MR DERBY-LEWIS
Please let me finish, because this is relevant. In fact, Mr Chairman, at that stage in 1978, it was common cause that in terms of the ethnic orientation of territories in South Africa, that an average of 70 - these are the figures that are at my disposal, and I have never had them questioned in any political arena anywhere in this country or outside, that in terms of those figures, Mr Chairman, that something like a percentage of 72% of all of the peoples of the different ethnic groups, were either resident within or in the immediate surrounds of their traditional territories.  That was the information to my, available to me.  And Mr Chairman, that told me something. We could never ever have effected forced removals to the extent that would be required to effect such a massive move of people from one place to another. They must be moved voluntarily and I believe they moved in that area because industrial development was taking place, Mr Chairman, and if I can use Bophuthatswana as an example, that is proof of that.  Bophuthatswana was the economic success story of the policy of separate development.