MR MADASA
Yes, Mr Chair, that's very important.   Actually that lends support to the submission that this is the background against which the SDU's must be seen, and these applicants cannot therefore be faulted if it is revealed in evidence before the hearing that what they did was beyond a mandate, what they did was beyond the reason why they were formed, they committed excesses, that statement sought to therefore accept that there were those problems, and those problems were attributed by the people concerned as squarely on the government of the day, that because people were defenceless, these impromptu structures were put up, and it was difficult to monitor them, hence there were excesses.   So that statement was admitting that there were excesses, but I'm saying, my submission is that therefore even if there's evidence here that the committee may find that there were excesses or, therefore it should be seen in that light.