Crusader Kings II - User Modifications
[MOD] Terra Normannorum (Development)
Thread starter Nuril
Nuril
Come one, come all! I hereby offer an open invitation to all interest to take up regions of interest to develop those areas in this joint mod-project. There's only so much I can do and I'm hardly very knowledgeable on the world outside Norse history during this time, so I appreciate all the help I can get. If there's something you feel like taking on be sure to post that you're doing work on it, so there's no conflict and to compare files if more than one is on the same subject. As you might notice I'm mainly doing work on Norse peoples at the moment. If there's something you feel should be changed in the state of the Vanilla game, not just in history files, then just go ahead and tell me in this very thread.
Please also try to set somewhat correct dates whenever possible, not just put a base-line at the default start-date. Wouldn't want to go through all the files to change them again if we end up thinking of moving it back a bit further. ​
Our ranges for Characters and Dynasties:
- Characters: 1.000.000.000 - 1.000.009.999
- Dynasties: 1.000.000.000 - 1.000.004.999
- Events: 1.000.048.000 - 1.000.049.999
Just request an Internal range within that so we don't get conflicts. I'll reserve the first ones up to 1.499/.999/.999 for myself for now.
Olvirki - Iceland: 1.500-1.999/1.000-1099/---
Zaldax - Byzantine Mediterranean: 2.000-3.299/1.100-1.499/9.000-9.299
Development basis for Contributors!
Focus of the project:
- Expanding the focus of the game to the year 1000 (As of the Battle of Svolder, 10th of September) throughout the game-world.
- Historical flavour and culture-specific content.
Secondary tasks:
- Getting Ásatrú and other pagan religions into a decent state for playing. A big majority of Scandinavia is still non-Christian at the start of the Mod.
Map expanded westward for optional Vinland content
[ Province Map - Vinland Expansion ]
This is a private side-project of mine that will be an optional add-on for the mod once the mod is both released and I find the time to separate it out again.
- Characters that converted religions and had a death-date prior to 1066 just have their convert-religion at birth. Need to specify conversion dates and change the base one to their pagan origin.
- Remember to create Duke/Count characters for pagan regions ruled by Christian Kings, otherwise the randomly generated ones are all Catholics, since their Liege is. If at all possible find historical ones, otherwise note them as " #Ahistorical ".
Overview of the current 1000CE map:
[Castille is really León, but it didn't default to it in this older version]
Zoomed in on specific regions:
Eastern changes:
South-Western changes:
Vinland:
Culture Map-mode:
De Jure Duchies:
Persia:
Buyid Dynastic Tree:
Direct Vassals map-mode of Persia:
[ Terra Normannorum - Contribute to Developing CK2 for the year 1000! ]
[ Obligatory Vinland Mod for Divine Wind. <3 ]
v1.3 as of 2012-1-8
birdboy2000
Megalomaniac
Sadly, I probably don't have the detailed knowledge to help out here, but good luck! Greenland's literally the only Catholic province which got left out, so a Vinland expansion would be neat. (Though OTOH it's not hard to see *why* Greenland got left out - and you thought Iceland was annoying to play!)
Against God and Kings: my CK2 AAR about a Slavic pagan, peasant republic.
Keanon
I don't quite get how you've used the ᚬ rune, but finally have you made your thread!
I will help where I can, when I can.
Also, the battle of Svolder is awesome.
Orinsul
Absent Minded
A very interesting and ambitious project.
If your pushing the date back it might to be worth looking at the Saxon Mod, or seeing what work the Carolingian Mod and others have already done on that front.
Also why not a viking name for a viking mod instead of a latin one? I mean its a great name, Im just thinking some of those who might be interested and would help on this mod might over look it think its about normans.
Don't Press the O
Please support this CK Suggestion thread Player Heir
birdboy2000 said:
Sadly, I probably don't have the detailed knowledge to help out here, but good luck!
Well, you don't necessarily have to have huge foreknowledge on an area, it's more about putting in the effort. Of course most people aren't going to know the intricacies about the family of a Count in the Shetlands, but you do end up looking through info on it anyway, but thanks!
Greenland's literally the only Catholic province which got left out, so a Vinland expansion would be neat. (Though OTOH it's not hard to see *why* Greenland got left out - and you thought Iceland was annoying to play!)
Yeah, Eystribygð/Vestribygð are in there too. Though hopefully they should be quite interesting in the expanded map, since they're the launching point for the ventures into Vinland and the seat of power for the Eiríkrætt (those of Eiríkr hinn rauði).
Keanon said:
Honestly, the top part of the image is a result of it being murder trying to transliterate between Latin and Younger Futhark. Better suggestions are welcome, might've been mistaken about the versatility of the sounds associated with Ansuz.
Orinsul said:
Yeah, will definitely check for their advice on those topics, even if they aren't pushing back the start-dates themselves (referring to the Saxons, obviously the Carolingian one is, but it's probably not very compatible since they work from further back).
