MR AMEEN
I'm coming to that Mr Chairman, the survivors were in another group, were in Hlasa's group right, but I've just been instructed that there was movement inbetween, interchange, that the applicant's were moving from one group to another, that they did not confine themselves to one group and that is what I want to put to him and I want to put to him certain other atrocities that he has (indistinct) committed.  Right, I put it to you earlier and I'm repeating that, that in your group at the start there was Msilana, Mbulelo and Oscar, all of whom are deceased and that in Mr Hlasa's group, the first applicant, there were the two survivors and Vuyani.  I also now want to put it to you that there was movement of people assaulting from one group to another and that you were one of the people that was moving from one group to another and that in the course of this moving from one room to another room during the assault, you used a plier on the genitals, on the private parts of these youths, including the two survivors and that you used it in such a way to cause them pain and degradation.  Do you admit this, because that is what they will say?