IAN MUNRO PHILLIPS
Yes, absolutely.  I think you can divide it into two categories as well.  One incident I remember particularly, I think it was the 2nd of December 1992, where another comrade who was at the University and myself, called to investigate a massacre that had occurred in Bambai.  We went to Bambai, midmorning, the incident had apparently taken place in the very early morning, four or five o'clock, however the bodies were, about eight or nine bodies of people, mainly women and children, were laying where they had been shot.
	It hadn't been removed, because the police were waiting for the SABC TV cameras to arrive first, so they told us.  In that particular instance in Bambai, was a very specific case, the members of the community who spoke to us, as an official ANC delegation, we were joined by other comrades, indicated quite clearly who the perpetrators were, where they were, and they were still across the little valley which separates Bambai from the IFP settlement at that stage.
	The request was very simple, here is the evidence, we have been telling you for months and months that we are under attack, do something.
	In that very personal thing, I can come back to the office and the evidence is very clear to me, yes, something needs to be done, and I can make a direct recommendation to comrade Mandla by saying we need to get something for that community so that it can defend itself in future.  It is very, very, absolutely necessary.
	However, there would be other instances where less directly involved with a particular incident.  You would get in the course of meetings wherever, (indistinct), Umkababa, whatever, again people and appeals would be made from the floor, in a public meeting that we need assistance, we are being massacred.
	From the position of an REC member, we have got direct links into the ANC structures of those particular areas.  When you come back as a political leader, obviously you need to address the intelligence structures and the military structures and say it seems to me that something is required in this particular area, what needs to be done?
	The military side of things, the people involved in the SDU's, the people who know what type of things are needed to counteract the type of attack that is being waged against you, they are the ones that can come up with a more proper assessment of what is required in terms of arms and ammunition in an area.
	When that decision is taken or assessed, and they of course do their own assessments, I am merely an instrument of communicating that request north, I do not have a veto power on it, and I would never have exercised a veto power on it either simply because I didn't think it was necessary in a particular area.
	If a legitimate structure operated by comrade Mandla indicated to me we need weapons for a particular area, I would take that message as soon as I possibly could, to military Headquarters.