I was originally going to pick something spiffy from the Sagas, but after spending a lot of time re-reading things and cross-checking them with the Old Norse equivalent I ended up going back to my backup-name, since they didn't really lend themselves well to a Mod-name (the writing style itself is a bit isn't concise enough). It pains me to no end to put a latin name on it, but it did seem like the best option by that point!
Besides, if they wouldn't even open the thread long enough to see Sweyn Forkbeard having his Funeral-Ale over the death of Harald Bluetooth, then..
I would write it as ᛏᛂᚱᛅ:ᚾᚢᚱᛘᛅᚾᚢᚱᚢᛘ
Dotting the Isa was used for E's after about 900 and as seen on the Jelling stones, Úr was used for O without trouble.
Óss is a nasal A, and I personally haven't seen it used for O, although I just looked it up and Wiki thinks this is so.
Was it used for the Scandinavian 'e' or the English one (iih-like)? It's hard to see the comparison via text. It's not a real sentence, it's the mod's name transliterated, after all. But are you sure that's the preferred one? It doesn't really turn up much when searching for it, so some links could be nice. The character set doesn't have one for that and it's not listed on the Younger Futhark list.
Updated the image, though, but still would like to know.
Old New Alt
It's not a separate rune, it's more like e and é is the same letter but represents different sounds.
And it's phonetic value isn't written anywhere, but I'm guessing it's like the e in the word 'send'.
Dotting runes is something that started in the later Viking era, before that one would've just written it with Isa.
However, having read into it further, it seems that in the Óss case that it did evolve into an O.
Runes can of course be hard to work with, having been rather regional and sometimes up to the creativeness of men. Like they knew people would look at it later and go "Wtf is that?"
I mean, Óss could be written in seven distinct ways in the Younger Futhark, it transliterated into a nasal A at least at first, with the regular A sound migrating to the Ár rune, developed from Elder Futhark's Jára.
You can read what Wikipedia thinks here
So you can argue for the O's in Normannorum to be written as Óss as you did at first, using it as an E as you did in Tera is definitely not a usage I'd see as arguable.
So, for E you either either use ᛁ or ᛂ
And for O you can use either ᚢ or ᚬ
One must understand when dealing with runes that they never stopped developing and that from Hedeby to Nidaros or Uppsala to Reykjavik, runes were prone to end up slightly different.
Hence, you can choose to write it early era, short-twig, long branch, late era or something in between.
My initial concern was mostly that I actually couldn't read it at first.
"Taranarmanarum? Oooh."
Anyway, I've gotten a bit sidetracked, but I'd say use either of these two, the one you find prettiest:
ᛏᛁᚱᛅᚾᚢᚱᛘᛅᚾᚢᚱᚢᛘ (This is more correct if we take the Jellinge Stones, carved 40 years before the start of the game as indication of the trend at the time, except the M which would look like what you see here, a rune sadly not present in Unicode.)
ᛏᛂᚱᛅᚾᚬᚱᛘᛅᚾᚬᚱᚢᛘ (This will look better due to variance in runes.)
Unless of course you'd prefer short-twig, which are Swedish/Norwegian variations that I am less familiar with.
For more reading, if you wish to become smarter, this and is a good site
Uuhh.. Sorry about the wall of text, and the mess.
I like the subject o
Yeah, mainly picked the Danish long-branch because they're more elaborate and it's a graphical design. Though I keep it limited to specific Younger Futhark sets, since that's when the mod is set.
Well, can't say I actually expected them to be read (and I guess my transliteration chart used was a bit wrong), but good to know there are Rune-literate people around.
But thanks for the link.
Dutchling
You might want to not use those runes as I only see squares and I'm sure there are more people who can't see them either.
Dutchling said:
You can only see them if you have the character-sets installed for your operating system (same with Chinese/Japanese/Korean etc.), but since the introduction image is, well, an image that isn't an issue.
Erilaz
Danskr víkingr
Greetings Nuril!
It would seem, we are working on similar things.
I'm currently working on improving the Norse world to my liking.
At present state, I have added the count of the Færoyar, Sigmundur - (using Olav Tryggvessons Saga).
I've also added the houses of Palnatoke, Strut-Harald, and Vesete; tweaked some family-relations etc.
Furthermore, I've converted Småland, Blekinge, Bornholm, and Närke into Norse pagan provinces - also, made Sven, Duke og Östergötland, pagan. (Being "Blot"-Sven after all).
I will download your mod, and see what you've done so far.
I hope we might be able to work together (also maybe with Hundhedning?) to enhance the world of Northmen.
Norse Heritage Overhaul - CK2 HIP submod
Period Music: EU2 Nostalgia Mod - EU4 music mod
Old Portrait Frames - CK2 graphical mod
Better Combat and Immersion Compilation - Kingdom Come: Deliverance project
Scandza: Total War - Migration Period Rome: Total War mod
Haui that Skanunga ærliki mææn, toco vithar oræt aldrigh æn ; Gesaga him éac wordum, þæt híe sint wilcuman Deniga léodum
Question: Would there be anything in the available code that would allow me to kill a Titular Title by events relating to a specific character? I don't think I could find a satisfactory way to have Sveinn, son of Knútr inn ríki, be King of Norway and keep those listings correct without also making the North Sea Empire to let him have his son as a royal vassal. But I wouldn't want to do that unless I could automatically kill the title after the death of Knútr himself, since I don't intend on having some grand Scandinavian empire hanging around. If there is no way I'll probably have to screw Sveinn over and make him a duke so the realm is united.
