HENDRIK JOHANNES PETRUS BOTHA
Chairperson, perhaps I could facilitate this for Mr Lalla.  The Knoll was under observation, the house in Brickfield was under observation, many other houses were under observation, we were a core group of people who had knowledge,  one of the activities of Vula and those people involved, there was not a big team of observation which could observe these places for 24 hours at a stretch.  We ourselves undertook the observation and if there had been a meeting between Mr Gordhan and Mr Lalla at the Knoll or at any other place, it is possible and I concede because we did not observe the place for 24 hours.