ADV DE JAGER
But I think it is, as far as the evidence of Motsamai is concerned, the applicant, he deals with this person by name.  On page 711 while he is dealing with all the victims and he comes to Serame Lefe,
"That is Serame Lefe, not Molefe as it is written.  It is I F at the end. He is a member of the African National Congress.  He had knowledge about the task force which is a unit of Apla.  He was troublesome, problematic and troublesome.  It was in the morning when we were able to find him.  Jantjie was present and then they had information from Lesotho about him.  When I speak of Jantjie I speak of a certain person in Ladybrand who is a Warrant Officer Jantjie.  They found information from Lesotho that this person has knowledge about Apla in Lesotho.
		We took him.  It was in the morning.  He was assaulted and he was screaming.  When I opened the door he was wrapped in a blanket.  I did not want to see who were responsible for the assault, because he was quiet and he wrapped with a blanket and lying on the floor.  He would explain very well that who were responsible for his assault.",
and then we go on to the next victim, victim number 22.  So, that is all the evidence that the applicant has given and the applicant does not admit that he assaulted him and he is not, I cannot see how he could apply for amnesty unless he says, well, I assaulted him.