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You can follow your favorite podcast, so you never miss an episode if you haven't done so already be sure to download the Spotify app search for your podcast on Spotify or browse products in the your library tab. Also, make sure to follow me so you never As an episode of super women and thanks for listening. Hi, everyone. Its Rebecca you're listening to Superwoman. Today's guest is cat Lee currently a partner at Maverick on MAV. Iran is a very very very very large Venture Capital fund and why I thought it was interesting to talk to Kat as she has a fascinating story of how she went from working in Tech to then switching lanes and working in finance. So I hope you enjoy this episode. I'm here with a partner at Maverick on cat Lee and I'm excited because she has a really interesting career path. Starting at companies like Facebook head of culture at Pinterest and now a partner at a VC firm and we're going to get into some of the terms that I know are thrown around so welcome. Thanks for being here. Thank you so much for having me. So I would love to talk first about share a little bit about you your background. What got you into the tech space I started in Silicon Valley. I was born and raised in Santa Clara. Okay, so I kind of grew up with startups kind of getting all around me throughout high school and college. So it's just normal just every day somewhat. Yeah and my dad I sort of kind of lucked into my dad was a physicist turned engineer and I followed in his footsteps. So I majored in computer science at Stanford and I literally went into the company that he had worked at for 40 years, which was Lockheed Martin. Okay. I was on this rotation program and I quickly realized that I was not personally passionate about the defense industry. So I think I see My entire live and up until that moment sort of doing what my parents wanted me to do. And I think that a lot of that is cultural and then having this moment that that didn't lead to my own happiness. So I did what most people do applied for grad school to try to transition in my career and I went to grad school at Michigan to get my MBA. I knew that I wanted to work on products that I used every day. That was just something that was really important. Horton to me and so I ended up interning at Google and luckily I also got exposed to part of my internship was in India and so the sort of opened my eyes to sort of this global environment and even having the opportunity of living outside of California because up until that point, I was pretty much in California most of my life saw at Google that there's just an incredible culture incredibly talented people but the same time the company felt Really big and somehow I just knew that I want to get back into a start-up didn't really know how but I heard from Sheryl Sandberg just heard from her. It was like yeah, she's special. Yes. No. No, she spoke to all the interns and I happen to be interning in her group The all in sales and operations group. And I mean at that point in time like Cheryl was an icon to me and she said that she joined Google because she saw that it was a rocket ship when someone convinced her. That but she shouldn't automatically join a rocket ship and so I kept thinking. Okay. What's the next rocket ship? So I looked around at my classroom and saw that everyone was using Facebook in 2007. I was also really addicted to the product. So Facebook of course was not hiring MBA and interns or mbas in general. I saw that they were coming to campus to recruit Engineers. They were throwing a pizza party. I crashed the pizza party introduce myself to the recruiter told. Recruiter how much I loved Facebook and how much I wanted a role there and they luckily felt sorry for me came by the interview and that led to the offer. Wow, but things got even more interesting my boss at the time wanted me to drop out of business school. This is your boss at Google know at Facebook. Okay, and I had to figure out a way. I mean I wanted to join Facebook. I literally considered it. But then I also thought about the wrath of my parents of not finishing grad school and culturally I think that that's something that isn't, you know, it wasn't wasn't something I was willing to consider. So I talk to my teachers to help me graduate early and I ended up graduating early and went directly to Facebook in early March and there I had this amazing experience of leading a project called Facebook fund FB fund where it was sort of my first toe in the water into making investments into companies. Building on top of the Facebook platform using the social graph. Well, well, you gotta you gotta go back. Yeah to the lay the lay women listening and myself. What what does that even mean? So so Facebook's decided to open up a set of apis or it's a way for developers to use or to make their apps more social. Okay, and it was an opportunity to bring your friends along with you in any sort of application or perience whether it was on Facebook or off Facebook. And so Facebook would invest money in these startup apps to make them more social whether they were going to be integrated into Facebook or not. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, and the money actually came from Facebook's investors. Okay, and and the purpose was to help start up the ecosystem so that we could point to more examples of people building apps on top of the Facebook platform. Okay? Yeah, and so I was my first project worked on. Marketing eventually transition into developer relations and Partnerships and then my last rule was program management and building tools for developers and saw that growth at Facebook up until the IPO and that crazy group of 400 to 4,000 people was such an experience that I loved that I want to do it all over again. So I looked around for the next rocket ship. I saw, you know, I fell in love with using Pinterest. I was an early User in 2010 when it was invite only and I had met coincidentally the founder while I was working at Facebook and Pinterest was his side project. So I emailed him and jumped into Pinterest as a third product manager when we were 35 people started our growth team with another engineer and help the scale 200 million monthly active users and then was asked by our president to take on a role leading our B2B marketing team and help to scale to hundreds of Hands of dollars in revenue and then my last rule was stepping into head of culture and reporting to our Founders