MR DU PLESSIS
But Mr Chairman, for that purpose you have heard evidence in numerous applications of Cronje, Hechter, van Vuuren etc., where certain incidents took place in Mamelodi, including arson, murder etc., bomb attacks, petrol bomb attacks etc., in Mamelodi, you've even heard evidence of the killing of Doctor Ribero and his wife in Mamelodi, so I think that's a given fact that such incidents took place and were committed by the security police in Mamelodi.