Geoff Zanelli TJ Lindgren Tom Holkenborg (Junkie XL) Zak McNeil
Additional Music Additional Music Song Producer Additional Music Programmer
Label: WaterTower Music
Music by Danny Elfman
Everybody Knows - Sigrid (4:25)
The Justice League Theme - Logos (0:48)
Hero's Theme (4:17)
Batman On The Roof (2:34)
Enter Cyborg (2:00)
Wonder Woman Rescue (2:43)
Hippolyta's Arrow (1:16)
The Story Of Steppenwolf (2:59)
The Amazon Mother Box (4:33)
Cyborg Meets Diana (2:36)
Aquaman In Atlantis (2:39)
Then There Were Three (1:10)
The Tunnel Fight (6:24)
The World Needs Superman (1:00)
Spark Of The Flash (2:18)
Friends And Foes (4:14)
Justice League United (1:24)
Home (3:24)
Bruce And Diana (1:06)
The Final Battle (6:14)
A New Hope (4:36)
Anti-Hero's Theme (5:35)
Come Together - Gary Clark Jr. & Junkie XL (3:13)
Icky Thump - The White Stripes (4:14)
The Tunnel Fight (Full Length Bonus Track) (10:58)
The Final Battle (Full Length Bonus Track) (12:57)
Mother Russia (Bonus Track) (1:45)
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Mr.Unbreakable Replies: 0 || 2019-03-29 22:57:16
The cut's Snyder exists !!! Snyder himself has confirmed it. The movie has a duration of 3:40 hours. it's finished and you just need some effects retouching and you have the movie in your possession although it depends on the Warner executives.
MG Replies: 0 || 2019-03-28 17:26:31
Two new Shazam! tracks released this morning. What does everyone think of those
Hari Haran Replies: 0 || 2019-03-28 11:27:28
Nope, this score is still absolute garbage trash.
mpolonest123 Replies: 4 || 2019-03-26 15:00:24
Snyder confirmed that his cut of the film is essentially done, it's just up to WB to release it.
Scorefan 2019-03-26 22:21:48
I don't think WB release the Snyder Cut, because with the new way they take, it could affect the new movies.
But, i would like to see the Snyder cut
I could see it getting some kind of release down the line, it's not uncommon for Directors Cuts to pop up years after a film has left theaters. What I don't see is them shelling out money to finish/add effects or whatever other touch ups may be needed.
My personal hope is that (somehow) they get Junkie involved to finish whatever score he started, just to hear his take.
MrZimmerFan 2019-03-27 11:02:55
'I don't think WB release the Snyder Cut, because with the new way they take, it could affect the new movies.'
The Snyder Cut was a toned down version of the ORIGINAL version (drafted between Snyder and Terrio before BvS release in threaters and was very dark, and adresses the Knitghmare vision of Bruce), but the studio wanted something more lighthearted and fun, Snyder says the original concept was still in the Snyder Cut.
Totally, there are three versions of the same movie: the unmade, the Snyder Cut and WB cut
And wasn't affect the new movies, because Aquaman is same character was intended by Snyder (Wan work with him in that aspect, and the movie happens after the JL events and begins with a element of the Snyder Cut, with Arthur going to save a russian submarine) and Shazam, well the movie tells other story with an another character, but BvS happen.
About the James Gunn's Suicide Squad, well see.
tilibro Replies: 0 || 2018-10-11 05:47:46
Has it been confirmed whether or not Tom finished writing/recording any theme sketches or demos before he was replaced? If there were, it would be interesting to hear them.
The complete score is out there iwth Wonder Woman Complete Score
David Replies: 2 || 2018-07-04 18:06:30
Hi every body. Any news about the composers of future DCEU films like shazam or green lanturn corps ? Is there any rumeors who will compose them ?
I truely like hans zimmer move on from DCEU to MCU and compose the captain marvel.
dirty_score 2018-07-04 19:46:08
Pinar Toprak is scoring Captain Marvel. Hans Zimmer is with X-Men which is not in the MCU, yet.
Benjamin Wallfisch might be the one for Shazam since he worked with the director in the last 2 movies..
Mephariel 2018-07-05 16:37:44
I am ok with Zimmer or Powell anchoring the X-Men franchise. But yeah, Zimmer needs to get as far from DCEU as possible unless he is asked to score for future WW movies or Man of Steel movies.
dark knight Replies: 12 || 2018-02-21 12:10:24
I really hated this score for not using Clark's theme from MOS but this particular track "Home" is really growing on me. Still nothing tops Zimmer's magnificent theme
Michael 2018-02-21 13:49:20
I really hated the entire thing. Everything about it. Fuck WB, fuck Whedon, fuck Elfman.
I couldn't agree more. In context "Home" is really out of place, especially when there is already an established theme for Clark. On its own it's not bad at all.
That's how this score overall is. On its own it's actually a pretty damn good superhero score, with a good balance of themes and solid action writing. In context of the film and the DCEU in general, it's such a departure from the prior themes/style that was established.
meta 2018-02-21 14:24:30
cmon bro whaddaya expect? these dc people blew their wad with the Dark Knight and Nolan leaving, so they tried to keep it dark by employing GameBoy enthusiast Snyder who turned it into a farce. Zimmer wiping his ass with this was another nail in the coffin.
By this point with the whole gritty dark theme being an overplayed hand, the merging of these Superheroes took WB to the only one place they probably could still dig out some hope to salvage it - by mining the Batman and Superman cartoon series, hiring Whedon to punch it up a bit, and getting Elfman back to bring back the nostalgia (Im guessing Shirley Walker would have been the first person they call, but obviously she is deceased RIP).
