Boys and girls, welcome back to the inspiration space. I'm extremely excited to release this episode today. I've been waiting Parliament this week on holiday been absolutely amazing for my mindset. I really listened to it twice over because it is that good it is with Mark Bowden if you Heard of Mark Bowden I strongly suggest you going to watch his Ted Talk all about winning body language. That is what this podcast is about as well. Obviously, I'll leave it in the show notes. I've become absolutely obsessed with Mark's work and everything that he speaks about. I came across this Ted Talk a couple of months back and it is honestly changed the way I view so many things business personal interactions people around me. Honestly. I can't walk into a situation now. Not not see and think about body language it is so so important. So yeah guys, if obviously I love all my podcast but specifically over the last couple of months. This one had a massive impact on me loved every second of it. So glad to have got the chance to speak to him. I'm massively appreciate it the guy works with top-level CEOs all over the world the fact that he came and spoke to me on Skype is a massive Testaments. That's kind of guy. He is really amazing amazing, man. And I look forward to hopefully speaking to him further in the future about everything body language orientated guys. Listen to this. It's awesome. If you haven't given me a five-star of you yet. What are you waiting for man or woman? It's it's a good show. You know, I want to get more guests like Mark on it and because I'm getting all these fantastic ratings and reviews means I can carry on to do that. So if you have another time to do so please guys would be really really really Girls it would be really great. If you could hope you're having a wonderful week guys get stuck into this. It's awesome. First of all, thank you so much for taking your time. I know I was very persistent. But over the last two months or so your work is really really had a significant impact. So I was really desperate desperate is the right word to kind of get you want to thank you so much for that. I'm very very happy to join you. So you're based in Toronto. I am yeah, you you have been ever been to Toronto. So my father does a lot of work in Toronto. My father's been in show business since for about 60 years. So, you know, he brings show's over to the to the Mirvish Theater consistently for the last 50 years. So, it's not your dad is Paul Elliott. Who's your dad? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah for sure silver fox. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's great. So, yeah, he's bought a whole bunch of stuff over. Yeah good on it. And I understand you've well now it makes sense. I listen to a another podcast you've done recently with Michael port and so you've obviously come from a theatrical background directing and producing as well for sure for sure. So a lot of the work that I that I do comes from that background of understanding, you know, what you need to do this side to get other people to experience what you want them to experience amazed. I mean that kind of leads me onto my first question really is how you kind of got into the field be a background on yourself and really how you've managed to have such a prolific impact in the field of you know, winning body language. Yeah sure. So so I started out in this area just being fascinated by human behavior and animal behavior originally and just how how organisms move and the effect that they have I got into pictures are and I'm talking about when I was a kid and a student and you know visual art and how that affects the world around us and affects our perceptions and then into Theater Arts really specifically movement and theater and visual theater and how we tell stories with pictures and how those pictures affect our imaginations and behaviors and then it kind of started transforming into politics and business and I I found that in the world of politics and business there was quite a low level of understanding in terms of how images that we create affect the outcomes of people's behavior. So I found I was pretty Adept in that area. Nobody had my skill level there. Nobody would really applied that skill level to business and politics and so kind of here I am today written four books on human behavior and body language and I speak and work all over the World train people all over the world up to you know, G7 prime minister's the the yeah CEOs of Fortune 500 on how to use their nonverbal Behavior their body language to stand out to win trust and gain credibility every time they speak amazing site. So how's your understanding kind of develops along the way? I mean, was there a course in this or was this kind of exposure through like you said your background and seeing humans perform. Hmm. Yes. So yeah, my my experience and understanding has developed its developed through working some core content some core ideas that have not developed at all because they're they're totally caught to us being human beings. They're really they're never going to change. They're never going to change in my lifetime anyway, and and I don't see, you know, given our progress our Evolution as human beings. I'm pretty much saying nothing's Change, you know for the next 200 thousand years and if it does change within the next two hundred thousand years there would have to be a radical environmental change for for for any adaption in us as human beings. So nothing is going to change for us at that core of how we humans behave but how an understanding of that behavior can be applied yet. Absolutely. I you know through working with clients all over the world and You know different businesses different environments you get a much broader idea of how you can help people. Absolutely. I mean, I mean, I'll refer to your Ted Talk which I've watched probably 15 20 times now and it's funny good when a little bit of background on me. I own a gym in Oxford Circus and Central London and it's all yeah class class trains his group training. So the Big Bay see what it's all about. It's about creating experience and environment that sort of inspires them to kind of get the most out of Selves