MR SMITH
It's a conditional order, Mr Chairman and before executing that order, he does not go to the trouble of ascertaining whether shots are still being fired, whether they are in fact still under threat.
	And in respect of the proportionality, Mr Commissioners, there is the - I think it's a report by Mr Skrube who found that in respect of the persons stationed at Jongelanga, which we determined was a number of 36 soldiers, amongst them they fired 185 bullets and the group at Fort Hare he determined was a group of 78 and they fired 240 bullets.  
	My submission is that the relationship between the supposed attack, if one accepts that there was an attack, and weighed in proportion to the reaction, was totally out of context.  My submission in the end is therefore that both applicants have not complied with the requirements of the Act and that the application should be refused.