ANDRIES STEPHANUS KRIEL
Yes, Mr Chairperson.  I do not know exactly how Mr Oelofse gave the instruction to Kloppers, but that the instruction was there, that we were in war with the ANC and that the ANC people had to be killed, that is for sure, that is definitely true.  At that stage, it is not today the case any more, but it was the feeling Chairperson, we were convinced that if the ANC takes over the country, they were going to start killing all the white people.
	We all believed this, that did not realise.  So in other words the convictions we have today, differ in essence from those we had at that time.  I am not proud of what had happened.