MR VISSER
Chairperson, that the point I was trying to make.  The witness has now given an answer which is utterly wrong, Pitso doesn't say in his statement that he didn't see Betty until 1989, he says - the last sentence in paragraph at page 52, he says something entirely different.
"In as far as I am concerned, Betty was unheard of in our ranks in Lesotho, up till the time I left Lusaka, Zambia, in mid-1989."
And that's what I was trying to avoid, Chairperson.