Yohane ' s redeeming feature is that I REALLY like her voice . <| sep |> hmm I don ' t mean to sound stupid but what happened to the x that is outside of the parenthesis to get 13 ? the first one in x 3 x 10 <| sep |> Yes , if you want it . I never heard of it before , but it seems cool . <| sep |> he is the number 1 engine after all <| sep |> Thank you for the constructive reply . However , . I have a few issues . I realize this will probably have bad analogies , jump around , get into semantics to a point , but I ' m very interested in this very topic . intrinsic propertiesI ' m going to use this because it represents the idea of intrinsic value better imo . There is a mechanism to get from a list of intrinsic properties to a market value . That process is what defines a market I guess . The complex organization of infinite human value judgements . It ' s the mismatch of value judgements that allow trade in the first place . I value one bitcoin more than $ 730 . The person that sells it values it less than $ 730 . The fact that our values are different enables the trade . Intrinsic properties on their own cannot have any value without human subjective judgements . The sky is blue , chlorophyll is green , and gold is . golden . None of those properties are valuable in and of themselves . Until you add people to the equation . To expand a little , stones are hard , wood floats , and gold is electrically conductive . But again , absent humans ' subjective value of those properties , they have no value in and of themselves . intrinsic value gives something a market value . To be specific here , intrinsic properties cannot impart value , humans impart value based on them . As soon as value is mentioned it comes from subjective humans . The idea of value cannot exist in a world without humans . intrinsic value is the component of market value that would still exist if something was valued entirely at its intrinsic value . The value of gold if it were only used in industry , would be the subjective value of that use case . The same way we place value on a chemical or any raw material used in industry . But I would agree that if something has zero market value then it also has zero intrinsic value . This is kinda weird because nothing can have zero intrinsic properties . It does make sense though if market value is based solely on subjective value , and if there was no such thing as some value superceding human demand . Nothing grows with a value printed on it . We aren ' t bound by some natural law that if a thing is electrically conductive it must have a minimum of this or that value . Why not , if something ' s natural properties cause it to have market value ? Natural properties cause people to place values on things , each on a unique scale . Everyone values everything slightly differently . An ounce of gold could be worth $ 1500 to one person , $ 500 to another , and $ 1 to another . have you seen the Mark Dice videos where he can ' t sell a gold ounce for $ 20 ? It ' s all subjective . My point is , there ' s nothing about gold that imparts some natural value that can supercede the subjective value of individuals . In the same way that bitcoin ' s value is 100 % subjective , so is gold ' s .