MR VAN DEN BERG
It's not so much the lack of a positive answer Mr Chairperson but the fact that further violence was then used, that's the submission.
	In so far as the Stanton's are concerned, six people are tied up, a further person is lured into the house, that's Mr Kirk, he is then also tied up.  There is - assault may be too strong a word, but there is certainly the physical manhandling of a six year old boy who is then tied up and then a great amount of goods are removed from the home.  This apparently on the applicant's version was an operation to procure firearms and no firearms were found.