and scaling the organization across to really like bring our values to life. Wow. What an incredible career. I want to go back. Hmm. You know what I want to talk about what that conversation was like with your parents because you said culturally was really important that you follow in your family's footsteps. And you said not going to do that. So walk me through what that was like for you and then for them I think in some ways it was my journey to really learning about myself and really thinking for myself. I think that there is a lot of Asian culture that is very much like you respect your parents you I looked up to my parents and I think you know, I'm also naturally very achievement-oriented. So I think I had been following this Playbook of let's achieve, you know, I was valedictorian high school went to went Stanford and then started my career and then all of a sudden it didn't work. I didn't love my career. My I didn't feel like I was achieving or learning right and it kind of made me come to grips with who am I and what do I want out of life and what makes me happy and those questions led to me figuring that out along the way and figuring out at the very least. It's easier to figure out what you don't like. Like right and I was in pursuit of finding what I loved. Wow. And so that pursuing what you loved was more valuable than let's say the potential risk of upsetting your parents or right going against that grain. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I think I owe my parents also came around that's good. But they I mean even in that choice between Google and Facebook at that time. I think my parents I mean obviously like my great grandparents immigrated to the US it's like you take that safer path. Right, like my dad spent 40 years in one job. Yeah, and so when they're like Google they don't even know what Facebook was right here are like, why would you turn now this really great job for something that college students use, but obviously now they see that that was the that was the best path for me. Wow, and one other thing I wanted to ask you as you were talking about, you know, everything you studied the abysmal stats of women in technology and staying in Gee, I got exposed to this when we were developing our store Concepts and it was all men at the table developing a dressing room for women, which was weird. I began to just find out and research more about this and it's like I don't know like there's no women. What is it two percent or something? I stay in the pipeline. And so what made you stick with it? And what do you see that happens that so many women are just like this is not for me. Hmm. I think I grew up in a household that I mean I want to You daughters and I'm the oldest and I think that you know, I think luckily I was exposed to technology very early on even in the very early days programme because my dad was a programmer, so I didn't really strike me that I was the only woman until the workforce and I think it is hard there are moments where you feel alone and frustrated because no one gets you are understands you even in the latest part of my career. It's still a struggle. I Remember very vividly at Pinterest. There was a moment where I was the only woman in the room and I felt like I wasn't being heard and when everyone left I started crying and one of the other product managers came in and he was like, hey, what's up? And when I explained to my frustration, he said that he would help me and that was actually incredibly helpful to the point where when we had another meeting. He was like hey, Eyes, he like pounded the table cat is trying to say something. We all have to listen. Wow, and I think it is like well one I think is I felt incredibly grateful that I had an ally and that that makes you feel less alone. I think that it is changing because in some ways people are becoming much more aware that sometimes you do need to try to make room for different styles of communication and different people's perspectives because I think ultimately that That I mean all of the research shows that that makes any experience or any product better agreed. And so what made you then say? Okay. I'm at head of culture at Pinterest. I know you like to look for rocket ships. What made you pick something in the VC world as the next rocket ship because that's a very different path. Totally. I saw in my last year at Pinterest that stat that fortune put out there that out of all the Venture Capital funding only, you know less than three percent goes to all female founders. And that really shocked me I just thought what a missed opportunity and why is that the case and having had the privilege and experience of being at Facebook and Pinterest? I thought what can I do to help change that so I started Angel Investing not knowing what I was doing at first. Can you define what Angel Investing is? Yeah, it's where you take your own personal capital and you invest it into startups. Is that either because you feel very strongly about the people or the vision and what they're trying to build and you usually are the first money into that startup. And so I started learning as much as I could about Angel Investing. Of course, I had the previous experience of Facebook fund but that felt so long ago and I wasn't as well connected with the community. So I went to YC startup investor school and Y Z is y combinator it's one of accelerators in the valley and then I applied and got into the first cohort of first round capitals Angel track and it is a program where they take people who work at these startups and sort of introduce them to either Angel Investing or a cohort of people who are also interested in Angel Investing and I was very very grateful to be a part of that because that helps really open my eyes into That this could be a career path and this is something that I've got a lot of energy from and then that led to me joining Sequoia as a ior sequoia Scouts program, which is where they have a group of people that have the ability of investing Scout money into startups. What is gout money. It's a pool of funds that they've put together for in some ways Angel Investors. Okay, too. Invest on and then you get some benefit from finding or scouting companies. That's where the Scout word comes from. Gotcha. And then finally that led to me meeting a woman named alien Lee and alien of course was or is the founder of cowboy Ventures as well. As one of the women who started the all raised movement nonprofit that