Erilaz said:
Yes, hoping to be quite collaborative on this one, so that's nice. But about those decisions for converting provinces.. Why? Was there really not a Christian majority yet in Bornholm/Blekinge? Would love to have info on that.
Småland very obviously wasn't Christianized until very late and Närke doesn't really have mentions of attempts to convert it until Óláfr II of Norway is in exile and spends time there (but obviously it would just be groups of followers here and there, not sizeable demographics). All provinces in Sweden are Ásatrú in 1000, though, and the King (Óláfr the Swede/Skötkonung) doesn't convert until 1008 and as usual the serious Christianization can only begin after they get the King on their side. I need to figure out a way to prevent him from focusing conversion in Uppland (where his capital is due to economic considerations of the "King's Land"), perhaps if there are -% Conversion Chance modifiers I could add as province-modifiers to make it fairly hopeless to flip the most powerful home-turf of Ásatrú and better to focus on the historical South-West, though I'd have to familiarize myself with available commands and structures for this game first. At the moment all of the territory around Uppland is converted by like 5 years into Christian rule (Observer runthrough). It's insane.
Also the Sveinn in Östergötland isn't supposed to be Blot-Sven (note that his death date is many decades after the Civil War). I've asked the Devs directly about this in their Christmas Q&A thread and they told me that they view him and "Håkan Röde" as the same person and went with that version of history in spite of the contradictions......though Håkan Röde is just in the game as a Catholic King without the turbulent circumstances and as is the case with Óláfr back in 1008 they do actively push hard for conversion even if they were traditionally tolerant. They really need some sort of trait-modifier that would make a character not try to or be far less effective at trying to convert his provinces (possibly also making the Revolt-Risk be lower for them, but higher than normal for the Zealous).
Maybe make a condition of the local inquisition task that it be after 1070 or something, if the problem is the AI pushing everyting into conversion in the first generation thadt be an ugly but easy solution.
Wallain
You should consider adding Hedeby into the mod. It is the oldest Danish city and was the largest Nordic city at the time. Personally I would make it a county of its own with a castle (the city had some defences towards a land attack, and joined up with Danevirke), city and a bishopric(got one in 948). The province should be Asetro as Christians were still a minority at the time. Just a suggestion anyway.
EU4 Mods:
Scandinavian Flavour
The Generic Equivalent
Well, some pics of getting started on Scandinavian stuff:
As for Ásatrú, would someone with better knowledge on Denmark please point out which provinces, if any, has a majority non-Catholic population still:
Yeah, but I'd prefer something that doesn't just restrict it. Hopefully there is a -% chance to convert modifier. Would probably just need to restrict it for the Norse cultures until then, though, if such an extreme is necessary.
Wallain said:
Considering Jylland and Småland weren't considered to merit more than 1 province in CK2 I don't really see splitting the middle between Slesvig and Holstein into a brand new tiny province (which was historically destroyed in 1050+1066). More likely change the capital of Slesvig? Was it just the city that had a minority of Christians or was it the same in the region? Cities were pretty small compared to country-side population, after all.
I could really need some info on how far the Christianization had actually gone in Denmark, since it's very foggy and I don't feel I can believe Christian histories either, since they seem deliberately vague and downplaying it, not to mention the tendency of calling a whole region Christian just because the nobility might be, even if the majority of people aren't. :wacko:
According to the Swedish wiki it mentions the date of conversion for Denmark as "Danmark (1015)", so that'd be Harald II. Then Forkbeard still had a significant Ásatrú presence? Where would that be best represented?
I tried if I could add Viking shields for the pagans on the map, like you have special ones for muslims, but it's all 3d and not referenced anywhere in the interface files I could find :/
So I could change the shield under the portrait most likely, but their doomed to have either muslim or heater shields on the map
Also, I'm not sure about the religious spread, but if anything most archeology hints that the conversion was rather slow, so even if the kings and lords are christian, most people aren't by this time.
Could be nice to have unique ones, but if it wasn't possible it'd be best to leave it as the Heater Shields, me thinks. Not squares.
That Screenshot was just to ask for Danish assistance about what areas would be majority Ásatrú or Christian, so feel free to explain which areas were more Christianized.
Nuril said:
http://imgur.com/nAXfz,6PtYI,oHgJf,sKlYW
Viking shield for pagans.
And yeah, I just tried to retexture the muslim ones to make them appear round, but I couldn't assign them to pagans and test it :/ I hate when they use their damn XAC files.
And I couldn't say about the pagan spread, can try read up on it later but I need to clean my home now ^^
See, the problem with this design is that the middle bit will block out the centre of all Coats of Arms, since they aren't designed to go on such a shield. Not entirely sure it'd be best to be too faithful to the real thing when it's to display their "flag", of sorts.
Well, on both accounts keep me in the know.