High schooler and creator of online magazine Rookie, Tavi Gevinson is busy fashioning a DIY media empire that speaks to teens. 
 
 Column One Tavi Gevinson rockets from Rookie to teen pop-culture heights High schooler and creator of online magazine Rookie, Tavi Gevinson is busy fashioning a DIY media empire that speaks to teens. 
 
 In her Beatlemania schoolgirl outfit — gray miniskirt, knee-highs and electric-blue suede shoes — Tavi Gevinson looks like any other fashion-obsessed teen as she wanders the crowded aisles of Los Angeles' American Rag Cie. 
 
 "I can't afford, like, anything here on my allowance," the 17-year-old says, scanning the store's horizon for any gems she might have missed. 
 
 She pulls out her iPhone and responds to a text. 
 
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 "My dad, he'll be here in about half an hour to pick me up," she says, heading toward a carousel rack of vintage-image postcards — "the one thing I actually can afford!" 
 
 Gevinson is decisive as she plucks out certain moody postcards and quickly discards others. When the wobbly rack catches on the carpet and fails to turn, the petite Gevinson lifts the metal display and firmly plants it a few inches away, where it swirls freely. 
 
 "There" she says sweetly. "I'll take these four." After paying, Gevinson tucks the cards away in her floral backpack. "Now, what were we talking about again?" 
 
 One can forgive the high school senior for being a bit distracted. After flying in from Chicago, she was up late the night before finishing an essay. But the assignment wasn't for school. It was the editor's letter for Rookie, the online pop-culture magazine she started when she was 15; now she oversees a staff of about 80. There was also a photo shoot this morning, followed by a meeting with her agent and then another whirlwind shopping trip in Hollywood. 
 
 She will appear at Skylight Books later to sign copies of "Rookie Yearbook Two," an annual print anthology of Rookie's best online writing paired with original content from the likes of Lena Dunham, Mindy Kaling, Judy Blume and singer-songwriter Grimes. The store expects an adoring mob of teenage fans for Gevinson, called "the future of journalism" by no less than Lady Gaga. 
 
 Part Tina Brown, part Dorothy Parker, the quick-witted Gevinson has the ear — and Tumblr accounts — of a new generation of young women. Not to mention the eye of the media, the fashion world and, lately, Hollywood filmmakers. 
 
 She was just 11 when she started the Style Rookie fashion blog out of her Oak Park, Ill., bedroom. Soon she was sitting on the front lines of New York's Fashion Week. Fast-forward to 2013: appearances on "Late Night With Jimmy Fallon" and "The Colbert Report," international speaking engagements and a role in the film "Enough Said" opposite Julia Louis-Dreyfus. 
 
 With more than 4 million page views a month, Rookie is emerging as a DIY multiplatform media empire of sorts for Girl America. 
 
 The goal has become to make people feel included, that they're cool enough or smart enough.” — Tavi Gevinson Share this quote 
 
 "I'd felt like there wasn't a publication for teenagers that was respected. Or that I, myself, or my friends could really relate to," Gevinson says, settling into a booth at the cafe next door to American Rag, her creamy skin, crimson lipstick and blond bob giving her something of a "Ghost World"-era Scarlett Johansson quality. She slurps her lemonade. 
 
 "One thing I'm very proud of is that Rookie has a lot of legitimacy in publishing and music journalism and fashion. As it's grown, the goal has become more to make people feel included, that they're cool enough or smart enough." 
 
 Rookie beginnings 
 
 The original Style Rookie blog impressed journalist Anaheed Alani so much she offered unsolicited help. 
 
 "She emailed me and said: 'I work at the New York Times, and I will quit my job to help you,'" Gevinson says. "It was clear we were on the same wavelength. She's now second in command and my partner in a lot of ways." 
 
 Alani, 43, now Rookie's editorial director, has no issues working for a teenage boss. 
 
 "Tavi's one of the best bosses I've had," Alani says. "My rule for bosses and therapists is they have to be smarter than I am — and Tavi completely fits that bill." 
 
 An instant success when it launched in late 2011, Rookie now boasts jewelry and makeup ads and hosts in-person Rookie events in cities across the country, such as an Urban Outfitters-sponsored road trip last year that included crown-making workshops — Gevinson feels her now-signature floral crowns show "a pride in one's girliness." 
 
 In addition to material from the site, the Rookie yearbooks feature exclusive interviews with major pop cultural figures such as Morrissey, Chris Ware and Emma Watson; they're juxtaposed against personal essays by teens on universal issues such as sex, racism, friendship and feminism. 
 
 Boiled down, Gevinson's message might be "embrace yourself" — and it seems to be resonating. 
 
 "She's really, really popular with L.A. girls," says 16-year-old Xulani Akel, a sophomore at Los Angeles Center for Enriched Studies. "It's so amazing that she's so young and so successful. I'm worried about getting, like, one B, and she has this whole company thing that she's doing and that she really enjoys. That sets the bar really high!" 
 
 Fans at a bookstore 
 
 Skylight Books is filling up. The teen girls filter in, some wearing brightly colored floral headbands, others in swingy skirts and glittering prom crowns. Most carry a certain dog-eared book tucked under their arms as they swing between intensely focused and bubbling over with excitement. 
 
 Like a religious pilgrimage, many come bearing gifts cradled in their arms for Gevinson, who at the moment sits in the store's office loft, overlooking the main floor. Chitchatting with the two Rookie contributors who will be reading with her tonight, Gevinson looks very much her age. 
 
 "This'll be fun. Who wants to go first?" she asks them, as if the event were an impromptu school talent show. 
 
 Moments later, however, when Gevinson takes the podium before a now settled-in crowd of about 150 rapt girls, she is preternaturally poised as she faces the crowd. She holds her iPhone out in front of her with two hands, as if it were stiff essay paper, and reads off the screen in an adult, measured tone. 
 
 How is she able to ingest so much pop culture daily, interview her heroes, blog prolifically, write essays for Rookie and oversee her staff — all while attending high school? It's simple time management, she says earlier in the day, at the cafe on La Brea Avenue. 
 
 Gevinson spends nearly every sliver of downtime listening to podcasts or music — most recently Lorde, Taylor Swift and Kanye West — while walking to school, for example, or watching old episodes of "Freaks and Geeks" and "My So-Called Life" at night. Study hall, she says, is a perfect time to read other books she finds more relevant in the long run, like "Girl Power" by Marisa Meltzer. 
 
