MR COETZEE
Mr Commissioner, there was just one aspect which I can just, before it slips my mind, which I wish to refer to regarding proportionality which, I see I made a note but I didn't mention it.  It is that the question was raised, where does the buck stop and that was - Mr Barnard, when he gave his evidence he was quite bitter about that, that he felt that the politicians and the Generals did not come to take responsibility for what they have done and what they have created here and with great respect, they are the only people who can objectively indicate to this Commission where the proportionality comes from.