MR PHOSA
You see according to the medical report which is - for what it says is not challenged, this substance thallium was used.  Now I'm not sure how far I must go in this regard - whether I should say: "used on Mr Mthimkhulu" but of course then we're dealing with Mr Mthimkhulu.  Mr Mthimkhulu was obviously given thallium, now you would not say that he didn't get it whilst he was in detention, you cannot say that.