Commercial Fixed Wing
Flight Crew Multiengine; Flight Crew Instrument; Flight Crew Air Transport Pilot (ATP)
Troubleshooting; Confusion; Communication Breakdown; Workload
Deviation / Discrepancy - Procedural Clearance; Deviation / Discrepancy - Procedural Published Material / Policy; Deviation / Discrepancy - Procedural FAR
Air Traffic Control Issued New Clearance; Air Traffic Control Provided Assistance; Flight Crew Requested ATC Assistance / Clarification; Flight Crew Took Evasive Action
Chart Or Publication; Company Policy; Human Factors; Procedure
While reviewing the SID and release prior to departure (ABQ3 Runway 8); the First Officer and I noticed that the required climb gradient was very steep. We determined it may be difficult to meet the gradient and contacted Dispatch for guidance. I was unable to get in touch with Dispatch via phone. I then contacted a base chief pilot for guidance; who referred me to the Director of Operations. I was unable to get in contact with the Director of Operations until after departure. I then contacted another chief pilot for guidance and was referred to contact Dispatch again. I was able to talk to Dispatch and asked if we needed to run the climb analysis tool that we perform in ZZZ since this gradient was much steeper than ZZZ. Dispatch informed me that there was no need/requirement to run the analysis. I verified multiple times that this was the case; even with a steep climb gradient. Dispatch confirmed that no climb analysis was needed.I briefed the First Officer that we would need to fly a performance climb and ensure we were above 1;600 ft./min at a 200 Knot climb. After takeoff; we maintained the highest practical climb performance with E-climb; but were unable to maintain the needed vertical speed for our airspeed. We tried leaving the flaps at 9 and after that didn't work; flaps up with a climb below 200 Knots. I estimate we maxed out at 800 to 900 ft/min at 180 Knots. It was apparent that we would not be able to climb at the required rate with any configuration/speed and we made a right turn as assigned by ATC. We avoided terrain by executing the turn; but in IMC or without a quick turn crews would be in danger of CFIT. I was able to get in contact with the Director of Operations after landing to explain my concern with this departure. He pointed me to Training Bulletin XYZ; which referenced SID climb tables. This bulletin references ZZZ SIDs and it was not readily apparent (at least to me) that it would apply to other airports. After referencing the data cards; it appears that the required climb gradient of 470 Ft. per NM may not be achievable by the aircraft. While technically; there is a sentence in the training bulletin that states applicability to other airports; we have not received any training; memo; daily read; email; etc. on climb analysis at airports other than ZZZ. I was also a bit frustrated that it is recently getting harder to contact support resources by phone. I spent about 20 minutes trying to get help on a safety sensitive concern with no real available/wrong answer. While I take responsibility for this event; I followed the note on the training bulletin to contact dispatch when in doubt. I believe the company needs to issue a training; memo; etc. to make other pilots; Dispatch; and Management aware of the need for this analysis at other airports and include this on the 10-7 pages. I think this threat could result in CFIT if not corrected. While ATC would hopefully intervene; a crew could run into a situation where a GPWS (Ground Proximity Warning System) escape maneuver may not physically be able to clear the terrain without a non apparent turn in IMC.
While reviewing the SID and release prior to departure (ABQ3 Runway (RWY) 8); the Captain and I noticed that the required climb gradient was very steep. We determined it may be difficult to meet the gradient and contacted Dispatch for guidance. The Captain was unable to get in touch with Dispatch via phone. He then contacted a base chief pilot for guidance; who referred him to the director of operations. He was unable to get in contact with the Director of Operations until after departure. Then the Captain contacted another Chief Pilot for guidance and was referred to contact Dispatch again. The Captain was able to talk to Dispatch and asked if we needed to run the climb analysis tool that we perform in ZZZ since this gradient was much steeper than ZZZ. Dispatch informed the Captain that there was no need/requirement to run the analysis.The Captain verified multiple times that this was the case; even with a steep climb gradient. Dispatch confirmed that no climb analysis was needed. The Captain briefed the me that we would need to fly a performance climb and ensure we were above 1600 feet/min at a 200 Knots climb. After takeoff; we maintained the highest practical climb performance with E-climb ; but were unable to maintain the needed vertical speed for our airspeed. We tried leaving the flaps at 9 and after that didn't work; flaps up with a climb below 200 knots. We estimated we maxed out at 800 to 900 feet/min at 180 knots. It was apparent that we would not be able to climb at the required rate with any configuration/speed and we made a right turn as assigned by ATC. We avoided terrain by executing the turn; but in IMC or without a quick turn crews would be in danger of CFIT. The Captain was able to get in contact with the Director of Operations after landing to explain his concern with this departure. He pointed the Captain to Training Bulletin XYZ; which referenced SID climb tables. This bulletin references ZZZ SIDs and it was not readily apparent that it would apply to other airports. After referencing the data cards; it appears that the required climb gradient of 470 Ft per NM may not be achievable by the aircraft. While technically; there is a sentence in the training bulletin that states applicability to other airports; we have not received any training; memo; daily read; email; etc. on climb analysis at airports other than ZZZ. I was also a bit frustrated that it is recently getting harder to contact support resources by phone. The Captain spent about 20 minutes trying to get help on a safety sensitive concern with to no real avail/wrong answer. While we as the flight crew take responsibility for this event; we followed the note on the training bulletin to contact dispatch when in doubt. I believe the company needs to issue a training; memo; etc. to make other pilots; Dispatch; and Management aware of the need for this analysis at other airports and include this on the 10-7 pages. I think this threat could result in CFIT if not corrected. While ATC would hopefully intervene; a crew could run into a situation where a GPWS escape maneuver may not physically be able to clear the terrain without a non apparent turn in IMC.
An Air Carrier pilot reported they could not comply with the climb gradient on the SID and ATC had to vector them for terrain clearance. The pilot reported dispatch advised them they did not need to perform a climb analysis prior to departure.  The reporter had  difficulty contacting company prior to departure to receive guidance related to their concern.