MR VISSER
Yes and the way you did it, you explained to us, graphically, by pouring petrol over a cat after you poured petrol in the house and you let the cat run haphazardly through the house.  I am not going to repeat that, but then you added, Mr Motsamai, did you not, that the security branch at Brandfort, apparently, I assume, had tapped the telephone of Mrs Winnie Mandela.  Do you remember saying that?