MR MALUSI
If a person says I was there in the murder, but I was just standing by, and the Committee later finds out that you were not only standing by, your role was more than standing by, I believe that is a ground for refusal, and it is my submission that they also be refused.  On those two grounds, Mr Chairperson, I submit that both applicants, Mr Guleni and Mr Poyo, with regard to the Port St Johns incident, be refused amnesty, especially with regard to the murder of the four APLA cadres and the attempted murder of Mr Gasmeni.  Of course there are other charges, possession of unlicensed firearm because he says they were carrying Uzzis, pump action guns and the like, I believe they had those for political objectives.  The abduction of the APLA cadres earlier on during the day, I believe based on the Act, that abduction was justified.  All their acts were justified to an extent up to the point when they decided to kill those people to silence them, from there on their acts were definitely not justified in the Act.  Thank you for having me.