focuses on increasing the diversity of Founders and funders. And I spoke with her and she was really the first person to tell me that you should be a VC. Wow, and I really credit her to putting that thought in my head and making introductions to a lot of different Venture funds including macaron. And what did she see in you that made her say that I don't know. Haha. I mean, I think I think in some ways I think she is just an incredible person. Them and somebody who wants to give back. Yeah, I feel incredibly grateful to her bringing such awareness to the industry. Yeah, and opening doors to at least making the introduction and I think it takes women. I mean something that I keep in mind all the time of how can I give back? I think she truly open the door for me, right? And I just want to give a public service announcement to the women listening that you know, I had Patty sellers on and she said if women talked Bout money the way they talk about sex would be a lot further along. And so I think this is a really important episode because you're talking about investing and how women can get started with Angel Investing even small amounts. You know, my first investment was a thousand dollars in something and I was really proud when you know, I did that because I meant that out that was the beginning of my journey into this scary world. Well, he's scary for me to be able to put something the in a non-traditional form. So I'm happy you're talking about your journey here because I think if we did talk Money the way we talk about sex. We wouldn't probably still be fighting some of the inequities. We have agreed. Yeah, what you say resonate so much with me. I've been trying to start a bunch of sort of started up in angels group for Pinterest Angel Investors. And a lot of them are women, but I do think that even for myself personally there's a lot of intimidation to approaching it because it's not something that were used to talking about right and it's a whole new. Language, like I still don't understand a lot of the definitions that are thrown into a document and I'm like, I guess I'm just going to sign here because I don't know what it is means and I'll figure it out later and that's not a good it's not smart first of all, but when you talk about there's Angel Investing their seed stage, you know, is that where does Maverick on come in into the into the process of investing? Yeah. I mean we come in at the earliest stages. So primarily we do seed and see what we primarily do the series A. But if you think about the progression, it's we also do seeds as well opportunistically. So Angel Investing is the first check in they typically individuals who are accredited investors. Then you have the seed funds and see checks and then you have the series a which is what would be the difference between a seed in a series a typically at the seed you have the team a little bit of the idea and some sort of prototype and perhaps You've launched your product, but sometimes not and then at the series a you've typically found product Market fit and you're looking to scale gotta okay. So how do you know when something's a good investment or not? What is do you have like a spidey sense? Or is it a lot of research and vetting or both? I think it depends on the stage. But this is something that I am learning and still learning. My partner's always tell me that there's two questions that you have to answer one. Is this a good investment and to is this a cat lie investment and I do think that given that there's a lot of science to investing. There's also a lot of Art and one of the reasons why I joined my friend why I love the way that we think about investing as we definitely use our core values as a firm to invest and those values really resonate with me and I think that seems as we think about this the set of entrepreneurs and we're will focus only on condition. Consumer investing. So it's any company that's building for people like us as opposed to businesses as the customer. So what kind of brands have you guys invested in us? All birds ever Lane and perfect produce modern fertility. Oh cool two chairs co-star here in New York, Mass. Yeah. I know a lot of those awesome. And so what which are the ones that have been the cat Lee Investments. So there are two things that I that I'm starting out with thesis areas. And I do that mostly to give myself a little bit of a framework so that it's not completely reactive. One of my thesis areas is the underserved needs in a woman's life goes back to that ratio and it goes back to where I think it's a huge opportunity. So what does that mean? I am looking at companies that speak to women at these different stages. So one of my seat Investments is a company called Bloom BL ume they make self care products for girls at puberty. And what resonated with me and the types of companies that we invest in our Founders who truly understand their in customer. They know that those women or girls who are going that they're going through all these changes in their bodies. There isn't a company that owned that a brand that truly owns what these women are going through and can help them along the way so they want to be sort of the older sister to give girls that confidence at that stage in their life. What's your decision making process? Us like for your Investments when it's a cat Lee investment or just for your firm even for my firm one thing. I really resonate with and I love is that we have these core values and it affects how we make decisions. So the values are one we look for unapologetically non-normal Founders and we it's one of our values unapologetically not normal because we believe we ourselves are but at the same time we know that in order to build a company you have to be comfortable and self-aware and have that confidence. Since to be unapologetically not normal second, we believe in ships over actions, which is shortcut for relationships over transactions. And at the end of the day, we view all of our decisions and Investments as relationships. It is a long-term relationship and the more that we can get to know each other and think about that that investment in that way. I think that the more aligned we are in that sort of contract that we have. Have and third we invest in profit and purpose. We believe that there isn't a trade-off between the two and so we look for people who want to achieve both and then lastly the value is when the right way it speaks to both how we work as a team and that we win