Didn't work for many reasons, but whatever...I dont say FUCK EM....Not necessary.
@meta
And maybe the film was already a mess before Whedon came in too. Unless people know the whole story no one can point fingers. This is why hardcore fanboys bother me. They get so worked up over things that really aren't that big a deal. I understand not liking the film as is (and there are some truly bad moments there) but why start making assumptions before you know the full story?
Ian 2018-02-21 21:34:54
I think Elfman is a phenomenally talented composer, and I agree with "the whole gritty dark theme being an overplayed hand", but nonetheless Hans's theme for Superman really, really works within the MoS universe. So yeah, dumping it didn't make any sense, IMO
well i also think theres a little revenge at play with Elfman and Zimmer (Zimmer's dismissive insult to Elfman years ago about his music), which may explain why Elfman decided not to use Zimmer's music (outside of Wonder Woman, which was probably coerced by WB to include, albeit VERY briefly). I mean, if I was in Elfman's shoes I certainly wouldn't wanna use Zimmer's stuff after insulting my work.
These guys are pros and veterans, I HIGHLY doubt there's anything so petty going on.
Balfe 2018-02-22 14:40:28
Well, they had to deal with JUNK xl as the opposite. Anything will probably sound more professional and appropriate after that nonsense this 'composer' would have analized. And to be fair, all of you critiquing the Snyder style forget that a big part of that style was the nonsense crap that Zimmer 'invented' for the genre.
Yes, Man of Steel is not bad and has some great moments of ingenuity especially when they are not destroyed by Balfe's banal inability to be creative. And Hans' work on the Nolan Batman trilogy is very stellar, but mostly when it references his other styles - the grabling nonsense of the Bane music not so much.
But remember that Snyder had Tyler Bates as his house composer until he sold out to Warner Brothers' demands for Zimmer.....
Interestingly, Tyler Bates is nowadays one of the most promising composers out there with his work on Guardians of the Galaxy and the John Wick franchise.
While exciting work is done by Bates and Goransson, Zimmer experiments with sound design like he is Gil Melle out of an atonal postmodernist movement that passed out of style forty years ago, sounding like an old man being cool (if you don't get the reference, don't worry, you are ignorant....).
Meta your comment is based on smoke...
Do you have any idea of what Hans & Elfman's relation is ? How many scores Danny mixed at Remote Control ? That when Hans was writing Batman Begins, Danny was in the next room and Hans invited him to check what he was doing ? How many people from RCP Elfman recruited to help him ?
Actually Hybrid my comment is based on their separate interviews years apart. Zimmer's arguably dismissive comment years ago and Elfman's arguably stern remark about his theme being the only Batman theme, of recent note.
If they are both good friends who go to each other's barbecues on Sundays and drink beer together, more power to them. If they have a stellar working relationship, well, I obviously am not privy to that, but good on them. However based on what I've heard my impressions don't lean towards the latter.
If I'm wrong, I'm wrong.
Mike (OTM) 2018-02-23 04:39:37
Hybrid, what did Danny think of what Hans was doing? Since he tries to claim that no Batman composer after him wrote a "theme"...
Snoke 2018-06-06 01:48:33
The DCEU scores basically became like the MCU scores. Few uses of old themes but completely new. Like the Avengers theme is recurring but is their a distinctive theme for Iron man in the MCU? No. What's Superman's theme in the DCEU now Williams or Zimmer. Elfman should have just compiled the two. I've listened to videos of people combining the MOS and Williams Superman and it is not st beautiful.
Junkie XL Replies: 1 || 2018-02-26 14:51:10
I am sorry to fail you guys. I tried out some Hollandic beats. Hans master told me to make it more real, more serious. For me, serious means hard core. Hard core means more pump. Sexy pump that makes my bold spot shine. I like samples from the 90s. They make me shit-snatch. My term, don't use it.
So, I made a groove for the team. It sounded like the car squel from the Dutch show Salamander. This is my main theme. In a Junkie World, you will listen to my groans as I navigate Amsterdam. Mad Max - fuck you, Slag X. That is me.
I'm calling BS
Danny Elfman Replies: 24 || 2018-02-23 14:51:42
At the end of the day, the Zimmer style for Batman is now done. It had its ten years of glory but now sounds like bad advertising music as all of Hans' music tends to do after its cycle runs out.
Junkie does not have the skills to come up with a new style nor do any of the lackies Hans employs currently.
Good at doing additional, terrible at anything original.
Think back to the days of Powell etc and now we have Krazcynski. Fuck.
The Hans factory is dying finally. This is a positive thing for film art as Balfe was the epitomy of a drone/clone composer and now the industry is catching up.
They can get either a computer/Balfe to do the same thing or find someone who has actual skills and talent.
Maybe we can finally get some real composition here.
Oh, hey, Balfe turned into Danny Elfman, guys!
That being said, I agree with some of the above points.
Can somebody erase the troll?
Honestly, I do feel bad for Elfman, because for Chrissakes hes been doing 50 Shades of Grey these days, and the last memorable scores I have of him are from 2012. But I don't think Zimmer or even Elfman for that matter are done as yet. I predict by the end of this decade Zimmer will have a new wave in popularity wash in. I'm just waiting for Elfman's wave right now...not quite seeing it yet.
Yeah, Silvestri, Newman, Goldenthal and JNH too. The six most popular "new" composers, along with Horner, of the 80's and 90's.
Seven with Zimmer
Ahmad 2018-02-24 22:29:35
Yeah... I'm not sure about Elfman's wave. The guy decided to bring back his old Batman theme instead of actually writing a new one. He has to re-invent himself.
It was a missed opportunity.
