MR VISSER
Just in the remaining time - Mr Chairman, if you will allow me to interrupt the examination but we believe that we have to say something from a point of view of explanation to the members who are appearing, who are sitting with you today who have not been exposed to us, as it were, before.  Mr Chairman, you will recall that on occasion in the past, certain cross-examination was directed to certain of the applicants for whom we appear in regard to precisely the point that Commissioner Malan raised this morning, that being that the applications are all basically the same.  Mr Chairman, you will be reminded that there was one occasion, I can't remember which it was, but I believe it was in the Umzimkulu matter, where we explained to you and the panel then sitting with you, how precisely this came about and it concerns a long history of reticence on the part of policemen to apply for amnesty and how it eventually came about through the efforts of persons such as particularly General van der Merwe and also others that literally on number 99 decision was made to apply to support the process of the TRC and to apply for amnesty.  When that happened Mr Chairman, my poor attorney was suddenly swamped.