MR HOCKEY
Mr Chairman, if I may also just add.  If I were asking those questions, I simply would have said that "my instructions are", now Mr Williams is in the difficult position that he has personal knowledge, because he was there, so it is, he doesn't want to say "my instructions from myself are", so we can take it that those are his, he knows about these things, it is evidence that he can lead, and on that basis, these questions should be allowed, thank you Mr Chairman.