UNKNOWN
There are two answers to that.  Firstly, it's not tested evidence here, no one was ever given the opportunity to test that evidence.  One would have expected then, particularly in the light of Verster's evidence, which suggests at this juncture between the CCB and the government itself on what the government stated policies were.  If they wanted this Committee to believe that it was in truth and in fact government stated policy to get involved in this sort of thing, one would have expected them to either call or subpoena someone higher up that ladder and to give all of us an opportunity to test that proposition.  We haven't been able to test the proposition, I don't see how the Committee can make a finding of fact.  If we were to take that further and we say well, let's then look in the Committee's report and see what the - not the Committee, the Commission's Report, let's see what the Commission found about who the CCB probably murdered.  I assume my learned friends will not have you accept as proven facts what is contained in that report because if you had to do that it would have a rather serious impact on the applications.