NORMAN ARENDSE
My point is quire simply this and I don't want to take it any further and undermine whatever your deliberations were Mr Chairman, my point is simply that 19.1 kicks in 32, it's not in isolation, it's only when your name is mention in an application form and this was not the case.  Mr Ntsebeza's name did not crop up as a result of any - it couldn't have, obviously it couldn't have and we now know the evidence of the applicants has been given.