I agree. His Justice League theme is just a deconstruct of his Batman theme. Clever, yeah sure - he's done similar things with the Men In Black sequels and I'm sure there's others I can't think of right now - but I personally dont consider Elfman's involvement in this new DCEU to be very welcome. Zimmer paints a different canvas than Elfman, and I love both their works.
I think it's worth noting that Zimmer's popularity at this point is largely under his direct control - meaning that if he were to decide to stop touring, go back to writing full-time, and return to his 'epic' thematic style, I think we'd see a surge in his popularity of the sort we saw from Batman Begins through til Interstellar. However, I just don't think he's interested, which is totally his right.
I certainly agree that the RCP proteges at this point are, frankly, shit compared to how they used to be. I mean, even a guy like Steve Mazzaro (who I genuinely like and who wrote some of the coolest cues in Chappie, and basically co-wrote BvS - a score I actually like) just utterly pales in comparison to the Powell era.
Actually, I have to take that back a bit; Wallfisch is a very, very talented guy, honestly so much better than someone like Junkie that I weirdly tend to forget he's under the RCP roof now.
Wallfisch is a good composer indeed, but BR2049 (and Dunkirk) were absolutely the wrong place for him. He's not a synth guy. He was originally a protege of Dario Marianelli, for heaven's sake - he's got a far more classical/orchestral sensibility. A score like Cure for Wellness is a much better fit for him. I'm not sure why Hans thought it was best to bring him of all people in on BR2049 when the more electronically-inclined Mazzaro/Kawczynski duo would have made more sense for a Blade Runner score (I say this based mostly on Chappie).
It would be good to see Kawczynski doing more.Chappie was excellent
Yeah, Mazzaro and AK would be more interesting choices, even Balfe.
Maybe Zimmer has more confidence in Wallfisch? He delivered Verbinsky's "Cure" gratuitously for him and then tied him up on two of his major projects last year.
When I refer to security, I talk about the "assurance of delivering a good job".
1000000% agreed that Wallfisch was the wrong choice for Blade Runner; I'd have been genuinely to hear a Zimmer/Mazzaro collaboration (Andrew K.'s stuff tends to be extremely grating, IMO), but they were both on tour last year, which might explain Wallfisch's involvement.
Now that I think about it, if Hans and Steve were on tour, and Wallfisch and Lorne were working on Dunkirk and BR2049, where was Kawczynski?
*genuinely curious
Medigo 2018-02-26 10:22:26
Considering IT. I dont see Benjamin as a bad choice for synthetic music myself.
Kawczynski did work on Wonder Woman last summer...as well as Mark Mothersbaugh's Thor Ragnarok, strangely enough.
JBSO99 2018-02-26 10:37:51
About Wallfisch, I agree with Medigo. IT had several cues with synths and those were great. And BR2049 was also great and I think a big part of the score was created by him and maybe Zimmer helped with the overall sound or with the themes.
That being said, I prefer Wallfisch doing orchestral tracks like A Cure For Wellness that in my opinion is one of the best scores of RCP from the previous year.
rockhound 2018-02-26 10:44:58
the funny thing with BR2049 is, that they hired someone, who couldn't deliver what the filmmakers wanted. then they hired someone, who had no time to do the movie, so they had to hire a third guy, who was also at the end the wrong guy for that project, because the music added nothing to the movie, just in a very few moments. the music was loud, but didn't create atmosphere. the music was just there. the one theme, that sounded a bit like the the theme from The Fan was pretty nice and also effective, but that was all....sadly.
Because Kawczynski had 2 solo films (one being one of my fav' action scores of 2017) to score.
I'd say the music added a lot to the movie myself
But then I dont know why we're talking about BR2049 here
LOL what? Nonsense. The "not a synth guy" wrote the bulk and the heart of the whole score, the horse theme. It is featured in so many cues (2049, Sapper's Tree, Someone Lived This, Sea Wall, etc...). It is one of the most beautiful themes ever written. I've been listening to those tracks since October non stop. Don't think they could've done a better job. It's perfect.
As much as I love the movie, I don't think it would've had the same impact on me if it had been scored differently.
Wallfisch's contribution to Dunkirk was also great.
Wallfisch's contribution to Dunkirk was playing Elgar's Enigma on a 30-year-old keyboard.
, 2018-03-10 00:35:57
Yeah I sometimes think Hans can be over-generous with the crediting/praise for others.
Elfman,Zimmer,and other Composers styles may be dying but John Williams is still going strong. Always hop on the Williams train.
jewen Replies: 4 || 2018-03-26 20:39:14
Hybrid Soldier, Do you know if Junkie XL could finish his work on Justice League?
I other words...
Can we believe that there is a rejected score in some HDD of some computer in the planet earth?
I'm sure he was far in the process, and wrote a lot of cues already. Probably at the stage of mock-ups though, I doubt anything was recorded...
Apparently he did actually compose a good chunk, although it's a big possibility that it was just score demos for the completed scenes. So yeah, there is a good chance that they are on his hard drive.
Bondo 2018-03-26 21:41:31
Fingers are crossed that WB and DC realizes the terrible mistake they made in replacing Snyder/JunkieXL with Whedon/Elfman, and uses some of their DVD and Bluray sales to fund a Snyder cut. What's interesting is that Snyder has been leaking images from his deleted scenes on Vero, and there has been no reprisal from WB over ownership...
jewen 2018-03-26 23:06:24
Thanks a lot for response. I know that now is the promotinal campaig for the dvd/bluray...but sooner than later I strongly believe that WB will make an anunce. It is possible that they says we'll never see the original cut/work from Snyder and Co. or maybe they listen to the fandom and release what thousands of people are claiming more and more.
And the same to Tom Holkenborg's work to this movie.
