TESTIMONY_GIVER:
  Yes, we had our conversation, and he just got out of the car without telling me anything or answering me, and two men approached us.  The other one was from KwaMashu.  He clapped me, and I was surprised as to why he had to clap me because I was so old.  I am just an elderly, frail man.  He knew me as a friend, but now that he had joined the Inkatha group he had now to impress Gatsha Buthelezi.  He appeared in the World Trade Centre.