CHAIRPERSON
Could you perhaps assist us?  We must make an order recommending whether people should be considered as victims in terms of the Act.  We would only be in a position to do so, I think, unless you could help me, that I'm wrong in this, if we could find on the probability that the person killed was related to the family here and was in fact Oupa Madondo, the brother, if there's no room for finding that on the probability, can we make a recommendation on other grounds perhaps?