MR VISSER
Now I am still on the point Mr Ismail of taking you up on your denial of callous action on the part of the ANC and particularly on your part.  I want to suggest to you that a reference to the type of targets that were attacked during the conflict of the past is a clear indication that the ANC had very - had scant consideration for the safety of civilians and indeed it appears as if sometimes civilians were particularly targeted.  Let me give you an example or more.
	The so-called Burger War, the Wimpy Bar attacks.  Shops that were attacked during the consumer boycotts.  We know of the Amanzimtoti shopping centre bomb.  The Witbank bomb.  The Ellis Park bomb.  I am suggesting to you Mr Ismail that when you considered the target for your Church Street bomb you had no consideration whatever for the fact that civilians will necessarily be casualties, and that was callous.  
	And I am sorry, if I may add, and I am going to suggest to this Committee when the time comes that there could have been no political objective of any kind.