MR SHANGWENI
I would disagree Mr Chairperson, with due respect.  I don't want to disassociate the motives of Djamile and Msizi Hlope.  A politician who wants to create a base where he stays, surely would use people like Msizi, like the Caprivi trainees clandestinely, that is why we today we have that difficulty in terms of linking his motive with a political objective.  It's because these things were done clandestinely, that's the problem we have.  I would bear with the Committee ...(intervention)