Hope Never Dies.
Micah Replies: 1 || 2018-03-09 20:07:25
Junkie: "Just one week until my Tomb Raider - 2018 score is released!
Along with something else... stay tuned. ;)"
PLEASE tell me this is happening!
Nop, is one of his very interesting Studio Time
Jose Damian Replies: 0 || 2018-02-28 11:56:41
How it seems that Hans does not have many short-term projects, and it seems that snyder's cut will come out, it is possible that he is collaborating in the development of music together with junkie, since we have him back to the world of superheroes ?
Booby Replies: 0 || 2018-02-26 16:05:58
I hope I am done in the film industry. I went too Moroder, and no one goes too Moroder.
My buddies are administrators. They put the notes where they are meant to be. None of my good time artists are here as they left. I wonder why.
Steve R Replies: 0 || 2018-02-20 19:18:30
where is the Zanelli/Lindgren music in the movie??
Can someone please answer this for me; why would the studio be opposed to Junkie putting this music out there in promo form? Or any rejected score for that matter. It seems strange that they wouldn't want music released that isn't going to be used anyways. Just curious.
It's a good question. I guess you might also say why does it matter if you get a bootleg of a complete score, so long as you also legally own the album you're not really "stealing" anything because it's not available to buy in the first place. But that's not how the law works. JXL wrote that music under contract and Warner can do whatever they want with it, including but not limited to locking it in a vault until the end of time.
Does it make sense? No. But studios are weird about their property, and there's not much we can do.
That does make sense. I can definitely understand them being wary about recording sessions, considering that is still a part of the film. But if JXL went to them and asked if he could put out the music, I wonder if they would be against that. Very strange if so....
... Replies: 1 || 2018-02-10 20:25:08
So apparently Junkie DID in fact write a sketchbook for the film, along with demoing up a big part of it. The question is, how much did he actually get to write for?
dirty_score Replies: 0 || 2017-12-23 16:29:05
I can't be the only one to have noticed that Cyborg's theme is the same as Terminator Salvation. Another movie in which Elfman ditched the iconic and classic theme to write his very own.
Sources confirm this days on social media that Zack Snyder Original Cut of Justice League not only exists, but have VFX's work and Junkie XL's score on it.
That could be really EPIC.
The Fight for this can happens is bigger every minute passes, dont lose the faith, not now.
Leonard Dante 2017-11-24 01:54:26
Perhaps. But it would be a disrespect to Whedon and Elfman. Okay. If that means more money on the table, they will.
cody 2017-11-24 03:59:39
imo whedon and elfman screwed up the movie, i'd say Zacks original cut would be better, then again thats just me tho
scarecrow9 2017-11-24 06:15:30
Hybrid, do you think that the Snyder´s Cut could really exist somewhere? Let alone with Tom´s score, do you think that he even began scoring the film? I would love to see that version. Thank you for your answer
Solomon 2017-11-24 11:21:50
@scarecrow9: Wikipedia says that filming originally wrapped in October 2016, and that Zack was taken off the project in May 2017. That's at least 6 months of post-production, so hopefully yes.
@Leonard Dante: You don't think it's disrespect to Snyder that the film bears his name but Whedon cut it up and redid his story with terrible reshoots and replaced his nominated composer?
Lastly, I will say that I watched the film earlier today and thought it was absolutely terrible. The best part was the few seconds where Zimmer's "Krypton" theme was playing in the scoutship!
GR7 2017-11-24 16:43:52
Exactly Solomon !
THe use of the krypton theme in the spaceship scene made this moment more intense and it felt... natural... as if the rest of the music doesnt blend in the atmosphere we were used to with the previous movies.
Rigby Replies: 15 || 2017-11-21 03:10:40
Seeing as how Lorne Balfe "leaked" his own score, I wonder if Tom could easily do the same?
Kingfannypack 2017-11-21 05:09:44
Which score would that be?
Ghost in a thing that doesn't have life but does
GITS was unreleased, JXL's JL score was completely rejected. The real qustion is how many rejected scores have leaked in the history of modern film scoring?
Gabriel Yared leaked his Troy back in 2004 but I think he got in quite a lot of trouble for that. There's a reason he hasn't done too many high profile films since then, I think. A few rejecteds have slipped out over the years but it's pretty unheard of for the composer himself to be the one to leak it I think, that would be career suicide if they got caught. Usually they come out the same way complete scores do, some anonymous person working on the scoring team probably did it.
There you go. So we probably will never get to hear what Tom planned/did for this movie. I really believe that it would've been great compared to the generic score we got.
Only two tracks stood out to me and only one was an actual cue from the movie.
The studio is the music owner now.
I certainly understand the criticisms leveled at Elfman's JL score, but I'm not at all convinced Junkie would have been a better option. I've never been too convinced by him anyway (Mad Max was a situation where his sound happened to be a good fit, but even then I think a better composer could have made much more out of the same ingredients). And since anything worthwhile in the previous two (and yeah, I'm aware I like MoS and BvS waaaaaaaay less than the average reader of this site) ended up being by Hans anyway, I really doubt Junkie flying solo would have been up to much. My guess is he would have pulled out stock, barely-altered reprises of Zimmer's themes all over the place without adding much new material on his own, which would have satisfied the DC fans more than what Elfman did, sure, but would have been a lot less interesting as a score album. I mean, say what you want about the questionable thematic decisions Elfman made, the two gigantic full-length action cues are pretty solid in and of themselves. I'll take that over Junkie letting the drums pound for eleven minutes straight, any day of the week.