and I mean I've been watching pantomime since I was three years old, so I know it's funny like it took me about a year to realize actually what we were doing was panto because you're right you're kind of up in front of them. You're breaking the fourth wall you're engaging with them and it's when I watched your Ted Talk and support my point. I'm ranting now is the fork if you could talk through the four categories, but essentially what my job is to try and do is trying to Getting into the category of friend. Yeah, and so it's very important that whatever body language I'm doing which I wasn't really aware of what I was doing. I learned it from panto and that was just a few pure environment pure, you know how somebody moves around the stage with conviction and confidence and you know, I've seen the very best, you know, Brian Conley and you know, yeah, I've seen these guys from a young age and I think it was almost like mr. Miyagi than away. You know what I mean? Right? Right, right. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So so let's just touch on that thing that you're talking about their of moving with confidence across the stage that for me is something about directness that you look at a human being and you go. Okay. They know where they're going I can predict where I think they're going. Oh, they're going there. Okay, there are very predictable person and when somebody becomes predictable for us, they become a low A risk for us or an opportunity for us. So let's just say look. There are two categories that we put people into based on on their human behavior their body language. There's either risk or reward and I break that down in that Ted talk into friend enemy potential mate and indifference and essentially, you know, friend and potential mate is reward and and and predator and indifference is Risk, essentially, so so the brain is looking at nonverbal Behavior as its best bet on how it's going to predict the future with that other human being we come into contact with each other and the Brain goes. Well, how's this going to work out? And it's the same whether you're watching a show on stage or your their one-on-one in a meeting with somebody or you're running, you know, a fitness experience for people everybody's Looking at you and going well, how's this gonna work out? Because the brain doesn't know because it doesn't know the future is having to make a prediction. One of the things that can make a prediction about is the Rhythm and directness with which you move. So if you look like you don't know where you're going your body doesn't know what it's doing the brain looks at that and goes. Yeah. Well then, how are we going to work out whether this is even going well or not if So so these fundamental things so when we when we take this down into say politics or business we go. Well, how do we know we've got a leader in the room? Well a leader has followers by you know, by by dint of being a leader the leader must have followers. Well then how do you get followed where you get followed by first of all being follow herbal, so, you know, so we've Got it. We've got to be able to follow the movement in order to know whether we could follow that person and they could be the leader and it's that belief in what they're doing. I mean, I was finally some of the trainer's that I've had over the past that it hasn't quite worked out. It's because I feel like there's that that self-doubt of their internal mind creeps into their body language somehow and they kind of lap that conviction and I See it directly in the people that are watching him and I can see that he's lost he or she has lost them in an instant and and they're on their phones and they're light and they're passive and and it's different to the ones that I know of got it and they've got that conviction and they and people are just so engaged and the experience it creates the experience and it's an ever since I watched your Ted talk. I've just like I'm a mind boggled by the whole the whole thing and how a few simple things which I'm going to ask you about in a second. He's doing such a significant impact. So I mean in order to get somebody on side. Is there any coffee there are there are a couple of characteristics couple of movements that are world world known to kind of get you in that category. Yeah, for sure. So it's very very simple. It's just your first thing you want to look for is is open body language sure justjust open you're doing it now in your conversation with me. I'm doing my best to do it with you. But you'll see it every down again from me is that I'm very clearly going look I'm open to this and one of the ways to describe it is is thinking about when you when you come in from a cold day into a into a home or a or a or a pub or a bar or and then they've got a roaring fire going. You know, what do you have to do with your body to accept the warmth of that think about those behaviors of how you need and where are you have to open up in order to get that warmth again? And where do you want the warmth? Well, you know you want you want the warmth into your chest area your stomach area under these armpits here. So you start it's almost like an embracing sense and now so the second part of that is our you maximized or minimized in that so there's there's me there's me kind of minimizing my my openness and there's Really maximizing my openness now think about go back to that panto idea that you've got there. Think about the the pantomime Dame. Okay. And in fact one of my fact my best friend guy called Sean Prendergast was voted. I think two years ago the Britain's best pantomime Dame and that's probably seen Sean. Yeah and what you know when you see Shawn perform the pantomime Dame and I think you'll see this in All the dames that you've seen it's a big all-embracing mother. It's like somebody who could hug the whole audience and bring that whole audience, you know into their bosom essentially fighting, you know, it's totally totally inviting. It's very though. It's powerful and strong. It's non-aggressive to the audience and it's all encompassing and all inviting. It's He warm to the to the audience and very maximized. I mean the costumes are you know, buffoonery. They're