MR WESSELS
Mr Chairman I am not interested in those, in his life would be petty crimes, I am interested in the serious crimes that he's committed.  And we want evidence about the serious crimes that he's committed because it is very evident that if he had committed other very serious crimes then he will never come out of prison.  Now let him disclose those other serious crimes that he has committed and then we can see how we must judge his evidence in this particular case.