ABRAM VAN ZYL
Mr Chairperson, I know what a crime is and I know what a crime is not.  The question to me was did I know, indirectly did I know that I was committing a crime?  Yes I knew it.  Why did I do it?  Because it was an instruction.  Why did I execute an unlawful instruction?  I did not see it as an unlawful instruction, Mr Chairperson, I saw it as a lawful instruction within the context of what the aims were of the CCB and in the context of the existence of the CCB.