MR LAX
Yes, the thrust of my question to you is much more far reaching than the nature of their discussion with C20, in other words the two deceased and C20, the discussion that they had, the thrust of my question is that the impression gained and confirmed except in one respect which I'll come back to, was that these people of C20 were busy with their own work, they had a different job to do, they were there purely by chance and Botha told us he thought it might be helpful to them if they had a chance to speak to Ndaba and Shabalala so he allowed them that opportunity.  He gave no evidence of them being involved in any observations or anything else of that kind and he goes further, he says I want to put it very clearly that at no stage did they have any knowledge of any unlawful acts by members of the Durban Security Branch with regard to Ndaba or Shabalala.  How could they not have known there was something irregular in those people being held at a safe house?  We're talking about experienced security operatives here, Makata, Van den Berg, Van Dyk and Roeland, we're not talking about low-ranking people without experience?