ADV PRINSLOO
With respect, Mr Chairperson, that is not my argument.  Whether his belief was reasonable in the circumstances will have to be judged, what a reasonable man would do under those circumstances.  The example which the honourable Committee member has submitted is not that simple.  Here one has to look at the surrounding circumstances, which have already have been presented to the Committee.  Namely, Chinese stick grenades were found, information was provided by an informant. The security police supported them in this view that there was in fact an onslaught.  The circumstances prove this, in fact R4,2 million was stolen.  It is a fact that AK-47 shells were found.  The deceased was found in suspicious circumstances.  With respect, Mr Chairperson, that in itself provides sufficient grounds, reasonable grounds which are reasonable because a reasonable person objectively believed that a person was involved in these circumstances.
	The act, the intervention, Mr Chairperson, how will the Commission be able to determine whether a person, if there is a death in a bomb explosion, whether that was deliberate, because there one is not involved in motive, one is dealing with deliberation.  Motives and intentions should not be confused.  This Commission must examine the motive of the person and not whether the intention was justifiable, not whether it was a case of neglect.
	The circumstances, with respect, Chairperson is that in the course of the whole thing, that Gerber believed in those circumstances, that he was working against the struggle for liberation.  There were many examples which have been before our courts, where politics specifically were involved, murders, assassinations, in which the victim, as in the case for example, S v Messina & Others. There, for example, various people were killed.  Ex Minister Lukele in that case, the members decided personally that they would murder Lukele, it wasn't as such a specific instruction from the ANC, it was their own choice. In that same case the people worked in with an AK-47, Lukele was shot, his sister-in-law was also killed, his wife was seriously wounded, one Const Vuma was killed in an assassination, without being able to defend himself.  In the judgment which was referred to here, there another member of the police was killed.
	With respect, if one looks at these things, in relation to the case before the court, the Appeal Court found a political motive to be involved.  What motivated them to commit this act, in that comparison, with respect, Mr Chairperson, this should not be lost sight of in these circumstances.
	There must be an investigation launched and then at the end of the day it must be identified whether there was a full revelation and whether the requirements as set out in the Act have been complied with.