underpowered weapons for deer hunting. To kill cleanly with the little
>> >.223 requires extremely good marksmanship. Most hunting situations don't
>> >allow for "perfect" shots. Hunters should use sufficiently powerful
>> >weapons to drop the deer with a single hit to the chest. The 7.62x39
>> >from the AKS-47 or SKS is adequate to this task, having similar ballistics
>> >to the familiar 30-30, but the little .223 is very marginal. In the
>> >hands of the expert, or the lucky, it will do, but hunters really
>> >should have more respect for their quarry. 
> 
>> >Gary
> 
>> I'll agree that the popular 55 gr. loading for .223 rem.  is too small for
>> deer-sized game.  However, if you use a 70 gr. semi-spritzer or the Sierra
>> 63 gr. semi-pointed bullet this would be suitable (like any round,
>> you keep your shots within a reasonable range).  It would still be on the
>> lower end of what I'd consider acceptable performance, especially those
>> long distance shots out West hunting Monster Mule Deer.  The .223 rem. has
>> been declared legal for deer hunting in Oklahoma.
> 
>> The .223 is excellent for varmit hunting and pest control.  The AR-15 in
>> particular is well suited, given its heavy barrel and heat shielded foregrip.
>> Add a high-power scope, and you're in "Dog heaven".
> 
>> However, I don't think Nathan Janette was refering to the specific chambering
>> of the rifle in question.  Maybe he thinks self loading rifles have no
>> place in deer hunting.  That may (or may not) be his opinion, but many
>> sportsmen do use self loading rifles and shotguns.

>Wrongo, NRA man.  I was definitely referring to the round, not the
>auto-loading aspect of the rifle.  I have no problem with *responsible*
>hunting.  That doesn't include machine guns from choppers, but a semi is
>fine.  My uncle has bagged several deer with 12 gauge slugs.  I would prefer
>that a hunter use as much of the catch as possible, and I don't condone
>hunting for "sport" only. 

>IMHO, of course.  

Two questions:

1)  You asserted that both the AR-15 and AK-47 are not suitable for
   "real hunting".  If you have no problem with hunting, or using
   self loading rifles for hunting, why did you say this?  If not
   for deer, then what about other, smaller game?

2)  When did I get the nickname "NRA man"?  Notice I have never referred
   to you as "Janette" which you don't seem to like.  Do I get any
   super-powers, like Spider Man or Powdered Toast Man?

Scott Kennedy    Brewer, Patriot, and now NRA-Man, defender of Truth,
                 Justice, and the 2nd Amendment.

kennejs@a.cs.okstate.edu
