CHAIRPERSON
Thank you Dr Ramashala.  Just one last issue.  Mr Ngxobongwana seems to have brushed shoulders with very senior people.  You mentioned earlier that Mr Roelf Meyer visited quite frequently, in fact it was Josette (...indistinct) showed me a picture of Mr Ngxobongwana standing with Mr Roelf Meyer, and I think I saw a picture of Ngxobongwana with - or someone mentioned that he even brushed shoulders with the State President, if it's right.