CARL CASTELING BOTHA
Sorry can I just interrupt you on that point, I would just like to once again explain to you what my role and responsibility was concerning this incident.  I was there in an observation position.  I accompanied Van Zyl as an expert in an area of which he knew nothing.  I did not make sure that I knew of all of the facts, I went exclusively on the grounds of an instruction that I received from the coordinator and the regional manager and what I observed in the handing over of this limpet mine.  I went there exclusively on that basis and I accompanied Mr van Zyl.  Once again you said I was not involved in the pre-study, I was not involved in the in-house and that is why I think it is unfair to ask me these type of questions because I cannot answer you with certainty even though I want to, and with respect I am saying this.  I pick up a feeling of animosity from you because I am not accepting it that way, but I cannot.  I can tell you how I saw the limpet mine, how I handed it over to Isgak Hardien, I can tell you what I observed there and that is my integrity that's on the table here, and it's my opinion about what happened there.