 Such efficiency, however, is not without sacrifice. 
 
 "There are compromises," Gevinson says. "Like there have been times when my grades have suffered or I can't visit my boyfriend when I'd like to because I have a number of interviews that day. But it's worth it." 
 
 Still, Gevinson's parents have made sure to keep her life "full of normal teenage stuff," says her father, Steve. She attends the local public high school and recently got an allowance increase. She doesn't yet earn a salary from Rookie — though that may change soon, he says, as the site becomes more profitable — and speaking engagement fees go into her savings. The total sum of her liquid assets from day to day is her allowance: $25 a week. 
 
 She left the room and I said, 'I want her.'” — "Enough Said" director Nicole Holofcener Share this quote 
 
 "It's a nice little fiction that we're living out because she has this bank account," he says. "But she likes living that way. We like her living that way." 
 
 Like many proud "pop culture nerds," Gevinson has a not-so-subtle obsessive streak. She might get up at 3 a.m. to rearrange all her books, she says, and not only journals her life's every happening, from monumental to mundane, but also "curates" her peripheral pop culture experiences to match her moods. 
 
 "Sophomore year I had my heart broken by a boy. I loved the feeling of heartbreak with dressing in nightgowns from the '70s, lighting candles and listening to Heart and Carole King," she says. "I documented it all. It's like making a bunch of little movies. It makes me feel like I'm in control and everything has a place in the world." 
 
 These days, Gevinson's mood is often a mix of excitement and trepidation. She's awaiting graduation in May and has applied to New York University, Barnard, Brown and Wesleyan — though she'd like to take a year off first to live in New York and focus on Rookie as well as other creative ventures, such as acting. 
 
 "Enough Said" director Nicole Holofcener has no trouble envisioning Gevinson as a movie star. 
 
 "Tavi walked in [to auditions], this little lovely thing, an angel with red lips and pink cheeks," Holofcener says. "She was maybe more nervous than someone who's been in a million films, but that nervousness was so natural and vulnerable and sweet. She left the room and I said, 'I want her.'" 
 
 How does all this high-profile success translate in the halls, on an everyday basis, at school in suburban Illinois? 
 
 Stirring the straw in her lemonade, Gevinson plays down her success, insisting that most kids at her school are either unaware of her growing fame or they don't particularly care. 
 
 Suddenly, three eager heads poke out of a nearby booth, their hands waving furiously at Gevinson. "Hi, Tavi!" they squeal in unison. "We love you." 
 
 Gevinson shrugs and breaks into a little-girl smile herself, giggling at the absurdity. "Oh, I guess they recognize me," she says. 
 
 On her way out of the cafe, Gevinson pauses at the door. 
 
 "I just hate 'voice of a generation' stuff," she says, balking at the suggestion. "You put someone on a pedestal and of course they can't represent all of feminism or all people their age or whatever." 
 
 And with that, Gevinson scurries out to the parking lot to meet her dad, her books and notes for the evening's reading bundled in her arms. 
 
 Contact the reporter 
 
 Follow Deborah Vankin(@debvankin) on Twitter 
 
 Follow @latgreatreads on Twitter ||||| Rookie is an online magazine and book series for teenagers. Each month, a different editorial theme drives the writing, photography, and artwork that we publish. Learn more about us here , and find out how to submit your work here ! 
 
 Rookie is no longer publishing new content , but we hope you'll continue to enjoy the archives , or books , and the community you've helped to create. Thank you for seven very special years! ✴ 
 
 Although she had no music out at this time last year, by now Lorde requires no introduction. Seventeen years old, from New Zealand, with a richly hushed voice that she lays over minimal beats—you’ve heard all this. You’ve probably also heard her portrayed as some kind of alpha-Daria. According to one YouTube commenter (I SWEAR I WASN’T READING YOUTUBE COMMENTS, THIS ONE WAS ALREADY AT THE TOP OF THE PAGE), “She’s like that awkward-ass girl in the back of your class lol.” According to many of the writers who have profiled her, she’s the patron saint of Weird Girls Everywhere. 
 
 What these people don’t realize is that her reach goes far beyond a very hip sect on Tumblr. In fact, Lorde’s song “Royals” was #1 on the radio for nine weeks straight. Her debut album, Pure Heroine, got her four Grammy nominations. She is not niche. She is huge. But despite the commercial and critical success of her music, and the fact that she was signed to Universal at the age of 13, Lorde is continually portrayed as an underdog. Adult journalists tend to see only “edgy”-looking outsiders in the backs of classrooms identifying with her music, and totally miss the fact that hordes of snapchatting normies understand her, too, and vice versa. This is not only because they tend to underestimate Lorde’s ability to appeal to the masses. They also underestimate the capacity of “normal” teenagers to appreciate thoughtful, unflashy music. 
 
 Sure, Lorde dresses like a witch and drips with sarcasm in interviews. Her best-known song denounces the materialism that other artists show off, and other ones say things like, “I’ll let you in on something big: I’m not a white-teeth teen.” But they also declare, “I’m little, but I’m coming for the crown. I’m little, but I’m coming for the title held by everyone who’s up.” And “We’re bigger than we ever dreamed, and I’m in love with being queen.” And “I’m doing this for the thrill of it, killing it, never not chasing the million things I want. And I am only as young as the minute is, full of it, getting pumped up on the little bright things I bought.” Do not for one second mistake her stoicism for self-deprecation, or think it’s only goth girls who relate. 
 
 The album is a delightful cluster of such contradictions: Lorde is content with the world she’s created for herself but eager to make waves in the one outside. Bored by the suburbs but endlessly in love with them. Critical of the other songs on the radio but wondering if she’s any better (follow up a listen to “Royals” with “Still Sane”: “Only bad people live to see their likeness set in stone—what does that make me?”). 
 
 It’s also insanely beautiful. A thorough listen feels like driving with shadows shifting across your face, quiet and thoughtful, in a car full of rowdier friends. Lorde elevates her suburban experiences to the level of mythology, becoming an empress surrounded by hounds, marking underpasses as her territory. She fixates on blood and veins as well as on the simple wonder of connecting with someone and wanting to experience everything with them. You can tell by the sound of her haunting voice that she means every word, and that she knows she’s on the edge of erupting, as if to say: I’ve been taking notes and keeping secrets, and I want to share them with you now. 
 