Gotham Rogue 2017-11-21 17:58:50
Edmund, I somewhat agree - I've seen very little from Junkie to make me think this would have been a groundbreaking, wonderful score. However, maybe it's the Zimmer fan in me, but I would have loved to hear "stock, barely-altered reprises of Zimmer's themes all over the place" in this score. So many scenes begged for just that. Compositionally it doesn't make for an interesting soundtrack or film score, I agree, but I would be willing to sacrifice that for thematic continuity.
@Edmund
Given the chance I think Junkie probably could deliver a pretty fun score that stayed thematically consistent with the current universe. It all depends on what the studio/director wants out of the music. The biggest disappointment to me is that this was a huge missed opportunity to do a heroic take on Zimmer's Superman theme, something we haven't heard since MoS. Hell, even the trailers did that.... -_-
The score reflects the situation of DC movies very well. If Zimmer, like Snyder, continued, the result may not please everyone. A lot of people were unhappy with Snyder's work in the genre, just as many fans of soundtrack were with Zimmer's contributions that never followed the path taken by all the other composers who came before him.
The two left (regardless of the reason that led them to do this).
When Zimmer left everyone knew that XL would not hold the pressure or that the result would not be satisfactory for most.
When Elfman and Whedon were announced we all knew that they were hired to go against everything DC has done before to try to reach the first film of the franchise to reach 1 billion. Even if they were to follow Marvel's script and drop their originality.
But the hiring of Elfman and Whedon shows that the studio was long lost. Snyder succumbed to BvS. The only salvation for the DCEU are the solo films like Wonder Woman, the next Batman, Aquaman ...and freedom. Freedom for the directors, composers... Warner has always had this advantage over Marvel.
Honestly, the purpose of RCP is essentially to take Zimmer's style and make it widespread for use...WB not using ANY RCP to score this seems to have been deliberate, as there's literally no reason it couldn't be done.
James 2017-11-22 13:53:55
I agree that Elfman's theme fits into Nolan's films as long as they are adapted to them. However, I think the way things have gone was not bad. TDK trilogy was marked as a project fruit of Nolan's unique vision. Although the themes do not respect the orchestral tradition are more memorable than those composed for more than half of the films of heroes of the last 25 years.Zimmer's entry into the genre can be interpreted as a breath of fresh air in a saturated marketplace at the time. But I agree that the lack of originality these days falls on Zimmer and his company and that the goal of it goes far beyond bringing talents to light.Now we need something new, again.
@Olive: Rumors says Zimmer didn't want compose Justice League because of Snyder, and left behind Junkie
Were the two men no longer talking or did Zimmer anticipate Snyder's departure as he did in Pirates?
I heard and thought that Zimmer stopt scoring superhero movies (including Justice League and what comes after) because it has taken 13 years of his life and he wanted to do something else
Scorefan Replies: 11 || 2017-11-16 04:46:02
h t t p s : //www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4jbBeshH3s
Elfman must have balls or be a damn old prick to speak like that about Zimmer music. How can someone can shit on someone else's job like that and state that his batman theme is and will be THE only batman music ever....
Old news...
Brent 2017-11-16 18:01:11
Danny Elfman IS talented. That I have no doubt about. However, this has just solidified what a toolbag he is. Seriously, ONE theme? Are you freakin' kidding me? Not only is that disrespectful to Hans and James, but also to all the other countless composers out there that have worked on Batman related material the past 40 years or so. What an ignorant and blatant disrespectful statement to make.
I seriously hope he apologizes, or at the very least, clarifies his statements.
Apologies are desnecrssary thing in this case. Hans calls Elfman theme of "happy and jolly" in a interview of 2005.
Olive, the major difference between Zimmer's "happy and jolly" statement and this one by Elfman is that Zimmer backed it up by relating his comments to tone. The tone/structure of Elfman's theme wouldn't work within the universe Nolan created for TDK trilogy. Please tell me how Danny justifies using his theme from 1989, other than "it's the only true Batman theme".
Elfman may have taken these comments a little seriously and decided to hit back.
Except that Zimmer's "happy jolly" comment was completely off the mark. That's now how I'd describe the tone of Elfman's Batman theme at all. It's brooding and dark, but in more of an old-school Gothic orchestral kind of way that still allowed for some bursts of heroism. I still maintain the theme itself could have worked in Nolan's films, albeit with substantially changed orchestrations and tone (and doesn't Zimmer kinda-sorta quote it at 7:18 in "A Dark Knight" anyways?).
I think what Elfman said is not true.
Batman has different themes for different movies because every Batman is different.
Michael Keaton as Batman: Elfman's Theme
Christian Bale as Batman: Hans' Theme
Ben Affleck as Batman: Hans & Junkie's Theme.
Of course much more but the most important.
Each one if dies Batman's have a different story and a different universe. I think that for each universe a new theme is the best thing you can do. With a different theme you can relate more to this Batman than a previous one.
By the way, I think TDK, MoS & WW are 3 of the top 10 themes by Zimmer. I think what Elfman did the WW theme is an abomination. He removed the key instrument in the theme because he thought it was childisch.
I think the Justce League score is way worse than previous DCEU or Batman movies. I hope that Lorne of Junkie will do future DCUE movies instead of Elfman.
(Seeing Justice League thursday. I am curious if it is really that bad as everyine says)
@Iamtommie You forgot the theme by Elliot Goldenthal for Batman Forever and Batman & Robin, for not to mention the theme from the 60's TV show and all the themes for all the different animated motion pictures such as The Dark Knight Returns, Mask of the Phantasm, or the videogames like the Arkham series.
Batman's musical legacy is very big so him saying there is only one theme and his the one he created is really disrespectful to a big amount of composers.
@JBSO99 you're right. It's so big and widely spread.
