MR MOERANE
Well, I don't know whether you mention it in your statement, your first statement, I don't see it.  In any event, it is common cause and we all know now that they were not armed.   I would like to refer you to Bundle 2, page 125.  This is a press report dated the 12th of September 1993, the reporters there seem to be one Warrant Gibson, Sharon Chetty and they refer to an interview given by a former South African Police Sergeant, Marthinus Grobler.  Do you remember those two, Grobler and Stevens?