ABOOBAKER ISMAIL
Mr Chairperson, if one looks at that paragraph, it says "the ANC sought", that is what it would have liked to have done, at the same time, elsewhere in these documents and if you look at the Kabwe Conference sections, it talks about not having the fact that civilians present, to allow the ANC from being prevented from acting against the Security Forces.  There came a time in the struggle and let me put a theoretical or hypothetical case, if we are in a combat situation and you have ANC combatants fighting against Forces of the regime and there are other civilians present at that time, often you found that the Security Forces were firing at the crowd and perhaps even at combatants.  The responsibility for that would have been then that would we then say that the ANC cadres or the combatants should not then fire back and that the Security Forces therefore had the leeway and to continue fighting in which ever way they wanted?  Because often the situation was created that the Forces of apartheid were ready to go on and fight and oppress and it was only when the Liberation Forces were able to fight back and strike at them, that they began to feel the pain and the hurt, it is when they themselves bled, that they realised that they did not have the stomach to die for apartheid.