MR VISSER
Mr Chairman, with all due respect, can I just tell my learned friend what the facts are.  We've gone through this in the cross-examination - we're just wasting time.  He was at school in 1985 and he finished his matric at the end of 1985.  From 1983 to 1985 he was an informer of the security branch in Bloemfontein.  He then was ...[inaudible] on the 11th of March 1986 as a student constable, worked from that time until the 19th of June 1986 in Bloemfontein and he was then transferred to Ladybrand.  He was then admitted to the college on the - either the 9th, 10th or 11th of July 1986.