MR STRYDOM
Because the same situation arose earlier on in regard to Mr Berger, that I've become a witness now.  I will cross-examine this witness now on these aspects and if needs be we will have to investigate this whole issue further and then I'll have to call witnesses at a later stage, to rebut what these witnesses are saying.  But just for record purposes, I must rely on my memory, I obviously deny one hundred percent that I paid them any money whatsoever and my recollection is that they did not want to speak to us, as is reflected in the record, at that stage.