CARL CASTELING BOTHA
Sir, I wouldn't say most probably to an extent sympathetic as well, we were treated like outcasts, so in all probability, yes.  But that wouldn't have meant a great deal to them, the Ponti and something like mentioning a name like W.  He wouldn't have said the name, he would have said W, something like that.  So it would have been a coded message which wouldn't have meant anything to the specific person relating the message to me.