MR WESSELS
Mr Chairman yes, and it's very important that one has regard to that in this particular case, because as I started I said that especially in the case of Verster, there's a public perception that surrounds him and one becomes sceptical if one sits in these proceedings, if you sit in criminal courts day in and day out, one becomes hardened against a lot of excuses that are advanced in these sorts of forums and especially in the case of a person with a certain profile.  And that's why you have to disassociate yourself with that sort of preconceived - and I don't mean it in a derogatory sense, but that sort of feeling that you know, it's probable that he's not telling the truth, he came here coming to tell lies.  You must take it as a new matter, give him the benefit of the doubt, if there's a doubt.