MR MEYER
Chairperson it is quite obvious that the person who led the demonstrators at that stage, at that very moment into this opening, through the gap in the fence, was Mr Kasrils, according to the findings of the Goldstone Commission and other evidence I believe submitted to you already.  So it was him in person, but I believe also it was indicated through other submissions and also in the Goldstone Commission that this was part of the so-called Leipzig Option, and whoever was responsible to design that for this particular day and for this particular occasion was also acting recklessly and that would be our submission.