MR RHAMAPHOSA
I had been in discussions with him on a number of occasions either face to face or also on the telephone and I never reached a point where I could say I understood him.  But we had sought to make it clear through communicating our objectives publicly, through various authorities and may I say even not to try and make it personal that I had at some stage during the course of the turmoil there, had said that you know, all we want is free political activity and the rest will follow.  One thought that he understood all that.
 How do we say as you ask sir, we can reconcile our action even against the Court Order that had been issued.  The Court Order by the Supreme Court was to direct the magistrate to apply his mind to this and the magistrate accordingly proceeded to grant permission, type of permission that in our view sought to frustrate the objectives that we had set.  As I indicated earlier, we had dealt with this magistrate before.  We had dealt with magisterial authority in the Ciskei before and by and large our applications, our attempts, our approaches to them had, if not dismissed out of hand, had been blunted, had been undermined and so forth.  So when this one came at the very last hour, at the very last hour in the early hours of the morning, setting out what the terms were when decisions had already been taken, and when people had already been mobilised it was difficult if not impossible.  It was going to be impossible to comply with this order.
 Given also sir, that the magistracy in that area was seen as part of the oppressive machine that acted in collusion with the regime of Oupa Gqozo in as far as denying our people free political activity.
 On your question that it would appear that it could be read that this was a planned break out of the stadium in that we did not communicate to the authorities of the Peace Secretariat and so forth, I did say sir, that having sent the group of people who were going to reconnoitre the area and look at the conditions of the wire as well as the conditions in the stadium, I did say that they did report back and instantaneously the decision was taken, that seeing that there is this opening, this opening is there, that could well be the route that we should take right into Bisho.  Remember that the objective was to go into Bisho and when this opening was seen, people did not in their own minds think that this was an ambush, this was a trap, they did not think like that.  They just saw an opening, we wanted to go to a particular destination and whilst the route was controlled by wire fence and all that into the stadium, but through the stadium there was this opening.  
 Our argument and our submission is that if the intention was to prevent us from going out of the stadium, the people who could put up a wire fence could have taken care to raise the wire that had been flattened, could have taken care to close the stadium completely with the wire fence as well.  They could have taken care that everything ends up in the stadium to frustrate our objective but they didn't do that.  They didn't do that, they left the opening knowing what our intended objective was.  So we could not communicate sir, to the Peace Secretariat because the decision was taken instantaneously.