 I met Ella (her given name) in October, after we’d both discovered via online interviews and social media that we shared a mutual admiration (she’s a Rookie!), so this interview got pretty conversational, but I liked that we could talk to each other as peers. We gave it a try on the night we met, but we were on a noisy restaurant rooftop and my recorder wasn’t working. (I was also nervous about meeting her and embarrassed when she called me out for humming “Royals” under my breath subconsciously.) (She was nice about it.) (It is a really catchy song.) She was generous enough to agree to a do-over last month, and we talked for over two hours on Skype. She addressed, among other things, the pervasive line that journalists dole out about her: “While I dress and talk somewhat differently from other people whose songs are in the Top 40, I feel like more people dress like me than the media makes out.” Instead of letting a few random sartorial choices narrow our expectations of music and music listeners, let us appreciate what Lorde’s popularity says about all sorts of people, which is the only way to describe her demographic. And let us see what she has to say for herself, right here. 
 
 TAVI: How does it feel to be home right now? 
 
 LORDE: It feels really good. I’m definitely not on holiday yet—I’ve been writing outlines for what I want to happen onstage for the tour and the next music video and this, like, big TV performance I’ve got coming up. It’s not work, per se, but—yeah, work. 
 
 I’m curious, because I love what I do, but it is also a job, and everyone at times doesn’t like their job. What do you do when it starts to feel too much like work? 
 
 Often I’m able to work on my own timeline—I’ll give myself enough time that if I don’t feel like doing something, I can wait and do it a few days later or whatever. 
 
 That’s good. I want to start out by saying that what I want to do with this is…I’m in a unique position in interviewing you because we’re the same age– 
 
 Holla. 
 
 And I feel like everything I read about you is like grown men writing— 
 
 Oh my god, that tweet you made where you were like, “She laces her Converse…” I was like, “This is so accurate!” There’s a definite viewpoint of the think piece by an adult writing about kids. 
 
 "She giggles, lacing her Chuck Taylors. She may be famous, but she's still just a kid." -end of every profile of a well-known young person — Tavi Gevinson (@tavitulle) November 4, 2013 
 
 It’s true! The end is always like, “She does [this childlike thing] but she also does [this adultlike thing]. Whoa!” 
 
 Mine is “She squeals…” 
 
 Yeah! That’s what I’d just read when I wrote that! Or, no, it was a profile of Saoirse Ronan where they were like, “Then she’s just a kid in her Keds…” 
 
 [Laughs] Yeah, so terrible. 
 
 So I just want this to be, like…a lot of our readers really relate to you, and I want this to be for them. Not music-journalism-y or about “the pop music landscape.” 
 
 Aw, yeah, yuck. Well, this is fun! ||||| Rookie is an online magazine and book series for teenagers. Each month, a different editorial theme drives the writing, photography, and artwork that we publish. Learn more about us here , and find out how to submit your work here ! 
 
 “Whoa, impressive taste for a teen-girl mag!” 
 
 This comment, in one form or another, often gets directed at us on Twitter, especially on Friday nights, right after we post our weekly playlists. It’s also something I hear a lot in real life when I tell people—especially grown men—who I write for. “Wow!” they’ll say. “Good work, ladies!” Their surprise might be based on our staff’s working knowledge of punk rock history (yes, we know who the Wipers are) or on the fact that Rookie’s articles are actually thoughtful and well written, but it’s always condescending and insulting, and never itself much of a surprise. 
 
 I know I’m coming dangerously close to generalizing about ALL men in the exact same way I’m complaining that SOME men generalize about young women. There are, of course, many male critics who celebrate teen-girl fandom and our voices as cultural consumers and analysts and don’t roll their eyes when we gush about 1D or whatever. Thank you for that, dudes. But because men have more power across the board than women in our culture, they get the message, from birth, that their opinions about things are the Most Important Opinions. Whether they choose to believe this is up to them, but rejecting it is a lot harder than sitting back and enjoying it. 
 
 So I can hardly blame the many, many adult males who seem to have this cute assumption that all girls are dying for their approval of our cultural tastes, though we never actually asked for it. And I guess it’s kind of understandable that they might assume we have shitty taste—but I still don’t totally understand their need to vocally criticize us for liking the things we like. When Tavi posted a link to an excerpt of her Taylor Swift piece for The Believer, a highly detailed and laborious work of pure love for Swift’s music, a male cartoonist called her out for liking what sounded to him like “the soundtrack to getting a froyo and then stopping at Target for a new pair of Crocs.” Not that she asked him! 
 
 When I wrote a long piece for Buzzfeed about discovering Animal Collective and falling in love with them as a 12-year-old girl, dudes in the comments section made fun of my musical taste! Apparently my enthusiasm and knowledge meant nothing, because this band’s music wasn’t on the sacred list of Music Men Approve Of. And that’s just one example in a long history of criticisms lobbed against me and my apparent TEEN TASTES! Once, I was talking to an older male friend about the brilliance of Mean Girls, and he kept dismissing it as an airheaded comedy “for teens.” Obviously, he hadn’t seen it, because I think we all know that Mean Girls is a classic for people of any age. It wasn’t until I told him that the movie was written by Tina Fey that he seemed willing to reconsider his first reaction. Because 30 Rock is cool, but young women are NOT. 
 
 When you applaud or critique a young girl’s taste based on how well or badly it aligns with yours, you are suggesting that your taste = THE RIGHT TASTE, because you are the one IN THE KNOW. I sometimes rate movies on the website Mubi, and I can’t count the number of times an older male cinephile has urged me to rewatch a film I’ve given a low score to, because obviously I “didn’t understand it” the first time around. “How do you even know about this?” they sometimes ask. “You weren’t even born when this movie came out.” Dude: I have the internet. 
 