super maximize, you know, so but obviously, you know in business and politics and anything else that you might be be doing to create business relationships. You probably not looking for that buffoonery maximization, but you're usually looking to push beyond your usual maximization or certainly Lee not minimize so think about cold Behavior, whereby you know, I'm going to now, you know, try and warm up my neck here and warm up my my chest by hugging myself this kind of self soothing gesture. You can see how it's starts to minimize my body as well. So you think about your trainers who are coming into the space when they walk into that space. Are they already maximized or can you feel And see some minimisation in them your audience are going to look at that immediately and go. Well. How's this class going to going to go? And of course the thing is is this is not conscious for them. They don't show up to a class going. Well, let's look out for the maximization or minimization of the trainer. That's what's incredible about it. Right? Right. It's it's it has a profound effect on their judgment about the experience. That's Coming and they don't know how that judgment is operating or even that they're being fed this judgment. They just believe that the Judgment they have is the truth and it isn't necessarily the truth. It isn't necessarily what's happening in that person's head that person may feel very confident about the class that's coming. It's just their body has Isn't projecting that even it may be projecting it a little bit but not enough. So sometimes you go to amplify this just as a stage performer would amplify, you know, a good Dame is amplifying the warmth that they naturally had overtaken all the max. I'd almost like obviously and we'll probably get onto you know Arabians. You know concepts of 93% of it is 93% of communication is nonverbal, which I just find is an astonishing figure considering, you know, people probably naturally think that the importance of verbal communication is obviously very very very important. But it but it's true like his so many like I know I keep referring to the gym, but like I mean, like I said, I've watched shows for years and years specifically pantos because I used to go and watch them all up and down the country but the amount of errors Errors that are made in these performances, but people get away with it because of that exuberance and and confident flow Jamie and I how it like Ryan and it's what my dad's always said. He said, you know, whatever happens is meant was meant to happen. But you know, you're asked the or you ask the audience and they would never say they would never pick up on these errors or mistakes in the script simply because the body language carries the whole the whole the whole perform as a whole the whole experience, which is well. Also, I think to that, you know people aren't looking for Perfection. They're looking for Charisma. They're looking for an experience and that experience is not necessarily ever one of perfection or fact or they're looking for something more wonderful and it doesn't matter whether it's a it's show business or business or Fitness or anything. They're looking for a wonderful. Earrings, which doesn't can be related to Perfection of fact, but it doesn't have to be Perfection and and fact fact, sometimes it's better if it isn't. Yeah, it's sometimes nicer. You know, somebody once said to me, you know, don't let the cold dead hand of Reason spoil a good story. You know, don't let fact spoil something really good. I think the thing is is that it all of us in this area of heightened communication, whether it's whether it's the the Theater Arts or the art of communication or the art of engaging people and engaging their bodies into a into a into a performance and exercise that will take them to another level. It's really the art of reminding people that they're alive sheets really that that art of going. Hey look, You've got a body you're alive right now really really, you know experience this thing being alive right now now to to that point of 93 3% what Moravian was saying around that in the experiments that he did is that is that the information that our brain needs in order to make a judgment about somebody else's feeling in intention. The majority of the information we want is visual. We want to see a picture and Ahh moving picture and a context some of the information we want is Sonic is the sound of their voice the tonality of their voice and very little of it. Only seven percent is what they say. So when we're in a communication with somebody else and and our brain wants to make a judgment and it does want to make a judgment. It's not very concerned with what you're saying. It's more concerned about what you're doing and how you're sounding. Emotional content the intentional content of it and if the intentional content is different from the from the the verbal content. It discards the verbal content. It just goes that's not that's not the fact the fact is how I'm feeling and intending how I think I feel about you. That's the most important thing. So I'm Arabian was never saying, you know, just to clarify mehrabian was never saying 93% of all. Ocean is nonverbal, because otherwise you'd never be able to read a book or you could you could go to a film and and just have I mean it does not stay silent movies didn't work because of course they totally did but there's words add an incredible layer and extraordinary layer to all communication. We've had a verbal language. Now for about 200,000 years we think so. It's pretty new for us upright hominids. It's pretty New Concept but language has caused us to be extraordinary on the planet and there is much else on the planet that has language or certainly not at the capability. We have it. Yeah. Sure. Absolutely. Yeah. It just is it's funny. Like I said since watching your stuff, it's been on my mind constantly and And just to bring it away from almost people like who are in sort of the formal roles, like, you know politicians, you know leaders all this kind of stuff just on a generic kind of person to person basis. So I'm obviously my job is very belly-to-belly. So I see people every single day, you know in all