MR MAPOMA
Thank you, Chairperson.  Chairperson, I've got only two issues to raise of and concerning the application by Mr Mkosana in particular.
	The first Chairperson is the submission that Mr Mkosana refers to, that of I don't know, Major General  Ulser.  Chairperson, the essence of that submission was that he authorised the shooting to take place if they were shot at and that in itself, he was saying that:  "If you are being shot at, then defend yourselves" and it is in fact along those lines that Mr Mkosana instructed that people be shot at to defend themselves, now it comes then to a question as to what act or offence is it that Mr Mkosana should be granted amnesty for in the circumstances because he is coming to this Committee to provide this Committee with a defence of self defence against a possible 
offence and in a way it is my submission that he denies that he committed offences on that day, because he was acting in self defence or he instructed the forces to act in self defence.  The  Picard Commission Report, the Board of Inquiry and the Goldstone Report, do not take this matter any further as well, in his favour.  They just do not assist him.  He in fact goes on to say that he accepts, he does not accept liability for the actions that were committed by those soldiers whom he says he never instructed.  The only responsibility that he seems to be taking is the responsibility for the consequences of what he calls minimum force, which he claims to have instructed that it be executed.  It would be noted, Chairperson, that this minimum force, was described by the applicant quite succinctly and out of the description that he has given of this minimum force, it is highly unlikely, I submit, that the magnitude of these offenses where people died, might have been killed as a result of that minimum force which he claims to be responsible for, given the explanation that he gave this Committee of what the minimum force entails.  It therefore consequently shows that he denies the offence still.