MS THABETHE
I am indebted to you Mr Lax.  So it's 4 incidents.  Let me just repeat them quickly.  It's the meeting of Ndaba with you, it's the arrest that took place, it's the telephoning of Mr Steyn and it's the information that he gave you, that is for a meeting with Shabalala.  Can you possibly tell us how it happened, which occurred first?