MR LOWIES
Ja, but on the other hand say for instance, to come back to the sexual assaults, who can say that that is strictly speaking relevant if we know that it's something that is from a victim's point of view, not nice to talk about.  We don't want to go into that, that I give you the assurance and my, speaking for my clients and myself, we don't want amnesty for something that happened like that, but you have listened to their versions, it's not their versions that they have committed it, unless of course a witness comes and identifies a specific witness, then it's a different story.  But I think strictly speaking we're all talking about the same thing.