REV XUNDU
In our experience with the police we have come across a number of cases in which a person is roughed up in jail and them he is taken to a Magistrate in the afternoon to give evidence because he must appear before a Magistrate  within so many hours and as a person appears before the Magistrate,  as he goes there, he's going with 2 security police who will say to him, excuse my language.  You tell the Magistrate that we have neuked you up, jy sal kak, because you're going to come up, you're going to come back to us.  There are several people who, who would testify to that.  The Magistrate would look at you and he sees that you have a blue eye and he doesn't remonstrate the police about that but  I want to say that we have had Magistrates also who have not been, who have not had any sense of integrity when it came to Blacks because I think they were in the same war.  In a White/Black war.  Now I would like to make that comment.
MR CARD?: Mr Chairman, unfortunately I, I'm not, I haven't been sitting on a Commission to hear all these stories but I can tell you from my experience with a magistrate and the Judges, there was never anything like that.  I had the highest regard for the magistrates and the judges and let me say that in the times that I had dealings with Magistrates, in fact I thought, on a number of occasions, there should have been guilty.  Certain people should have been found guilty and they were actually found not guilty.  I thought that, as far as I was concerned, justice was one of the departments that you couldn't point a finger at and I might be wrong, Mr Chairman.