TESTIMONY_GIVER:
  As well as the Audi which was parked behind the wall opposite Mr Mxenge's office.  He then also went with us to show Mr Mxenge's house, and the information was also given to us that he usually works late at night, and his wife usually leaves before him.  I requested Brigadier van der Hoven at the time to arrange with Brigadier Skoon for him to send Joe Mamasela down for me as I would pick him as one of my team members.  At the time Joe Mamasela was actually working with West Rand Security, Captain Jan Coetzee, who succeeded me on the 31st of December 1981 as commander at Vlakplaas, but whenever Captain Jan Coetzee didn't have work for him he would work with us, or when I needed him it would be arrange with Captain Jan Coetzee.  So Brigadier van der Hoven arranged and, according to my recollection, Sergeant Schutte brought Joe Mamasela down on the 17th of November during the night which the dogs were poisoned.  He brought down with him from Vlakplaas a hunting knife and two Okapi knives.  Four pieces of meat we got from the police single quarters kitchen, and I had a bottle of strychnine in the back of my car, green crystals which the farmers used in the earlier days for jackal, to kill jackal that caught their sheep.  Small slits - I made four pieces of meat, small chunks of meat with four slits in it, and put knife point - only a small knife point of strychnine in each piece of meat.  This was not for the dog to taste the strychnine, and if you put in too much