ADV DE JAGER
Mr Cook may I put this to you.  It is common cause that those assaults were actually covered up, they were denied, now if the Judge had two versions of evidence and we have an admission by people that they assaulted people but we denied it and we misled the Judge, what is the relevance then of asking what the outcome or the finding of the Judge was?  The outcome could have been that he spoke the truth and he wasn't believed.