MR WESSELS
Well the manner in which this happened, we know that there were discussions, sometimes over the telephone, on these things and one may criticise the method in which this happened.  I'm not suggesting that that is a good way of doing things.  That doesn't alter the fact that there may have been a misunderstanding of some sort in that regard.  There's a dispute between the two and there has been a dispute for many years in regard to exactly where or to what extent Webb had given authority for these operations.  It's clear from that that at least as far as Verster is concerned, he was bona fide in believing that what he did was within the purposes of what he was there for.  He got the money through a budget, he got or made the arrangements that a weapon be obtained and this was the type of operation where had he, Webb says that if he had been asked for permission to do it, he would have granted it.  So there may have been something that happened at the last moment, where Webb didn't think that he gave permission when Verster thought he had given permission.