THESE GLOVES be not either waterfroof or ZERO PLUS CONDITION , THEY get soaked quik and the liner break OFF REALLY EASY , I end up RIPPING the liner OUT and USE THEM AS A NORMAL GENERAL DUTY GLOVE ... UNFORTUNATELY THERE be not many glove that SUIT those characteristic , I be a BIG IRONCLAD FAN BUT THESE DO not live to THEIR EXPECTATION ... ... terrible !!