ADV DE JAGER
But I really had in mind if you are countering offences that is being committed with a political objective from the side of the deceased, but my point that I originally put before you is, how can you say that the list was - have we got evidence saying that the deceased's defences was committed with a political objective, because then you are sort-of countering what they have done, but according to the list this could have been ordinary criminal offences not related to any politics.  That is what I have tried to establish from you, what are your submissions on that.