UNKNOWN
I just wish to again thank you Deputy Minister, for also the Commission to get not only a first-hand report, but to get a perspective and I daresay from the position of the investigative unit which had a background.  We now are going to have a fair sense of balance and I would therefore like for the sake of the record just to make sure that we are going about our facts correctly.
 When the Pickhard Commission met or set, is it your evidence that you were not called or you did not participate in that Commission so that your perspective can be given.  That's now the first question.
 The second question, also for the record, just for us to, because there are certain sections that I want to put to you as to what their conclusions were but I would like to know as a matter of record, historical record, that these conclusions, either about yourself and your conduct or about others, were done by judges, judiciary judges, some of whom are being respected and being banded about as examples of what judiciaries should be.  But I'm keen to find out whether as a matter of historical record, it is your testimony under oath that when Goldstone also had a Commission and conducted this Commission of enquiry against the background of what you had said, where media, speculations about your particular role and when as a consequence thereof, he made not only certain findings about your conduct which were not flattering, but he actually called on the ANC to censure you, because I'm going to ask whether that was done and if it was not done, why was it not done etc. but is it so that your evidence under oath is that those conclusions were made by that judge without you ever having been given an opportunity to be heard.  I just want for record.