 This kind of cultural superiority complex extends to the makers of culture as well. For evidence, look at almost any piece written by a grown man about a young female artist. Here’s one: When Jody Rosen wrote about T. Swift for New York magazine, rather than ask this funny, smart, world-famous young pop star anything interesting about her work or her views on the world, he pitted her G-rated pop against Beyoncé’s and Rihanna’s more risqué work and let us know that Swift has never “writhed across a stage wearing a negligee, or less.” Rosen found Swift “witty,” “despite her public persona.” Because, what, cute girls can’t be funny? He marveled at the mostly female crowd at her concert for a full paragraph, but was careful to point out that there were “creepy dudes from Oklahoma” among the screaming young females, to illustrate…what? That Swift is so versatile that she appeals to both (a) females and (b) male creeps? The whole piece came across as the work of someone deeply out of their element. I mean, he described the male gaze as an “old feminist bugbear.” Why is this the person who was assigned to the Taylor Swift story? 
 
 Following the U.S. premiere of Chris Lilley’s television show Ja’mie: Private School Girl, which has Lilley playing a highly exaggerated mean-girl archetype, several think pieces popped up to criticize not the show itself (even though there was plenty to legitimately criticize, as a few smart writers did), but rather…the sorry state of REAL YOUNG WOMEN in the world. In one such article on The Atlantic’s website, Jake Flanagin took a look at a work of over-the-top campy fiction and posed, in all apparent sincerity, this question (about real people!): “Why are young women turning into monsters?” I repeat: monsters. Ooh, scary! I’m sure we’re a big threat to straight white men who write for magazines like The Atlantic, what with all our dangerous selfies and Snapchats and sexts. Flanagin went on to wonder whether the average viewer was smart enough to tell that the show is satire: “Presumably, Lilley poses this array of amusing insecurities and prejudices as a critical device, not face-value comedy,” he sniffed. “But it’s difficult to say whether the audience can discern the difference.” 
 
 As a member of that audience and a teenage girl (aka future monster), I’d like to ease his fears, at least on that last point: Teenage girls know that Ja’mie: Private School Girl is satire; it’s by Chris Lilley, for god’s sake. Have you ever met a teenage girl, Jake? We don’t act like Ja’mie. Just like how you, a guy in his 20s, don’t act like Van Wilder. Or so I assume (insert a thousand winks here). 
 
 I know I have a vested interest in this whole thing because I’m an aspiring cultural critic and a current young woman, but I think I speak for all girls and women between the ages of 13 and 19 when I say that grown-up male journalists are probably not the best choice to assign stories about teen-girl culture to (keeping in mind those aforementioned exceptions). What they come up with, too much of the time, is a lot of off-base and frankly clueless speculation about what girls think, what we do, what we want, and what we need. 
 
 It’s not these dudes’ fault that they believe they know everything. They were raised that way. But they really don’t know much about us at all. Here’s a tip for them: Next time you’re musing as to what girls are all about, try to shut up and listen. ♦ ||||| TRANSCRIPT 
 
 Tavis Smiley: Good evening from Los Angeles. I’m Tavis Smiley. 
 
 Tonight, a conversation with Emmy-winning, Golden Globe-nominated, and Oscar nominee, actor Benedict Cumberbatch, who’s currently starring in the film, “The Imitation Game” which tells the story of real life British mathematician and pioneering computer scientist, Alan Turing. Turing was a key figure in cracking Nazi Germany’s Enigma code which helped the allies win the Second World War. 
 
 We’re glad you’ve joined us. A conversation with Benedict Cumberbatch coming up right now. 
 
 [Walmart Sponsor Ad] 
 
 Announcer: And by contributions to your PBS station from viewers like you. Thank you. 
 
 Tavis: “The Imitation Game” has been hailed by critics as one of the year’s best films. Benedict Cumberbatch–I love that name. Can I say that again? Benedict Cumberbatch, of course, stars in that film as Alan Turing, a key figure in cracking Nazi Germany’s Enigma code which helped the allies, of course, win the Second World War. 
 
 Cumberbatch is no stranger to viewers of PBS’s Masterpiece for his brilliant work in “Sherlock” which he’s filming right now. Well, not right now. He’s here with us right now, but will be when he leaves here. Before we start our conversation, let’s take a look at a scene from “The Imitation Game”. 
 
 [Clip] 
 
 Tavis: I was whispering to Mr. Cumberbatch while the clip was playing that Keira Knightley who’s been a guest on this program a couple of times was wonderful in this as well. I was just saying that she is pregnant, as we saw at the Golden Globes. I had to congratulate you ’cause you’re pregnant as well right now here. 
 
 Benedict Cumberbatch: Thank you. Not me personally, but yes [laugh]. 
 
 Tavis: Yes [laugh]. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yes, the couple are doing fine in that department. It’s great. 
 
 Tavis: Congratulations on that. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Thank you. Thank you very much. 
 
 Tavis: And congratulations on this wonderful film. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Thank you. Thank you very much. I’m really quite proud of it. 
 
 Tavis: Wonderful, wonderful film. In preparing for our conversation, this is the first time we’ve met, I was reading in a number of places that your parents didn’t really want you to do this. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Not really, no. And I sort of saw it firsthand why, you know. It’s a very odd peripatetic, crazed, out of your control work and social schedule. It’s very hard to plan a family life, let alone know where the next paycheck’s coming from. 
 
 So they worked very, very hard as my parents, but also as actors to afford me an education whereby I had the opportunity and the privilege to be able to try and channel myself towards other goals. 
 
 You know, I wanted to be a barrister because there’s definitely a crossover, especially in criminal law with trying to persuade an audience of jurors and a judge of the case and your client’s story. 
 
 So I did go down that road for a little bit and I think they would have been very happy if I’d ended up there. But I just met so many people who gave me the same story. It’s over-subscribed, you can’t control your pay or your private life. I mean, there was so much that was a similar sort of set of problems. 
 
 I thought, well, why am I giving up on my primary dream for a very odd career, really even more competitive career in many ways than being an actor and not pursue my dream. So I did and, you know, much to Dad’s selflessness as a man and I have to echo that one when my time comes to be a dad. 
 
 He said to me in a car park after a play I’d done at Manchester University when I was student there, he said, “You’re better now than I was or ever will be”, which is a huge thing for a man to say to his son. 
 
 He said, “I think you’re going to have a great career and I can’t wait to watch you and support you.” I was like, my God. So the primary motivation for me in my life is to make them proud. I love them both very much. 
 
 Tavis: You said two things I want to go back and pick up if I can. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yeah, sure. 
 