kind of mental States, you know, wherever they are in their life. They're coming through the gym. I have to be I'm always the first person they see and it's funny. I I see a complete massive. My body language throughout the day if male and female. Yeah, and it's it's amazing. What coming down into our gym environment which is a massive Community can do for somebody being surrounded in an environment where people's body language tends to be a lot more positive interesting. Yeah. I just in such a small space of time. So that's interesting by the time they come into the gym. They're not feeling maybe a Monday morning the nervous about work. Whatever it may be they come in they are around surrounded. By people that you know got slightly better more like you said upright posture more inviting posture they do a session and then they leave and that I'm not joking. They look they've they come in and they look like they by the time they'll either it looked like different human beings and in a way. Yeah, so which is which I personally find fascinating and it's kind of made me think And you're one from your big one for growth mindset. I know when I speak about it in a minute. Yeah, but Would you say in terms of the first step for learning more better body language would be getting to an environment which? Encourage not encourages. I think that's the right word. But sort of unconsciously teaches you yeah gives you good examples of that. Yeah. So what's you know, that's really interesting what you're putting forward their because I've not really thought about that in terms of the gym, but that based on what you're saying. I can totally make an argument that says you're better off to work out with others than alone. Because because we're social mammals so so and because we're social mammals we perform more powerfully as groups. There's an advantage to being in a group and we resonate with each other. We copy each other's behaviors unconsciously and we even pick up on the on the neuro chemicals that go, you know, we will pick up on the on the testosterone and the estrogen in the Androgen which literally He is in the air around around a gym. Yeah, so not only will we get more focused and and potentially competitive because of the testosterone but because of the estrogen as well potentially will get more connected with each other and will mirror each other more so I'd never really thought about that before until you until you were mentioning. That is that not only should you be going to a gym obviously in order to exercise your body and some really specific Can important ways but also to be around other behaviors which are good behaviors for your mind and your body so these open behaviors so it strikes me like as a as a as a, you know, a gym owner a gym manager anybody who has some kind of you know, as a franchise owner anybody who has some kind of jurisdiction over the behavior that happens in there. You want your staff to Be doing this open body language. You want to make sure that you are that you are rewarding members who are displaying this kind of open body language open mindset inviting warm, you know, really thanking those people for coming on because they're doing some of the job of the gym and it's funny cuz it's spot exactly it I mean and up until watching Your Ted Talk, that's what I realized. We were doing which was such a special thing because right was like oh there because yeah, obviously aesthetically physically you're helping people but in a mental way and it you're kind of creating this environment which encourages better body language which then leads to a better mental state and it's right. It's just a very exciting thing to see like it really is and for me as somebody like I said, I always send your Ted talk now, too. Potential members of Star great great think it starts there. I think for sure. Yeah for sure. It's got to start with the with the first, you know, obviously look, you know, there's how you can you know dress up your doorway and your entrance way and the poster image that you might have outside your place. Of course, there's The Branding there's all of that but ultimately somebody walks in the door and they're going to meet a human being and once they meet that human being that's going to be they're their framework for who are we as people in this place? You know, what how is this experience going to be for me and that first and you know, imagine going, you know, trying out a gym and and trying it for the first time and maybe you've been away for a while. Maybe you're not happy with how you are at the moment and and and of so, of course you're nervous and you're anxious and you're you're you're optimistic, but still threatened by By what this is going to be because you don't know you just don't know and what if that first moment triggers in you that sense of you know what this is going to be. Okay. This is going to be all right, you know, I think this is gonna be good the time people come in we've got this thing called a two-week trial people referring to my own experience just because it's the only way I've kind of understood what you're trying to say, but sure we've got this two-week experience and people come in on that first day and they're closed off. I could I promise you now the space of two weeks. It is miraculous. We miraculous it really really is but I want to spin on its head just one Deshawn quickly. It's you talk about and when I've been speaking to people about you and about your sort of concept. Let me say of the importance of being more inauthentic. Yeah. Sure. Okay. It's a funny one, isn't it? Because I'm sure like, you said not always does that sound correct or all right. You're right. I mean sure. But so he takes it whenever I'm in space when he takes the explanation and the like know that is completely makes sense. So I'm not going to obviously I would love you to kind of just talk us through your that concept and what it means to you and it's something that I completely utterly and completely utterly agree with now. I've been through the last 24 months by the way, so yeah. Yeah, right. Yeah. So my idea about being made more inauthentic is simply to understand that some of our anticipatory is around