And you're right about me forgetting those score. I just picked these three because Elfman critized Zimmer
and Zimmer criticized Elfman...back and forth, etc. So what? The movie is lame, the score is about as lame as Bat V Sup
JBSO99 Replies: 4 || 2017-11-19 10:56:42
After watching the movie, I just have to say it was okay. It had some great moments but for me it had also many problems. And one of them was the music. For most of the part it wasn't even noticeable and when it was, it was like random background music with no really emotion or heart.
BvS and MoS movies can be criticized for some things but the score is not one of them. The movie gave the movie a strong and powerful side, as well as a heart and emotion into it. In this movie there were so many moments that needed different score.
***SPOILERS***
Superman's resurrection needed the MoS in full epic form. Wonder Woman at the bank at the beggining needed her theme with the electric cello in full power.
The Batman theme at the beginning when he is after that Parademon.
We should have a really memorable theme for the whole Justice League as well as for each individual member.
The scenes with Clark and Lois at the house in Kansas and when his mother sees him, this needed the piano theme from This Is Clark kent or something like that.
And that final moments with Superman opening his shirt showing the Superman logo and then flying to the sky, we needed something like "What Are You Going To Do When You're Not Saving The World?" or "Flight" and not that unmemorable music we got.
I really hope that the petition of the Extended Cut of the movie made by Zack with Junkie's music gets to be released someday, but for now, I'm disappointed.
Horner and many others with Star Trek is a good example too.
@James I don't know what you are referring to exactly, but I think that Horner's score in Star Trek II is a great example of a follow up movie score within the same universe.
I think all of those movies use the Alexander Courage theme for the original series but they still have some original material of their own and that's what Elfman should have done if he wanted to use the old themes for Batman and Superman. He could have used those in some moments but also keeping some material from BvS and MoS and creating new themes for the new characters and the League.
They all respected the theme of Courage, but each new composer brought a different sub-theme to the franchise.
Yeah, that's what I thought you meant. And that's what Elfman should have done if he wanted to use the old themes.
scarecrow9 Replies: 2 || 2017-11-19 17:22:35
what do you gyus think about this?
www . youtube.com/watch?v=9riigqWjovM
"Don't believe everything you hear, son."
This is a kind of Chappie mixed with Arcade of MoS.
Kal Replies: 0 || 2017-11-19 13:28:03
Anyone else think Hans knew about all the studio meddling during pre-production, the rewrites etc and walked away ? I mean, when I heard Elfman's score I thought it was generic and wouldn't fit the movie. Then I watched the movie and it fits well. The movie is just as bland as the music in the background.
ThomasFernandoMusic Replies: 0 || 2017-11-19 07:10:44
Any ideas on the Chronological Order of the Tracks?
I made a start here...
Batman On The Roof
Everybody Knows - Titles
Wonder Woman Rescue
Icky Thump
Aquaman In Atlantis
1m1a Krypton (from Man Of Steel)
Spark Of The Flash
Come Together - Credits
Anti-Hero Theme - Credits
edsonrln Replies: 2 || 2017-11-16 15:12:03
Are these "Full Length" tracks from the JL: Extended Edition?
Yep. The three last tracks.
ThomasFernandoMusic 2017-11-19 07:03:03
No, they are the full score cues- as presented in the film. The presentation of the final three tracks on the first disc are edited down for timing.
Ds Replies: 23 || 2017-11-15 22:27:34
In the movie there are a few scenes that scream for Clark Kent's piano theme. You know, tracking shots in corn fields around the Kent farm, quiet scenes with Lois and Martha... but no. Not only did Whedon/Elfman reject Zimmer's theme, they even composed ANOTHER quiet piano theme to play during these scenes. Needless to say, that piano theme has nowhere near the heart and the identity of Zimmer's.
What the hell is wrong with these people? Clearly a lot of things went wrong during production, but the whole thing is probably even worse than Suicide Squad.
dat drama
No really the film is hilariously (or not) bad...
I don't even want to blame Elfman anymore, I just feel sorry for him he had to score it...
... 2017-11-16 00:20:24
Well apparently only 15% of the movie are changes by Wheedon so some of the blame has to go to Snyder.
Then why 90% of the Superman scenes are reshots (with the most aweful CGI-removed stache ever lol) ?
To quote Bat V Sup : "In your dreams, Alfred !"
unofficial answer:
Payback for Zimmer dissing Elfman in years past.
Reason for using Wonder Woman Theme: WB probably coerced him to use it from the success of Wonder Woman, but he only used it briefly.
Still trying to figure out the significance of the ukelele riff in this...Is there some kind of Italian/Mafia Superhero or something in this movie? Odd...
HunterTech 2017-11-16 07:06:59
Hybrid, if Snyder went out and said that JL was still mostly his film, are you still gonna think that it's WB trying cover their backs?
Whedon would've gotten a director credit if he actually contributed a ton. There's no way they would've passed the film with only Zack's name on it, if that were to be the case.
HunterTech, so officially Klaus' name is on POTC, did he contributed a ton to the final score ?
Just contracts & politics...
had Geostorm not the same problem? danny cannon and jerry bruckheimer were in charge for the heavy reshoots. i havent seen the movie, but in the latest trailer, both weren't mentioned. Did they get a big credit?
Ds 2017-11-16 09:31:22
@Meta: if I remember well, this riff is used in scenes involving a Russian family living very close to the final battle stage (a remote location in Russia). They are random citizens whose purpose is to be saved by the Justice League in order to avoid criticisms of "too many casualties".
isildur 2017-11-18 16:45:09
Came back from watching the movie and I couldn't agree more about what @Ds said. Adding to the scenes you mentioned I really felt instead of the intro song they should have played a variation Clark's piano theme it would've been so perfect as that whole sequence depicts a direct consequence of Clark/Superman's death and the loss everyone feels.