 Tavis: Number one, so we’re off and running now [laugh]. Number one, barrister, thespian, barrister, thespian. You laid out clearly before why you could see your parents didn’t want you to do this, given the challenges that actors have. But in your life, in your mind, in your heart, what made the difference? What made you make the transition? 
 
 Cumberbatch: I think that it was something that was just sort of naturally in the blood that I was surrounded by and sort of in an environmental way and nurturing way, as well as a sort of nature way. 
 
 You know, the acting community’s a very small but intimate familial group of people and I was enthralled by the company my parents kept. I was enthralled by the work I was lucky enough to see them do at close quarters. 
 
 You know, some smart teacher at school thought wisely that, if you give the classroom show-off some responsibilities, give him some lines to learn, some other actors to cooperate with and compromise with and give them a focus and an objective for their unruly energy, good things might come about and, thank goodness, they did. 
 
 So I was saved from being just yet another pest in the classroom to my poor teachers’ ever-decreasing patience. But given these wonderful roles, I just took off at school. I really enjoyed it, really enjoyed it, so I’ve become that. 
 
 Tavis: The second thing I want to follow up on, and it really struck me when I heard you say what your father told you ’cause it made me think about my own dad. I’ve been trying my whole life and I’m still not there yet to be half… 
 
 Cumberbatch: To please your father? 
 
 Tavis: Not just to please him. I want to please him, but I want to be half the man that my father was or is. My father, you know, raised 10 kids, only five of whom were his, but he took in five other kids. He worked multiple jobs. I mean, my father’s just a remarkable man for what he did to raise all 10 of us… 
 
 Cumberbatch: He sounds it. 
 
 Tavis: In the way that he did. So I’ve been struggling my whole life. I’m 50 now and still not there yet to be half the man that he is. 
 
 Cumberbatch: I’m sure you are, but with different objectives and goals. You know, you’ve got different obstacles in your life. 
 
 Tavis: Oh, you’re kind. I’m working at it. But I was struck when I heard you say your father looks at you and says to you, “You are better now than I am.” How do you process your father giving you that kind of accolade? 
 
 Cumberbatch: Well, that really, I just had a massive outbreak. It was a very emotional moment for us. 
 
 Tavis: It had to be. 
 
 Cumberbatch: You know, I already felt unqualified and unconditional love from them from the beginning of my life until that point. 
 
 Tavis: Do you have siblings? 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yes, from my mother’s first marriage, I have a half sister, Tracy, who I adore. But there’s an 18-year age gap, so we didn’t grow up together, but we’re very, very close. So I am the only child of that marriage, of my mother and my father’s marriage. I obviously crave what you don’t have. I wanted brothers and sisters. Everybody else, all my friends would say, “You don’t know how lucky you are.” 
 
 Tavis: I got nine. You want a couple? I can loan you some [laugh]. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Exactly. You’ve got some to go around, yeah [laugh]. I have friends in the similar position and it’s like, you know, big families, you really have to fight for your place at the table and I didn’t. You know, my place was there. But, you know, I wanted to capitalize on that. I think what I’m saying, though, about going back to how do you process that. 
 
 Emotionally, it was just overwhelming and then you process it as, right, well, now I have a duty to that promise and that level of sacrifice and humility. I have to honor that and that gives you a great, great sort of motive for your work ethic and for how you go about living your life, I hope, and to honor dad’s faith in me. That’s one of my driving motivations. 
 
 Tavis: I want to go back to this barrister, thespian. I’m still noodling on this. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Noodling? 
 
 Tavis: Yeah… 
 
 Cumberbatch: Good word. 
 
 Tavis: On these two routes that you could have taken. So you were abundantly clear earlier, Benedict, about what you hoped to accomplish, had you gone the route of being a barrister. So what did you hope to accomplish, what do you hope to accomplish as a thespian, as an actor? 
 
 Cumberbatch: To have longevity, really. To have a career that stretches, you know, to the great ages that some of our most celebrated and brilliant men and women still manage to work in. 
 
 I think I only really set out with wanting to make a living out of it, yes, but to continually sort of evolve as an artist and challenge myself and get better, you know. Just keep failing better, keep failing upwards, I guess, in falling upwards. 
 
 Tavis: Samuel Beckett said that, yeah. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Samuel Beckett, yeah. Fail and fail again and fail better. It’s all of that. It’s an imperfectible art form. We’re imperfectible as a species, let alone as actors sort of portraying that species. So, you know, I’ve got so much to learn and so much more, I hope, still to give. 
 
 So while this is an amazing moment, the word moment sort of has a tinge of dread about it for me because I didn’t ever project to this point. I didn’t project to award ceremonies. I projected to getting opportunities to do good work, but not necessarily in films. It could have been in television or theater. 
 
 All I ever really saw was a long game and a career of longevity. I think the only other goal was a measure of respect from my peers for doing it the right way, I suppose. Yeah, and have fun with it as well and not take it too seriously. 
 
 Tavis: How do you define–I promise we’ll get to the movie in a second, but you got me going. So I’m going to follow you. 
 
 Cumberbatch: No, no, no. Do this. 
 
 Tavis: How do you define doing it the right way? 
 
 Cumberbatch: Well, you know, just the sort of grass root basics, I think. You know, being respectful, being approachable, knowing your craft, doing your homework. I’m still working on being good at being on time all the time. I’m still working on being perfect with lines. 
 
 I do seem to get quite a lot of them, but nevertheless, you know, that’s something that I’ve always found difficult. I always found it difficult to learn lines. Yeah, well, just creating an environment that’s fun for everyone to be a part of rather than just being about you. God, the list goes on, but I’ve learned from the best. 
 
 I’ve worked with the most extraordinary people in that regard, as well as my parents, but people like Judi Dench and the extraordinary cast I work with on “Sherlock”. All of them to a man or woman are just exceptional in every one of those roles. You know, there’s a huge support working that and it’s a happy place to be. 
 
 Tavis: That seems a serious work hazard, though, being an actor and having trouble learning lines [laugh]. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yeah, yeah. 
 
 Tavis: Are you sure you made the right choice? Are you sure the barrister isn’t calling you? 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yeah, you’re right, you’re right. 
 
 Tavis: You sure got no lines as a barrister. 
 
 Cumberbatch: You have to learn quite a lot by rote for being a barrister as well. There’s a hell of a resource you have to carry around inside your head as well as being able to improvise an argument in the moment or situation. You have to carry the might and truth and fact of the law in your head. 
 