being people around people similar to us, you know, so so look, you know, we clearly have a link because we have a link through theater, you know, you know, you mention your dad and I go okay course. Yeah like Okay. So this guy we know each other's world. We know a lot of the same we're going to know a lot of the same people, you know, you know it We carry on this got so so so we might be able to say we are we are familiar with each other even though we haven't met each other before we're family. Yeah, we would get on we'd have to work really hard not to get on because we've we've come from backgrounds that hold the same values beliefs rituals Customs goals concern signals. Yeah, which means you know, we get along really well right now and toys feels very good and it and it feels very authentic. We even you know, we have some similarities as well. You know, you got blond hair. You look like you've got a you look like you're kind of Danish kind of maybe French Danish, you know into Britain like like like me our ancestors would have come from northern Europe or something like that. So yeah, so there's a lot of there's a lot of similarity between us and so I'm more likely to gravitate towards You than somebody who doesn't instantly share a background is not familiar and who looks different from me. And in fact, I'm more likely to be suspicious of them or in most importantly indifferent to them if they don't trigger that sense of hey, this person is a good person their family. This feels really authentic to me really good really nice and most likely to be indifferent to them and That means I'm going to miss a great opportunity with something different something Innovative because because ultimately though, you know, you're a fantastic person. We already share a lot of the same views. It's like it's like this is like a conversation, you know on a on a on a level of values. We hold some of the same values so it's So it's an interesting conversation. It's almost a conversation with ourselves. Okay, there's nothing wrong with this because it feels great and and you know feels feels fantastic. But but but what we've got to seek I think more is conversations with people who are not like us who are different from us so we can influence and persuade them and they can influence and persuade us and we can all learn. Or be a little bit on the edge of one. This is a bit uncomfortable. You know, this is a bit uncomfortable hearing this stuff or hearing that point of view, but we all learn more it does that does that kind of make make sense to you on being surrounded by people like that? You can have more of an influence on them. Right? Absolutely and think about a business that you might might have and think about and let's take her. Take a Gemini l'm I don't run a gym. So I don't know but, you know tell me if this is right or wrong is that my guess is on the whole you can often kind of get an idea of the kind of people the kind of customer that you have the kind of values and beliefs and rituals and customs and goals and concerns that those people have and those will gravitate towards you and sometimes unless you become a little Authentic and little more inauthentic you won't go out and seek the new and different and more extraordinary markets for what you have. You won't go out you won't go into the uncomfortable places and go can we attract people who we really actually don't care about when we don't talk to them like who cares about about them? Here's our Aunt here's our customer now, I know there's absolutely a business argument that says no the people you don't care about don't care about them. You know, we have it in politics look, you know, there are people who are too too expensive to move over to your to your side, you know concentrate on the easier ones to move or the ones that you already have. Don't lose don't lose voters, you know, swing voters don't go and find voters or never be your vote. And that's that's too expensive. There's lots of good. Reasons around around that that sometimes on a business and personal level. You have to be more inauthentic in order to grow. I think essentially authenticity can often be something that stops you growing rather than helps you grow and that that's a bit of a bold statement because people who love authenticity hate it when I say when I say that and what I'd say is I think you got to get the right balance between authenticity and inauthenticity to be somebody who's really going to grow. I'm sorry. I really do and I just think the way I view it and the way I heard it just now and and on obviously on your Ted Talk was that if you have an authentic morals and an authentic goal being an authentic initially. Get there. It's just it's a vehicle is a vehicle for you to really do good essentially, right? Yeah, right. Right, right so correct. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely so that so yeah, look you absolutely have to have authentic goals and authentic morals. You can't really borrow morals from people or fake morality. It's that's that isn't gonna work. You kind of just a guy that's just being truly inauthentic and when people come into conflict with themselves and the world around them is often. They don't know their their goals or they're not comfortable with them right now. They don't know their moral compass or or what we'd really called their values like you can't really fake your values because ultimately that they're going to happen unconsciously anyway, Yeah, but you can put on behaviors in order to get those goals and get those values. And in order to engage people along that route for you to be more successful and for them to be more successful as communities as communities and we're going with social mammals. We've got to get on with each. Each other in order to be powerful and and and and and live. Well, yeah and live well as communities so we have to be able to look lying is one of your most important social skills as well as telling the truth is one of your most important social skills and what you have to learn as it as a human being in order to get on with a society is when two lion went to tell the truth and when to accept Accepting a lie is one of your most important social