**SPOILERS**
And how fucking epic it would've been if MoS theme was played in all it's glory when he comes to their aid and punches Steppenwolf in the face.
What a wasted opportunity and did they reshoot all Cavill's scenes? His face looked so weird in almost all the shots with the CGI removed moustache.
Yes they did.
That Phantom Stache is in 90% of the Cavill shots...
Warner/DC died and chose Whedon to nail the coffin...
I hope like Superman 2, that one day, we'll get the "Donner's Cut" of this movie as it was supposed to be, because I think it was almost finished (even the score I'm sure Tom had written a good part of it).
The movie itself is bad on so many levels and adding to that in many scenes I was shaking my head as I was hearing a completely different score in my mind, but there it was, something which took me out of the movie. Disappointed.
Do you think Whedon would've convinced the producers to replace the composer(s) if Hans was scoring this along with Junkie? I can't imagine what the uproar it would've created.
Watched this movie yesterday and it didn't make the score any better. It's not the worst thing I've ever heard but after what we got with MoS & BvS it's just disappointing. There's so much missed opportunities. Both the movie and the score had so much potential but it's just flat.
The problem isn't just Elfman or Whedon, it's WB! They wanted the change in direction and that's really sad.
Mortifer V. 2017-11-18 18:39:14
This film is atrocious. Suicide Squad was a mess but that film was forgivable. What WB decided to with JL is embarrassing, to say the least. Forcing Zack to change the tone and add forced childish humor and quips, demanding a less than 2-hour runtime, extensive reshoots with Whedon in charge... wtf were they thinking?
It's interesting to note that Zack hasn't even seen this abomination yet.
Did Tom actually record anything for the film or did he just do demos?
I honestly have no idea... But I can't believe back in June when he left he hadn't done a bunch of the score already...
I wouldn't be surprised if he wrote another long sketchbook for it...
I can confirm that he had already worked on it quite a bit, because he said so in one of his Studio Time episodes.
The funny thing is an interview he gave 1 months before being replaced... Saying pretty much the opposite of Elfman !
"It's a massive undertaking. And I can't say anything about Justice League specifically, but I'll tell you this, and this was exactly the same experience that Hans and I had when we did work together on Man of Steel and Batman v Superman: It's like when you see a movie like that, these iconic superhero movies, some of them have a 60 to 80 year legacy, multiple composers had a go at their themes, multiple filmmakers did their version of these characters—it's very scary. You watch a movie and it's like, "Holy shit, now I have to come up with something." You've got sweaty hands and you're nervous, and you talk about it over and over again—and I have exactly that relationship with Zack Snyder—and then Zack said, "There's only one thing you can do, and that is embrace this character as if it's your own, keep it close to your musical soul, and just do whatever you feel is the right thing to do for this character." That's the only thing we can do. That's what all these great directors did back in the day, and that's what all these great composers did back in the day. It makes no sense for me to do extensive quoting of Hans' score of the really amazing Batmans. It makes no sense for me to quote Superman from John Williams. Because all fantastic composers, they all did the same thing, they did something that was close to their heart, and I have to do exactly the same thing on this movie. You know this is Movie Number 4 that I'm doing with Zack, so you build a friendship and it's built on trust and loyalty. You know how to challenge each other, you know what to expect on the other side, and it's this really open, amazing dialogue about where to take this franchise."
Damn that sounds different from Elfman's comments
so...based on what junkie says here, Elfman is basically just rehashing old shit, as well as other people's old shit....Unless you want to say he's taking his Batman theme into a whole different direction that he didn't really have a desire to do before...until now....
In that case, "whatever" is all I have to say.
Meow 2017-11-19 06:21:47
* I posted this at filmtracks and wanted to share it here as well.
Danny Elfman's comments are very disrespectful and so disappointing for a creative person to hear, especially for composers. Nostalgia is a big problem with Hollywood and it's a simple Jedi mind trick. It's slightly different, but the same meal over and over with different seasoning. Imagine if James Horner didn't get to write the score he wanted for Spider-Man? Or Zimmer had to use Elfmans Batman theme for the DK triliolgy or BvS? Or Shirley Walkers incredible Batman theme for Batman: Mask of the Phantasm. Or Giacchino just used the original star trek theme, or the original Star Wars themes for Rogue One and created nothing new at all? How boring and uninspiring for the composers not being able to challenge themselves to create new original music.
Whether you like these scores or not isn't important, the pursuit to create something new is what drives a creative person and gives us freedom in choosing something to enjoy and not enjoy. I love the original Batman theme by Elfman but I love it in the Burton films. I love Zimmer scores for both the DK trilogy and BvS. I am happy I can enjoy both types of scores and films but there are those who don't and that's a great thing because that means we are not all the same and that brings variety of opinion and taste which creates real conversation and most importantly gives an identity to a project.
It's easy to go back to original ideas, but I respect the creators who actually take the risk and want to try and do something new. If Danny Elfman stands by his words he should have just used the original Batman theme from the Tv Show and film or the original Spider-Man theme. Oops he didn't and we got a whole new Batman theme and Spider-man theme which most of us love. Thank god he didn't stick to using the original themes. The Batman reboots and superman and Spider-man reboots are completely different takes on the characters and that's why they deserve their own new themes and soundscapes. The only time I think an original theme from a film should be used in a new film with the same characters is if it's actually a sequel or prequel connected to that actual original film. Re-boots should always have new original music.