 So they have their version of lines, as we all know from court and those closing speeches and all the rest of it. So I think my work would have been cut out and would be just as stressful for me there as it was for my chosen profession. 
 
 Tavis: So I’m working my way to “The Imitation Game” and one more stop along the way. We get right into the film ’cause I love the film. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Thank you. 
 
 Tavis: When you saw this–let me start with this. You mentioned the award season and how you really hadn’t factored all this. Well, you’re in the middle of it. I mean, you’re nominated for this and nominated for that, and all the ceremonies. I saw you photobombing. Was that Meryl Streep? 
 
 Cumberbatch: I couldn’t resist. 
 
 Tavis: Did I see that picture? 
 
 Cumberbatch: I mean, I got asked… 
 
 Tavis: I saw a picture of you photobombing Meryl Streep at the Golden Globes? 
 
 Cumberbatch: It’s outrageous. It’s like I’ve got no respect for the woman. It’s very much opposite. No, I just thought I’d get down on the thing. It was happening right in front of me and, you know, it was a sort of ongoing satirical nudge that everything North Korean related in the recent year of Sony’s trials. 
 
 I thought, I can’t. You know, you’re dangling a carrot way too close to me. They knew what they were doing [laugh]. I think Meryl knew I was there. I think they knew… 
 
 Tavis: The photo looked like you were having fun. I only raised it because how are you navigating your way through all of this process of award season? How you handling it? 
 
 Cumberbatch: To have fun. I mean, it’s odd. I went online just now which is a very dangerous thing to do in my line of work or life or whatever. It’s just an odd place to engage with and I rarely do. But I went online because I wanted to see–I literally was off a plane. I literally got off a plane onto the red carpet literally about an hour after landing. We were delayed an hour in London. 
 
 Anyway, a real sort of, you know, skin of the teeth moment. Get there, literally meet John on the red carpet. We had a rough idea of doing it as if I’d been picked at random by Amy and Tina, or they’d have that idea, rather. They scripted the idea. 
 
 But, you know, we didn’t rehearse it. I didn’t know where my mark was, didn’t know who I was going off, who was going to have the envelope, didn’t know if there was–I didn’t know anything about the machinations, nuts and bolts of it. 
 
 So, you know, that first bit was just sort of really nerve-wracking. I just sat down in my seat. I was just going, “Was that all right? Did we hit the right note?” And I was just looking now backstage trying to see a clip of it and, before I even got to the clip, there’s this whole review of me and award seasons, my strategy. I’m like, look, I leave that to the Weinstein Company. 
 
 I’m happy to be at the forefront of a film of a very quiet man who would have hated anything to do with this. And the reason why I enjoy it is because it gets into talking about and ensuring this exceptional human being who is shy, diffident, awkward, never really fitted in, I’m sure, into any of the sets that he should have done. 
 
 And to be able to stand up front and say this man who died too young is a gay icon, war hero and the founder of modern computer technology and programming is somebody who should be on the front cover of history and social textbooks as well as science books. He should be on the back of bank notes with Charles Darwin and Isaac Newton in the U.K. He’s somebody, great cultural and political and historical and scientific importance. 
 
 So this award season for me–I’m very proud of my work, really proud of it. I don’t mind if I’m the guy who’s the bridegroom and someone else is the bride. I mean, Eddie is a really good friend of mine, so I’m happy to applaud that man’s work. He’s phenomenal… 
 
 Tavis: Eddie Redmayne from… 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yeah. So all this sort of thing about strategy. What’s he going to do next? Somebody said, “I’m going to dedicate the award to my child.” I couldn’t think of anything more disgusting. And the idea that this is life, it’s not, you know. 
 
 I’m working in London playing Sherlock Homes. I’m in the middle of doing the Christmas special. So I’m here for a day and I go home. It refocuses you. It is all about the work. And let’s not forget the other performances like David Oyelowo and Steve Carell. I mean, just incredible performances. 
 
 Tavis: I did not realize until I was reading for our conversation, since you mentioned Eddie Redmayne who did win the Golden Globe in the category that you were in for playing Stephen Hawking, is it true that you played Hawking? 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yeah. 
 
 Tavis: You played Hawking in another project. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Which is a slightly weird hall of merit aspect. I know these are framed as well. But I only played him up to the point that he gets his doctorate in the great paper he wrote reversing the idea of a black hole into a big bang potential. 
 
 So I did it out of a point of singularity, the universe could have been born, this incredible science of Einstein that was made beautiful again by this paper, this really young, brilliant mind that was already crippled by motor neuro disease and that wonderful moment in his life. So I can watch from afar, but there is a way of really… 
 
 Tavis: Yeah. 
 
 Cumberbatch: It’s odd, yeah. 
 
 Tavis: So I am a long way from being the brightest bulb in the box. 
 
 Cumberbatch: I wouldn’t say that. 
 
 Tavis: But it is always arresting for me to go see a movie like this movie and have had no clue about the subject matter. 
 
 Cumberbatch: I know. 
 
 Tavis: I just had… 
 
 Cumberbatch: Why I’m saying that is because I had the same thing. I had the same reaction. 
 
 Tavis: I felt like stuck on stupid that I had no idea. I use a computer a bunch every day, had no idea about Alan Turing. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Well, not enough people do and that’s sort of a double tragedy not only of his demise and how he was treated by the very government that he helped save. But at the end of reading that script, the emotional impact of the story was raw, but also the feeling of anger and frustration. 
 
 This man hadn’t achieved the recognition that he deserved in his too-short life and, you know, it’s a very weighty responsibility when you’re portraying somebody who existed, whose legacy is important to his family, to the gay community, to the science community, but also to people who’ve yet to meet him. 
 
 You know, this is the chance to shine a bit of a light on somebody and engage people in our version of the story and ask people to investigate obviously a very complex man in a fuller way by reading Andrew Hodge’s beautiful, very detailed biography which the script is based on and beyond into Turing’s work. I don’t know. That was a guiding, really strong fuel, well, for all of this, but also for wanting to play the role in the first place. 
 
 The anger I felt, the injustice of how unknown he was in comparison to the scale of his achievements and suffering. It’s like you’re not alone. I mean, I felt the same, and a lot of audiences seeing it for the first time feel the same. 
 
