At 1 . x this isnt that rare . Usually they have a lot of chest <| sep |> No but I ' ve got a buddy who would gladly help me cover you ! The two of us could pull it off ! <| sep |> Both of these require discussion , just like a player falling . You never mentioned that , you know . I always argued that a DM can ' t impose the fall . If you think it requires discussion , then we agree a DM can ' t decide on his own that a Paladin falls . And if you ' d read any of my posts I showed that you can easily do something for any class which is similar to a paladins fall , leading from thatThe Fall is unique though because it ' s the only case where the DM can decide that the character changed his feelings or his character , to use a better word . Which points at the core of the problem the DM changes something that should be offlimits for him . He can do everything with the world , but he can ' t change the thoughts and motivations of player ' s characters . Every class has the potential to have some sort of fall if your DM is any good , you ' re saying a paladins fall isn ' t fair because they have given you the option . I actually believe that only Paladins and Clerics can have real falls . All other classes have no necessary rules that can ' t be explained away somehow . Of course you can call a crippling some sort of fall , but that is equally applicable to all classes . The fall is unique to the Paladin and Cleric . And it ' s only socially acceptable for the Paladin for historical reasons .