`:::Well Agrippa, since the primary topic of debate concerns people like myself, (Which is sort of ironic, I always see people complaining about how Creationists or people objecting to Evolution bring up off-topic discussion on this talk page, yet now it seems the shoe is on the other foot) and it appears nobody objects heavily to Filll's sentiment, I think it's likely that anything I say has a high risk of being twisted in meaning to fit other people's pre-conceived notions that whatever I say must be false and incapable of being debated with, ``since the Christian evangelists/creationists think they are being perfectly moral to try to force their views on others, to lie and cheat to get their way``. I mean, I certainly wouldn't try some friendly debate with someone who thinks it is perfectly moral to lie and cheat to get their way, how could you possibly trust a person to hold a conversation without hiding important things?    `