 Tavis: Because you starred in it and I’ve already seen it and loved it, we jumped so fast, I should probably ask you to back up for a second and just tell a little bit about what the story is about. I love it, yeah. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Of course, of course. It’s a story about this very extraordinary mathematician who applies for a job to work at Bletchley Park which was undercover operation for code-breaking in the Second World War. 
 
 And it’s about him building a machine to try and break the German Enigma code using an algorithm, funny enough, that’s still employed now with Google search engines. I mean, this guy’s legacy continues well into our lives and beyond. 
 
 And it’s a story of the kind of pressure cooker environment, this point in the war. The islands of Great Britain was under siege. We were having ourselves starved. We had merchant navy ships with supplies being sunk by German U-boats. We had to crack the code to get an intelligent step ahead. 
 
 And in conjunction with that, we learned about the puzzle of Alan and, as the sort of thriller aspect and the humor of seeing this sort of slightly awkward, diffident, non-team player kind of come into the group with love and trust and collaborative work very much through Keira Knightley’s character, Joan Clark, thawing this pressured and protective man, you see this extraordinary human being evolve and you jump back to what he was as a young man when a lot of his most formative experiences happened. 
 
 Tavis: I’ve talked to so many actors over the years who have had the honor, the opportunity, to play historical figures, some dead, of course, some alive. Turing, of course, as you said, dead too soon at the age of 41. And yet, when I saw you in this film, I thought what a wonderful gift you were given. I mean, you gave us a gift with your wonderful acting… 
 
 Cumberbatch: Oh, thank you. 
 
 Tavis: But what a wonderful gift I think you were given to enlighten us about someone that we knew nothing about. It can’t get much better than that. 
 
 Cumberbatch: No, it can’t. So when you’ve got material that hooks you from the first page, Graham’s script is extraordinarily deft and humorous and nuanced and complex, thrilling, funny, moving. I mean, wonderful ingredients to play with as an actor and a filmmaker. 
 
 All of us had a great, great time with our parts and all of the parts in the film deserve their own film, by the way. I mean, incredible characters in the story of Bletchley Park. But this particular man at the center of it all, you know, he’s rendered in such a vivid, unapologetic, non-vain, frank manner from the very first encounter that you see a little bit of in that clip. 
 
 You know, he’s single-minded, has a complete irreverence for figures of authority, wants to do things the same way. He’s very funny and casually kind of gauchely very pedantic with language. And there are miscommunications which are both funny to laugh with him and/or laugh at him slightly because of his, you know, misfit status. 
 
 And out of this evolves this incredible story of an outside hero who is as relevant now as he ever was then. It’s a very extraordinary story rendered in a very brilliant script. So, yeah, it really was a gift of a role and I got hooked in, like I said. From that first page, Graham had me. 
 
 Tavis: I mentioned earlier that PBS audiences know you well… 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yes, they do. 
 
 Tavis: And love you for your work in “Sherlock”. So tell me how that’s going right about now. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Very proud to be up here. It’s going well. We’re a week into doing a Christmas special which will be out this time, well, Christmastime, I suppose, next year. And I’m gunning for a dual transmission date so we don’t pretend that Christmas happens later in America that it fell to the U.K. We have that possibility at the same time by our little lag of a couple of hours. 
 
 I really want that to happen because it’s become such a sort of communal thing, this moment of whenever we air one of the programs. It’s got such a kind of loyal fan base around the world. I mean, it’s huge. It’s alarmingly big, but it’s exciting. And, yeah, we’re doing a great show. It’s gotta be a corker. 
 
 Tavis: To your point about it being loved around the world, you must clearly be aware that the PBS audience in this country–I mean, I don’t know that you could put anything on our air that is not British born, British based that the audience would not love. 
 
 Cumberbatch: I know… 
 
 Tavis: So what is it about what you guys are drinking in the water over there that seems to work so well over here? 
 
 Cumberbatch: I don’t know. We use our consonants a little more than you guys do [laugh]. Clipped accents. We know how to do a table setting at a formal estate dinner. 
 
 Tavis: “Downtown Abbey”, “Sherlock”. I mean, you name it, yeah. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Listen, you know, much is made of the you and us kind of thing. Even looking at that map over there, it’s not that big a distance anymore. I mean, the global village makes it instantaneous and I think the appeal is the same as why American cultures always appealed to us, you know. 
 
 Tavis: It’s gotten so bad now–let me say this again ’cause I don’t want the viewers to take this out of context. It’s gotten to the point–and I’m not even denigrating this… 
 
 Cumberbatch: Your work is huge, like… 
 
 Tavis: It is, but now it ain’t even just white Brits. It’s Black Brits who are taking jobs now. You look at the “Selma” script. You look at “12 Years a Slave”. I mean, I love all these actors. They’re wonderful, but you guys are coming over here just taking over, man. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Well, it’s an even playing field [laugh] which is we all stand in our tights under the same conditions. I can’t speak for David Oyelowo, but those are two actors who work and live here as well, you know. They paid their dues for years by just beautiful, beautiful performances from very fine actors. 
 
 And I think as long as we pay our subs and our taxes over here when we work camp, I think it’s fair game. I mean, you know, Meryl Streep can come over and play Margaret Thatcher. Why can’t we come over and play in your sand pit, you know? 
 
 In all seriousness, I know what you’re saying. I think as far as colored actors go, it gets really difficult in the U.K. and I think a lot of my friends have had more opportunities here than in the U.K. and that’s something that needs to change. 
 
 Lenny Henry who’s a real force for good for many, many reasons, a brilliant actor, comedian–I was about to say chariter. That’s not a word–an amazing figurehead in raising money for Africa through comic relief. You know, he’s rightfully launched a campaign to keep it in check ’cause something’s gone wrong. 
 
 We’re not being represented enough in our culture of different races, and that really does need to step up a pace. I don’t want to get involved in any debates about that, but it’s clear when you see certain migratory patterns that there are more opportunities here than there are in the U.K. 
 
 Tavis: We recently had Ava DuVernay on this program who directed “Selma”. 
 
 Cumberbatch: What a wonderful film. 
 
 Tavis: I raise that only because one of my favorite movies of 2014, she sat in this chair. Speaking of Black Brits, Amma Asanta, who directed “Belle”. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yeah, yeah, it’s a great film. 
 
