TESTIMONY_GIVER:
  Yes.  While I was lying on the ground shielding myself a lady had obviously been caught in the same sort of - in the same group that I had been caught in, and she crouched behind me.  She must have been about in her thirties somewhere.  She was actually trying to hide under me.  She was trying to hide under my body, and she had consequently also been stabbed in the back at the time.  While we were actually lying there we could - you know, we could see the group following up on the road, and it was only once that I stood up and walked into the hotel, into the Lonsdale Hotel to see if I could get someone to help me, that when I came out - at the time I didn't know who the man was, but I saw him firing shots at the - at the same man who had stabbed Ryan.  And I wasn't sure who the man was, but later on it was revealed that he was a training - a policeman who was in training school or whatever, and one of the - his accomplice was down from Pretoria on holiday with him.  She had also been stabbed at the time.