RUSSELL ALLY
I understand that, Mrs Nhlapo but he can always make a statement.  It doesn't have to be to-day.  The work of the Commission will go on for at least six more months so there is still time and if you can contact him and ask him if there's anything that he would want to add to your statement, anything that will shed more light on what happened on that day in May.  Also on what happened to your husband subsequently because when Mr Manthata was asking you about the circumstances surrounding the death of your husband you seemed to suggest that there was more than just an ordinary death.  In your statement you also speak about your husband having been involved in the taxi business and after his death, his taxis were stolen.  So there's quite a lot of things in your statement which, if we could have more information, would assist us.  As I said, there is no immediate hurry.  It doesn't have to be done to-day, it can be done in the next couple of weeks.  If you could please ask you son......   I just want to say to you also that in statements that we have from others dealing with this period, with what was actually happening in Siyathemba, it is said that one of the incidents that actually sparked off this attack on the houses of Councillors and in particular your house, was after the body, after the coffin of Abram had been taken by the police and the police refused to give the family permission to bury Abram in Siyathemba, but in Greylingstad as we heard from Abram's father.  Apparently that so angered some of those present that they decided to take their anger out on Councillors and that a decision was taken to go and attack the houses of those Councillors who had not yet resigned.  Many houses were actually petrol bombed and your family house was also petrol bombed.  So we are beginning to get some picture, some idea of what was actually happening in the community at that time.  The tensions, the conflicts, the way in which the community became divided and I think that without wanting to take away from the suffering of anybody, from whichever side of the conflict, I think we are increasingly beginning to see that this Council system was at the root of a lot of what turned people against each other, that caused these divisions, those who were seen to support the Council system and those who were seen to be opposed to the Council system.  One of the achievements I suppose of the democracy that we have now is that we have no such system.  A system which divides, which imposes structures on people.  We actually have a Local Government system, a Provincial Government, and National Government where people all have the right to vote freely, where political parties have the right to campaign freely.  That was not the situation in the 1980's, the period that you were speaking about.  Without wanting to justify what people did, people must take responsibility but at least we are beginning to get some understanding of why people acted with such anger, such vehemence.  We can see the consequences.  Thank you very much for coming and speaking to us from what I suppose we can consider, the other side of the conflict because Councillors were seen, rightly or wrongly on the other side of the conflict.  Thank you for coming and sharing with us and I again ask you if you would please ask your son at some point to make a statement, to add to your statement so that we can have a fuller picture.  So thank you very much, Mrs Nhlapo.