 Tavis: What a beautiful film. 
 
 Cumberbatch: She was fantastic in it as well. Really beautiful performance from her. I mean, I live not far from that property where she… 
 
 Tavis: Where she filmed that? 
 
 Cumberbatch: Yeah. Well, the whole story, where the story happens. 
 
 Tavis: Sure, sure, sure. 
 
 Cumberbatch: So I was aware of it. I said, God, why isn’t this being made into a film? Almost not finishing my sentence before the person who was telling me about it said, “It has. It has. It’s coming out.” Oh, thrilling. 
 
 Tavis: I love the name. I’ll say it again. Benedict Cumberbatch stars in not just “Sherlock” for Masterpiece fans here on PBS, but he is the star of “The Imitation Game”. It is a wonderful film. If you’ve seen it, you already know that. And it’s gonna get more buzz as this award season continues on. But it’s wonderfully done. I’m honored to have you on this program. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Thanks. Thanks for having me on. 
 
 Tavis: Thank you. Congrats on the baby and all that good stuff. 
 
 Cumberbatch: Thank you very much. 
 
 Tavis: Come back whenever you can. 
 
 Cumberbatch: I’d love to do that. Thank you. 
 
 Tavis: That’s our show for tonight. Thanks for watching and, as always, keep the faith. 
 
 Announcer: For more information on today’s show, visit Tavis Smiley at pbs.org. 
 
 [Walmart Sponsor Ad] 
 
 Announcer: And by contributions to your PBS station from viewers like you. Thank you. ||||| (Jürgen Teller/Courtesy of Céline) 
 
 If there are any doubts that smart ladies are the new rock stars, one need to look no further than the latest Céline ad shot by Jürgen Teller. 
 
 It features none other than writer Joan Didion as the new face of the fashion house. Didion is the acclaimed author of, among other works, “Slouching Toward Bethlehem,” “The Year of Magical Thinking” and, most recently, “Blue Nights.” 
 
 It would seem designer Phoebe Philo has long been a Didion admirer, given this shot of model Daria Werbowy channeling a portrait of Didion with her Corvette Stingray. Her philosophy of providing sophisticated, fuss-free clothes dovetails perfectly with Didion’s much-admired simplicity. 
 
 “I guess there is a bit of a political statement behind Céline, which is that we should be teaching young girls to feel good,” Philo said in a rare interview at last year’s Vogue festival. “I am not a big fan of women being sexualized through clothes, as you can probably tell from my work. I have no problem with a woman wearing anything as long as she has chosen to wear it for herself.” 
 
 Didion’s reputation for effortless cool precedes her. At 80 years old, she is as much a part of the zeitgeist as ever. The much anticipated documentary of her life, “We Tell Our Stories In Order To Live,” received more than double its initial goal for its Kickstarter campaign. And, as Jessica Morgan, one half of the blogging duo who produce the Go Fug Yourself style blog, pointed out, Didion has always been chic. 
 
 
 
 Didion in 1977. (AP Photo) 
 
 “I am delighted by the fact that Joan Didion is the new face of Céline,” Morgan said in an e-mail. “As a native Californian, of course I think of her whenever the Santa Anas start to blow, and ‘The Year of Magical Thinking’ is one of my favorite books ever. She is one of my favorite writers. And obviously, Didion has always been super chic — anyone who’s ever seen that iconic Julian Wasser portrait of her leaning against her Corvette knows this — so it’s not really that crazy of a choice, if you really think about it. But there is something incredibly satisfying to me to see a brilliant woman of her age being the face of such a major fashion brand. Essentially, it is so refreshing to be reminded that chic doesn’t have an age limit. (And smart on their part, as older women generally have more cash to blow on gorgeous bags and coats, too.).” 
 
 But there’s something else being signaled by Céline choosing Didion: the idea of women writers and intellectuals as the new cool girls. 
 
 When she swanned into popular culture after her engagement to George Clooney was announced, Oxford-educated barrister Amal Alamuddin was celebrated as a new template for the ideal woman. She is unmistakably worldly, graceful and chic, and she’s super brainy too. Clooney certainly recognized his good fortune. “I’m marrying up,” he told Variety. 
 
 As Kristen Houghton wrote in a piece entitled “The New Trophy Wife:” 
 
 The days of a well-off older man who has a brainless beauty on his arm at social functions seems to be a deal out of Mad Men. Educated, intelligent women are the ones most sought-after by men of the same caliber. Brains are the new beauty. 
 
 (Helayne Seidman/For The Washington Post) 
 
 Alamuddin was the bright yellow buoy atop a wave that’s been in motion for some time, one in which the new cool girls are the ones who inspire cultural crushes, most recently among them Roxane Gay, Tavi Gevinson, Lena Dunham. Didion’s been the subject of many a writer crush for decades. 
 
 “As far as smart women being the new cool girls — god, I hope that’s a trend!” Morgan said. “But I bet most writers never think of themselves as cool girls to begin with — which perhaps is one of the reasons the cool ones are cool to begin with.” 
 
 Below, words on the appeal of Céline from the Philophiles, via Nowness:
– Tavi Gevinson became a fixture in the fashion world at age 11, thanks to her blog Style Rookie. Today, she's 17 and running Rookie, an online magazine delving into everything from pop culture to feminist issues to love to body image to celebrity interviews. Tavi and Rookie have come a long way since the magazine launched in 2011. Tavi now oversees an 80-person staff; the magazine's 43-year-old editorial director quit her job at the New York Times to come work for the teen. "My rule for bosses and therapists is they have to be smarter than I am—and Tavi completely fits that bill," Anaheed Alani tells the Los Angeles Times. Tavi also does book signings (Rookie puts out a print anthology of its best work, plus new content, each year), speaking engagements, and photo shoots; she's been interviewed by Stephen Colbert and Jimmy Fallon; she even had a role in the film Enough Said. But she's also a senior at a public high school in suburban Illinois who has to get by on a $25-a-week allowance. (She's not yet drawing a salary from Rookie, though it gets more than 4 million page views a month and features jewelry and makeup ads; her dad says she may start getting paid soon.) Of the magazine, she says, "The goal has become more to make people feel included, that they're cool enough or smart enough." The Times' full profile is worth a read.