In the end the comments from Elfman are simply stupid and uninspiring and it's definitely a hidden ego coming through I never new he had which is a shame. I remember what Zimmer said about Danny Elfman's Batman theme being a bit jolly, but that's not attacking Elfman at all, it's how he felt and heard the music and felt that that style wouldn't fit in the new batman films ect.. I have always found the original Batman theme a bit on the jolly side too and I love it because it nails Burton's take on the character and world. That theme is for Keaton's Batman, no one else's.
One final point, if we keep wanting to just revisit the past and hear and see the same thing over and over and not be challenged with new ideas, what a damn uninspiring and boring world of creativity we will live in.
All the best to you all!
Elfman just dropped a few more offensive comments about composers regarding batman and spiderman
https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/justice-league -danny-elfman-hates-reboots-scrap-classic-themes-1059632
What an arrogant guy
Funny I was laughed at when I said that film was 70% Joss Whedon, and Elfman just confirmed what I said ! lol
Snyder did too, actually, admitting has hasn't seen the finished movie...
#BringZackBack
#BringJXLBack
Yeah it was more of a Wheedon film. However I enjoyed the movie even though it was flawed. The score was horrible though.
After i finally saw the film, well in my opinion the film is incredibly. Watching those characters in a film is just like boy's dream.
I have watched every movie from Marvel and DC Cimenatic Universe, and i love both lines of cmics and for me, the first line of Marvel movies was the best in terms of narration. Iron man 1, the incredible hulk, thor 1, Captain america the first avenger were extraordinary movies. By now, i think Marvel/Disney go to the way of jokes to make the rest of the movies and i think this lost the interest in the movies, except with Captain America the winter soldier, Ant-man and captain merica civil war. Thor 3 is good, but for example Spiderman Homecoming was less good than Thor 3 but in sometimes i feel i am watching the same kind of movie. It's the same with the score, The incredible hulk, for me, is the best score for the Marvel series along with The winter soldier. One thing surprise me, "critics" put better scores for all the marvel movies except TV shows, and DC movies all have bad scores except wonder woman. And for me i enjoyed more the DC movies over Marvel movies. Man of steel and batman v superman were phenomenal movies and better than marvel movies. It's my opinion and Justice League is better than The first avengers. The tone of DC movies it's more like the comics and more dark, more serious. Maybe that's why i like them.
The same thing with the scores, i think The theme Arcade is the new superman theme. The themes for Batman (Elfman) and Superman (Maestro Williams) are iconic. But for the new kind of movies (The Dark Knight trilogy) the score Hans Zimmer and James Newton Howard made for the films were awesome. If you put old score (Elfman Batman) to nolan's films well the films lost their identity. DC producers take some risks to put the films into darkness and serious mode and it worked, but also the movies need to win a lot of money, that's why they changed the tone of the film to some king of marvel-ite tone. I hope the don't go to that way to replace the tone of DC of jokes and lighter action like Marvel.
Normally I'm not one for petitions but I think releasing an alternate version with JXL's score and whatever other changes they could make.
Danny Elfman's score has really been warming up to me the more I listen to it (on its own I don't think it's really that bad) but the lack of thematic continuity is definitely a sore spot. If Junkie could get a chance to rescore it, that would be a fair shake for Snyder and fans of Zimmer's work.
And if the critics put better scores to Marvel movies over DC movies, my opinion is they lost objectivity. the same kind with the scores.
The score is an essential part of the film, it's a character and it's important.
And the scores of DC have and identity.
"Joss said, 'Let's do it [Batman's theme] on the nose. Fans love this kind of stuff.'" Why do you have to ruin everything, Joss?
LS100 Studios Replies: 3 || 2017-11-17 16:41:18
After listening to this score a few times, I am starting to enjoy it. It's not fantastic, but it's not absolutely horrible, either. While I am very disappointed that Zimmer didn't score the film, and that Elfman didn't preserve the series' music continuity very well, I feel the score does hold up fairly well on its own. It introduces some nice motifs, and honestly, hearing the old Batman theme again is awesome, especially in tracks like "Then There Were Three" and "The Final Battle". Some may think it's out of place, but I feel it fits this iteration of the character. But then, Elfman gets lazy with some of the tracks. The opening of "The Amazon Mother Box" sounds like Elfman's theme for "Hulk", while the motif for the Justice League team is very reminiscent of the Avengers theme motif.
On the other hand, hearing the original Superman theme feels a bit odd - I love that theme, but the joyousness that Williams put into it doesn't fit this version of the character. Zimmer's amazing theme means so much in this series, and Elfman didn't reprise it once. Elfman did briefly reprise a trumpet rendition of Wonder Woman's theme, which was nice, but I personally expected to hear it a little more. And it made me even more confused as to why he didn't reprise other themes.
Personally I don't think Elfman was the best choice to score the film, but I don't think he did a horrible job. I would've loved to have heard Zimmer's score, considering the amazing work he's done for the series. Hopefully in the future, the themes he composed will be reprised more.
Well said. It's not a terrible score by any means, but the lack of continuity is incredibly disappointing. There were so many times in the movie that practically screamed for Hans' themes. The only point I heard one was the Krypton theme for (maybe) 15 seconds and that was just an insert from a previous film. I'd love to do a fan project once the movie is released and insert music from Man of Steel/BvS and see how it changes the feel of this film.
@Gotham Rogue That's what I think exactly. And when the complete score of BvS gets released/leaked we could have enough music for filling all the moments in the JL.
If they had kept MoS theme, I think people wouldn't be so angry at Elfman.
look what I found www . change.org/p/warner-bros-zack-snyder-s-director-s-and-tom-ho lkenborg-s-score-for-home-release-e90fef07-11c6-4a9a-9ae8-37 5c7717dafa
Justice League soundtrack 2017