as a team you get all of us when one of us invest and similarly like we think of ourselves as part of the team of the founder when I hear about, you know different people that I've Angel invested, That they've been turned down by hundreds of VCS. A some of them shouldn't have approached Avicii in the first place and be what do you do? What do you tell those people that are like? Oh my gosh. I just want to give up and how do I secure this money or or what? What could I do to overcome this challenge? I think it's hard to give very general advice. That's very much always on a case-by-case basis. But if I were to give general advice to that, I would say that a lot of It is thinking it is a mindset shift and I have even had to go through this mindset Chef to go from person who works at a start-up where everything can work. And of course things are going to we're going to make it work to transitioning to thinking like an investor where you have to dream with the entrepreneur I think about how it works but also our jobs are to Think Through. What are the different areas of risk? And how do I get comfortable around those risks or mitigate those risks and I think potentially doing that as an entrepreneur and trying to put yourself into the mindset of an investor and what could happen in turn or what are the risk areas could potentially prepare yourself for the conversation so that you can have that transparent dialogue with an investor. Hi guys, I hate to interrupt this episode but I have to do an ad and it's for myself. I love doing this podcast. I love interviewing these women. So what I'm asking you to do is support me if you are in the market for a beautiful bag or some wonderful apparel or Shoes by Rebecca Minkoff, and if you need to buy a gift for someone think of me, it always helps. It keeps the business going and I would love to see you wearing your beautiful Rebecca Minkoff. You can hashtag by RM and thank you for the support. What are some of the unexpected or one of the biggest unexpected challenges you have faced in your career doesn't have to be recently or that stands out more. I think one of the challenges that I've had is trying to figure out how to separate Who I Am from my work. Yes, because I in some ways. I'm a bit of a workaholic. I've made some trade-offs of my life to focus on my work. I knows my most people don't talk about this, but I'm totally open. To sharing I am yeah, I've frozen my embryos twice. God did hundred two rounds. Wow, that's different than freezing your eggs it is because I was married. Okay, and or I am married I should say but I was married and I owe ya no, no, no. Okay. I know it's the same person but you froze the embryos twice. Yes. Okay, you know I and I took six months off after Pinterest. Yeah. Before starting at Madrid in January, right? And I did that for a couple reasons. I did that because it felt like a good time to really reflect on what I want my life the rest now, I still feel like there's so much of life ahead. But I always loved taking these this time to just start check yourself and say like is this am I still staying true to what who I am and what I want my life to be about and to be totally And I'm still wrestling with this question of I'm at the stage. Where do I want to have kids or do I not want to have kids and I can imagine a life being really good either way. Hey, so I took that time for myself really to do a couple things to really check with what my values are and what's my purpose and how does life and work fit into that and I went to a lot of different places. I also learned a lot of skills I learned Chinese which is kind of reconnected my culture and all those things. I think that the challenge is continuing to take a step back and Center yourself is something that I was fine to be a challenge and it's not like one moment but it is something that I always try to figure out and something I'm always continually seeking. I love it. I was going to ask you what's one thing we'd be surprised to know about you. But I feel like you might have answered that that you have these little guys on Ice. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and what's Wild is that you actually know the gender wow, amazing technology is incredible. Yeah, so there's one of their there's one other question. I also ask what's one piece of advice you'd like to that was great for you that you'd like to pass on or or you learned yourself that you like to pass on that. There's no one right path. I love that answer. There isn't an everyone everyone expects to hear your path. And then they want to follow that one, you know, at least when they're asking for advice and I'm like, you can't do that. It's totally true. There isn't one right path. Hmm and then probably the other one is like just be that's that's sort of that. That's what I loved about the like what was so provocative. Someone told me to just be right and I sort of contemplated that and it was thinking that is really hard to do. But at the end of the day like all we can be is the best version of ourselves, and how do you figure that out? Well, thank you so much for being here and sharing your story. Thank you. Thank you so much for having me. That was can't lie. I hope you This episode to hear about what she's up to. You can go to Maverick on.com.
Cat Lee grew up with the intention of following in her father’s footsteps, and she did, for a while. After graduating from Stanford she immediately began work at Lockheed Martin where her father had made his career for 40 years. However, it wasn’t long until she realized that working in the defense industry was not kindling her passion for life. After pursuing an MBA, Cat graced the halls of Google, Facebook, and then Pinterest before realizing that what really gets her excited is angel investing and variations thereof. Now a partner at Maveron, an investment company that funds startups, Cat gets to do what she does best, breaking down barriers to entrepreneurship and helping to fund the next big rocketship! Thanks for listening! We love our listeners! Follow Superwomen on Instagram. Big Ideas   The cultural implications of not following your parents’ vision for your life. [07:03]  How to choose the right investment for you. [17:22]   The importance of periodically checking in with yourself to make sure you’re staying true to who you are and what you want your life to be about. [24:00]   ---   This episode is sponsored by  · Anchor: The easiest way to make a podcast. 