skills. You often know when somebody's lying to you and it's important socially to go. Okay good, you know, you know, that's not right. You know, that's not accurate what they're saying, but you have to accept it in or not because if you went around the world going to know that she that's that's not correct. That's that's a lie and you and you're telling me that on purpose and I'm not going to accept that and it's like it smells only that reminds me of How to Win Friends and Influence People, right, right, so the current that Carnegie book is really a Bible, I mean it is people often say to me, you know, what should I read what should I read on influence and persuasion and I say well, you know, first of all you want it you want to read How to Win Friends and Influence People, you know and do that and they say, oh, you know, I I've read that and I said, yeah, I know you've read it but you haven't done it. So that's the difference between reading it and doing it right now. Buddy, because if you do it if you literally go through chapter by chapter and you do what kind of he says the world changes in front of you slots into place and then it's not that it's easy work like it's hard work. It's hard work. It's effort because I think what Carnegie is trying to do is help people be less indifferent help people be more. Antic, I mean by that be able to get their authentic message out and collect people collect followers collect the will make a collective essentially be so sure we get a collective around you so that you can move your ideas forward for the betterment of everybody but that's an extraordinary book strawberry sense. Yeah. I mean, it's almost like a personal sacrifice. In a way to move yourself forward. It's like you got to give a little bit of a know this inauthenticity for your authentic goals to be achieved essentially, right? You've got to you've got to some things will rub you up the wrong way. He's gonna let him go. Let him go. It's like there's a bigger there's a bigger thing happening here. This was a bigger thing and though authentically like this person. Rubs me up the wrong way or I just don't like them or I just don't There anything there nothing there are no body. There are no body and and and you got to let that go the yes, that is the authentic that is truly the authentic you saying who cares who cares about them? Yeah, and instead you got to go. I'm going to totally engage with them and with totally engage with them like they are my familiar. They're my family and I'm going to see what happens and I'm going to be open to what What happens when you start doing some of that you meet some very Extraordinary People? Yeah, because they have a different thing going on to you. They got a different thing and when you Embrace and enjoy and get to know that different thing then you find some similarities you go the got a very different thing but some very similar things going on and you work out your way of co-opting with them and and and and Advising with them and going well how we gonna do something together because you've got this great like this this thing that you totally know about and there's another know about that Audrey, right? But how can we how can we do something together? And you start you start trading with them rather than hanging around people who are very much like you have very much a skill set that you have very much a knowledge base that you have and you just enjoying the warmth of being you know, With yourself essentially and that is actually very much more authentic is when people go with on the whole when people are going in I'd I don't like them. I think they were being very I think they're being there an inauthentic person, you know, they're well actually they did to just go know they were being inauthentic then it's right. Now you just didn't like them, but you don't know if they're being authentic or not. You have no idea. You just don't like them. Well, you're indifferent to them this kind of Link's me on nicely too. That's the kind of difference between someone with a growth mindset and a fixed mindset almost. Right? Right, and it really is that really is is it's that ability to realize that how do I have a face to realize that somebody else's personality may be fixed, but new you have to adapt and grow in that situation to be able to get what you want out of it for sure for sure. So it's so one of the things one of the things I think that look for people to best understand growth mindset. Let me give you a few words that I use in order to try and get myself into a growth mindset with around things. So one of the important words I use is the word yet. So so I might meet somebody and my instinct my authenticity goes I don't like them. I don't like them and and they go yeah, it goes I don't like them and and then I add to it at the end yet. So I don't like them yet. I like that. It propels me propels me forward now. I've met can think of about about three or four people the ultimately the moment I met them. I wear no they are not good. That's not good for that is not that is not good and they've persistently shown themselves to be not good. That's not you know, they should be avoided and when people go so, what do you think of sounds I'm like, I'm very over with all night. Not good. That's really not that's good for nobody good for nobody like that you it seems attractive quite charismatic not gonna be very good stay away from from from that but the majority of people the majority of people on the planet. I'm instinctively indifferent to and some I may not like from moment one, but it's not the the dislike is not bold enough. It doesn't put the chill up my spine. You know, it's just like indifference to like disinterest to don't like what they said. They're or don't like the way they behaved and what I've got to do is is I don't like them yet and give it more of a more of a chance investigate more essentially. So I think to to understand them play around with growth mindset just just add the word yet to stuff where you've created. Absolutes, you know and you doing business in great job flexibility, right? Absolutely. Correct creates a moment of flexibility, which means you might give it a minute more