MICHAEL BELLINGAN
It's the one of Mr Oosthuizen, Mr Chairman, marked Annexure K.  Mr Oosthuizen deals in paragraph 3.1 on page 2, with the question as to whether Janine worked for the Security Branch.  There's two comments that I can make about that, and the first on is that there was a long period when I was at Stratcom, when Mr Oosthuizen wasn't working with me, he was still in Johannesburg and I worked with Brigadier McIntyre etc., etc., and then certainly Janine worked for us on the basis that I've explained to the Committee, on the contract basis.
	When Janine initially started to work, as I've explained on peripheral basis for the Security Branch in Johannesburg, after I had met her, it could well be that Mr Oosthuizen doesn't remember that or that it may not specifically have been brought to his attention, as he says here.  
	And then I can just add there, Mr Chairman, that I've recalled that I gave a discussion in February about how one goes about the financing of these types of things.  
	And with respect to my media operation, my staff at the time will be able to confirm that for the media operation opposite Khotso House, I had a monthly standing advance for that operation and the stringers and the people associated with it that were paid would be paid and then the money basically claimed back by a claim form, not always via the usual system of motivations etc., etc.  
	So I had fairly much a free hand as far as that is concerned, Mr Chairman.  It may well be that Janine was paid out of that system.  People on my staff at the time like Warrant Officer Beyers and Paul Erasmus and so on will be able to confirm that.
	As far as paragraph 3.2 is concerned, it could well be that Mr Oosthuizen is right when he says:
"Ek dra geen kennis van die beweerde lys nie, of enige operasies wat in daardie verband geloots was deur teenspionasie nie."
It was in fact something I was doing, not counter-espionage, Mr Chairman.  The Committee must also remember that it wasn't only Mr Oosthuizen that I was speaking to, I had a fairly free hand in respect of my duties, Mr Chairman.  And I also had and was involved with some of the most highly skilled people in the country with these types of things.  So there were times when it just frankly wouldn't have been necessary to talk to Mr Oosthuizen about this type of thing.  
	In fact, this past Sunday when I was going through some documentation I'd just received I found some document which prompted my memory as far as something else that Mr Oosthuizen also wouldn't have knowledge of, and that is how names that I arranged via head office and the regions of people that we were to test on mass, under the guise of what is called here scientific investigation, whereas in actual fact I was posing 140 ideological and personality questions to these people.
	If one looks at these names over here there is only one conclusion that one could reach, some of the names that we slipped in, if one just looks at - well I'm sure that if the TRC looked at them they would agree with me that these are names that have been cropping up quite regularly in terms of what I would then have called possible extremists.  And there were also people on this list who were suspected of being working for the ANC at the time as well.  So Mr Oosthuizen would know nothing about this, but certainly some other people would.  And it's against the background of me drawing up a list and getting involved with these types of things that I mention this as well.
	So as for paragraph 3.2, it could well be that Mr Oosthuizen doesn't know about that.  In fact I'm quite sure he didn't know about the list.  I already testified to the fact that I didn't want anyone to know about the list.
	In terms of paragraph 3.3, I don't know if this is some sort of effort to get around this allegation that was made about Renata and I having an affair or being at Port Edward or whatever, prior to Janine's death, which is not, there's no basis at all for that, certainly not rumours around the office.  And I would have known if there were such rumours, Mr Chairman, I never heard any such rumours around the office.  Certainly - prior to the murder there were most definitely no such rumours whatsoever, Mr Chairman.  After the murder the rumours were to the extent that it was I who had killed Janine and not with anything at all to do with an affair with anybody else.  So I'm not happy at all with paragraph 3.3.