D WORDSWORTH LETHULI
What I can say, I will just reverse a bit, what I can say, on my arrival here at Mpumalanga, when I arrive I wasn't on good term with Comrade Mgeshle, then I withdrew.  He was the one then who was actually to proceed in his way.  after his death, I was then told by M Z Khumalo that there is a vacancy, I must just go and replace, and then I came back after his death.
	On my arrival, he had bodyguards and other people, other IFP members.  When I arrived at Sipumlabas, the bodyguards were there, and he explained to me that these people were given to me by Zakele to be my bodyguards.   In real fact, they are soldiers.  I'll just leave it there, but "These bodyguards, they were Zakele's bodyguards, now they have to be yours", and then I refused, I said "I don't need any bodyguards, no, I don't need them, I'll watch myself".   
	Thereafter, after a while, he called me and said, "These soldiers say they would like to see you", and then I went there at a place called Phulapon, and then I found them.  There was a certain person, major, of the military intelligence, and he explained me, he described me as I am, the training that I did at Caprivi and explained that he actually, he has called me, he's trying to make with relationship, and indeed the way he described and explained, there was nothing to refute or deny, and this person was not there, so he was saying all the correct things.   Then that's when that I realised that we will be helping each other.  
	Then I said, "It's fine", then I said to Mhlaba, "There's something fishy here", and then I said, "Oh, I see, there is something really indeed", and then he just acknowledged.  On our next meeting, it was in a hotel at Botha's Hill, we are the very same person, I think he did realise that I was suspicious about what he was saying, and then he called M Z Khumalo.  It was myself, Sipumlaba and Khumalo and this man, and then we discussed.   
	Then M Z said that "You must trust this man, I've been working with him for a long time".  That's how I (indistinct).  In all the violence here in Mpumalanga, it was this man, Philbury who was in charge and the other Major Terblanche.  What their function or duty was, to supply us with the information, I will just make a parable, that at Ward 9 and Ward 8 examples, I spoke to them, "No, there shouldn't be any soldier or police, I just want to clean Unit 3", and then they said, "No problem".   
	Indeed people from Unit 3, if they can tell the truth, there was no police, there was no soldier who came there.  The soldiers who were around were here at the police station and they were watching actually, others taking vigils had the vigil camera and... (intervention).