effort to minutes more effort a day a year more more more effort. You know, I you know, I haven't got I haven't got a five million dollar business yet. Yeah, that's it. You think differently make somebody else think differently just add more opportunist one three-letter word adds more opportunity to thank the think about that when you're managing managing people, you know, you're not very easy when you're managing people to say, you know, you're not performing, you know, you're not performing how I was at. Yes how I want yet. You know, you're not delivering to the client or customer this yet. I love it. I love it. Right this is going to be a fun one. Okay. All right. So fro the demographic of this podcast is somebody who is in the ages of sort of 20 to 30 31 looking for direction. And that's a massive thing for this podcast also is one of the biggest episodes in terms of downloads. I had on a sec psychologist. He was in Bro, who are who basically her experience was dealing in relationships? So I thought that it would be good to talk about that sort of third category of being a sexual partner how to get somebody in terms of a sexual partner and maybe a couple of characteristics or behaviors you could do on a in terms of body language on a date. I thought that be quite fun sure, you know, it's simple because it's what I was saying before open body language, so number one. Bo Papa but then again not putting someone in the friend zone as I like to call it right look well looked sexual attraction is being done at a with a whole bunch of other cues, very unconscious around likeness. How much like you are me? Yeah as a perso. So are you close to my genetic code? But not so close that we're family, okay. So there's a lot of attraction to likeness now. I know people will go. Yeah, but you know, I got friends and they're there with each other and they're so different. Yeah. Okay. So there's a lot of factors complex, but one of them is is likeness. Another is simply health health like we look at hair in order to work out how healthy is this person. How good is their diet is that is the hair hair that I have is it rich in color? And is it glossy because that's denotes High mineral content in the diet sources of fats and proteins. It's like a good diet. Yeah skin tone do they look is that the skin look good because if there's disease or malnutrition it's showing up in the skin. So, you know, it's all the things that you will go and buy products for You know and all the usual places, you know, in order in order to give yourself, you know a step ahead in the market in that competition because there will be a sense of competition for mates essentially. So you will get attracted and you will and people will be attracted to you if you look healthy. I mean it's and it was summer. It's not like we're looking for the most healthy person just die. Don't look like you've got a disease. It's not about you know, whoever has the most healthy body wins. No, it's just if if you look like you don't eat well and you know, you're around a place of disease. It looks like you come from a land which would be not very good. Good to live in because if we are to get together, I'm going to end up going to your land at some point. You're going to end up coming to mine. Okay to your each other's territories. And essentially if it looks like you're not well and your Mount have malnutrition. I don't want it. My instinct doesn't want to go over there. So those those elements there, you know T that I'm seeing you got you got a great smile, but teeth is one of the indicators of how old you might be and how Healthy you are so you know you end up at really simple things which is look after your body. Look after your teeth. Look after your diet, you know as well as you can it doesn't mean you having to push it to it's not about you need to look like you you're you know extreme sports person that could push it further, you know in a in another Direction look like you've got you've got, you know, no fat content on you which will cause people to go Oh, hang on though. You're in Starvation behavioral standpoint on this that says we are we are the the instinct is looking for signals that mean we are likely to survive. Okay, we're likely to survive around that person or in a group with that person now having said that though, There's other indicators like how good is that person at sharing? So sharing is important how good a sharer are you cause we're all going to die if we can't share okay with social mammals if you're if you're not sharing that's that's not good. How good are you at dissipating conflict? Yeah, so we often find that people that are funny. Funny I is attractive why is funny attractive because it's a great non-violent way of getting rid of conflict and we don't want to be around conflict intelligence. Yeah. How intelligent are you how good are you and intelligent intelligence would be how good are you at taking bits of information and turning them into something else. So how good are you at making? Kings something out of something else. So an example would be if if you or somebody else makes me a cocktail rather than just opens a can get a cocktail maker is more intelligent than the can opener. Yeah. Yeah. So so so so I would suggest male nor female. Yeah, the tail maker is more attractive than the opener of a bottle an opener of the bottle is using simple tools as a good quote that yeah, but any better mixologist, you know, so imagine that mixologist it's behind the bar. Yeah, you know male or female they can be pretty attractive now, you know, they're often put there because they have some of the signals of attractiveness, but it's that thing of when we got somebody really intelligent look at all the tools that they're using Look at look at how they're a look at how intelligent they are. Looking all the information that they Store look how they can make stuff out of other stuff. It's all the stuff that are instinctual brain looks at as upright hominids as social mammals and goes. Well, that's a good one there. So let's hang around our let's hang around at the bar because because there's lots of attractive but behind that behind that behind that bar, so it's so it's never just you