MS GOBODO-MADIKIZELA
Thank you Mr Chairperson.  Bushy that is what I wanted to touch on as well.  As Mrs Nzilane said that the burden is on Gqozo's shoulders, but what we must investigate is that the burden of the then South African government where does it start and where does it end?  You were all here in the morning when Mr Kriel told us about how he sent his men to Ciskei so that a police force would be built and also a Ciskean Defence Force.  My question is when he told us that this would take over the Ciskean Government why was it then necessary that a Ciskean Police Force and Defence Force would have to be built up?  What was the point and what was the motive?  These are the things that I think the Commission should investigate.  Because according to their statements to day and their submissions they say that they blame the ANC and Gqozo, but I think we should investigate properly why it was that people were deployed to Ciskei, what was the cause and what was the motive.
 A burden that sits on our shoulders as a Commission is that when we talk about reconciliation what exactly are we referring to?  When you call people here to tell the truth 
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what is it exactly that we are going to reconcile?  What are we going to look at?  When people come here, people who have lost husbands, people who have lost children that were breadwinners, the deaths of these people impacts on the lives of these people.  It is not only a gross violation of human rights, but people as a result of this have been disempowered.  The Black man has always been a social outcast, without citizenship, without anything.  People were oppressed because they were powerless.  When we say that we are reconciling what happens to the dynamics of power of the time?  If those power relations are still intact how are we going to talk about reconciliation if people are suffering to this day?   We should therefore go further than the point of just apologising and saying sorry, but look at the fact that people are impoverished and look at how these people can be helped. 
 What I am saying Bushy and the rest of you is that you are giving us a challenge, a challenge that evokes from us a sense of wanting to help.  Thank you Mr Chairperson.