MR DEHAL
I agree, I have no argument against that.  All I want to suggest is this, if there is testimony uncontroverted from the applicant that there were some problems in regard to this statement, why for example my knife, the deceased's knife, he says "I never said that."  He says he didn't read the statement before he signed it.  When asked pertinently about that aspect as to whether you turned around he says
"I never turned around, I never chased the deceased, I fell.  I dispossessed him, I wanted to subdue him"
And that's the level at which he pitched version.  No amount of cross-examination defeated him on that.  It's only the statements, which he, the applicant, also casts doubt on which stands against him.
	Mr Chairperson, there is this aspect that you've asked us to consider and address you on, namely whether there is an offence.  I have just a few submissions to make on that.  Basically two.  The first is this, the applicant no doubt has been convicted.  I accept that this is not a court of appeal.  He is endeavouring in the hope of if he gets amnesty granted to have his slate cleaned.  That's the most positive effect he can achieve from this process.
	But secondly, not his view but my view as a lawyer looking at his version, if one looks clinically at his approach of self-defence, it seems to me it is not one that really succeeds as self-defence for here is a man, who on his own admission, is in the company of Nsomi who holds down the deceased at a time when the appellant - sorry, when the applicant dispossesses the deceased of his knife.  Now at the level of arguing his activity hadn't gone beyond the bounds of self-defence one can see clearly that if he dispossessed of the knife he could well have taken that knife and run away.  He needn't have stabbed the deceased, he needn't have stabbed him to such an extent that three stab wounds were inflicted which indeed common cause caused the death of the deceased.  At that level of exceeding the bounds of self-defence it is murder with the firearm but yes, that was negated by the time the applicant got to him.