know one. One element and certainly physical prowess though. It can have some effect on attractiveness. It isn't it. Isn't it isn't the major thing. It's some of the important aspects that you want to be working on. I think amazing amazing, you know, I could literally talk about this topic. I mean, I've literally you can ask anyone who knows me. I believe she'll become obsessed with this field. I mean, what's a good it's good field to become obsessed with you know a while maybe taking it a bit too far. But but but look, you know get up get up CEST with it for a bit and get into it, you know by having these chats. You know, what I hope to do for people is just get them more intrigued by it. So they'll go and read more absolutely going, you know, get the doll can't get How to Win Friends and and dip into that and do it do it. Read any of my books and do what's what's in there, but get get obsessed and engage by it a little bit and I'm happy to come back and chat with you anytime now. I see why there was one last thing. I mean I wanted to just say. Oh, yeah, I wasn't asking about the resources he mentions so couple of your books you've written for an hour's at 3:00. Yeah, four bucks for now. Yeah. I've got one ready in my bag to go. I'm going away next week in Palmer, but I Big basic question. I always ask this I always ask at the end firstly have you got anything to question always, uh firstly have you got anything major coming up that people can follow you and follow your work or anything like that that's going on. So look, you can always follow me on Twitter on LinkedIn Twitter is at truth plain. Find me at Mark Bowden on LinkedIn, you know, you'll find me on you'll find me on Facebook either by Mark Bowden or truth. Plain, find me there follow me there and and there's lots of video out there that you can wallow. I should to World Tour. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. If your dad would like to produce that there you want to make sure people have is is I've got some some free training out there video training. There that I give away to anybody who's listen to me or heard a keynote or or listen to a podcast of any sort. So you find it at bit dot l y it dot l y forward slash winning keynote, you know winning as in winning keynote as in keynote all one word bit dot l y /h winning keynote go there and there's 20 minutes of free video training there don't you know anybody who's listening to this just go and get that go and get that for free? Yeah, please. Who's in their 20s and 30s looking for a bit of direction? I think I mean doesn't have any body language audience orientationally could be I mean just something like a life lesson you've learned or something like that just a bit of parting wisdom. Yeah. Yeah the best the best advice I can get and I think some of the best advice that I've got is is is simply this which is They got it. Just just keep going. Just whatever it is. Whatever it is. Keep going. Keep going just stick at it and stick at it and keep going because often being more Relentless than anybody else is the key to some of the successes that you'll have in your life in my experience on the and from what others have told me who've been very very, you know, I've been lucky enough to work with some people who've been extraordinary. Marilee successful and ultimately I get the when I say, you know, what's your advice? What should what should I do? What should people do pretty much comes to down to that which is just keep on going do not stop Let The Others Stop and actually, you know, I've had it with with with some top athletes that I work with as well. It's like well, how do you win? How do you win? They're like, oh, you know you train. You trained and trained to be the best that you can be and then you kind of hoping for the others to get injured. Yeah. Yeah, you're very yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. You're very welcome to come and hang out and for dinner sometime great talking to you and anytime you want to speak. I'm here. Thanks Mark.
Mark Bowden is the keynote speaker for organizations and associations worldwide whose people, leadership or sales teams need to stand out, win trust and gain credibility every time they speak. His highly interactive keynote presentation takes everybody on an informative, exciting and laugh-out-loud journey to understanding how, with the right body language “It’s often not what you say—but how you say it, that gets you extraordinary results!” His TEDx Talk changed my way of viewing the world. Understanding the importance of non verbal communication is a game changer. If you have not watched this TEDx Talk then I strongly suggest doing so. In this episode Mark and I talk about some underpinning beliefs around the topic and how it can unlock many doors to reach success. Topics covered in this epic episode:   I ask Mark about his background and how he stumbled into the field of 'Body Language'. The importance of creating an experience and how to do so. Mark talks us through the 4 categories we put people into upon meeting them. This is dependent on the body language the person is putting out. Mark talks us through how to create open body language. This is what is needed to get people 'on side'. 'People aren't looking perfection they are looking for charisma'' Potentially one of my favourite quotes of all time. Mark explains the importance of creating the experience more than anything else. I ask Mark what the first step for learning winning body language is. As a business Mark talks about how the initial contact with an employee can create the framework for how that individual thinks their experience is going to pan out. Mark explains how being more 'inauthentic' can be the way to move yourself forward as an individual. It can trigger huge growth, as long as you morals and goal are authentic. 'How to Win Friends and Influence People' the difference between reading that game changing book and DOING IT! Mark's approach to getting into a growth mindset. How introducing the word 'yet' can change your approach to almost every situation. Winning body language in a 'Dating' scenario. His advice - 'The cocktail maker is more attractive than the opener of a bottle'. 