We're up here man. We're up here or down here and Tribeca. We're ready to do the second half with our guest today. And he's a lot of funny could actually be a stand-up comic belt good fight hard and former deputy chief and the NYPD then went on to be a police commissioner inOccurs before we get back we get back into our interview. We we've been like you're such a great guy and so easy to talk to it and then like half these stories that you start telling us. I'm like save it for the air. So I'm here for you mark. Yes. So I you started on this story. Apparently you were in the Intelligence Division. You're the boss. Tell us the what you were you were just telling us right. It's a great story intelligence officials a great command and actually later on. I'd like to baby in a serious note talk about some of the post. Eleven stuff that the my guys and Intel did another got credit for it and they weren't looking for credit or Metals went like that. But after 9/11 obvious was crazy time in the city crazy time to job and these guys did the work of Heroes that day and and months afterwards and never fully was acknowledged. But anyway get off the somber note Intel for getting those who don't know the Intelligence Division at the time and still to this day. They're in charge of dignitary protection. So they got the mayor they got all the UN people and senators and everybody else that comes to town. So when this one occasion the Yankees had won the World Series here before so commissioner Carrick at the time Bernie. Kerry called me up and said, you know, we got to set up a motorcade from Baltimore and get him right into the White House to be. Alright after they won the World Series in Next Day next year. So it's the next year one the out they want to guess they want in October of 2000 and they were getting honored by the president in probably May of 2001. So in a Yankee fan is great for me. I get to escort the team on buses right into the White House right into the West Wing in the Rose Garden. And the whole bit and it was really really, you know a great kind of a highlight moment in my career. But but as cops, we see humor no matter where it happens. So I have to be on this bus for an hour or two is in the West Wing. There's a couple little like one stall to stall little bathrooms. So we all had to run to get online. And so the former Yankee great Lee mazzilli. Good guy. Nice man, very personable guy. He's on line with us. So guys are going in. Presents an economist guys are going in and you know taking a leak. So again being cops, you know Lee goes first and apparently somebody had gone in before him and absolutely destroyed this bathroom in the white house. It was a big number to shall we say, yes in the west wing and there's no way Lee mazzilli could have done it because he just went in and out real quick. But again being a guy you'd want to be hazardous materials unit. We had to it was it was a mistake as a crime scene Lee comes out the poor guy and he's devastate he's been embarrassed and we're on line right behind him and he's holding a door open going. I didn't do that. I didn't do it. Like why does he care? Right but I didn't do that and we both go sure that the poor guys like embarrassed as hell. But again, like I said, even the White House that you could find some humor that's how was the White House. It was beautiful. I said the Oval Office we packed them in George Steinbrenner was alive at the time. He was actually taking over finally the president United States says George just to remind you. I'm the president because yeah, they will form a Leaks when Bush was one of the owners of the Texas Rangers so they kind of knew each other but typical George Steinbrenner who I loved he was just taking over the whole room, you know, and you know, the JJ G WB finally had to say, excuse me. It's my office pal. So you got a chance to get to know George Steinbrenner too. Huh? No, look just bumping into him, but I know guys that work for them and listen, he's a he's a tough guy, but he did so many humanitarian things for some of his employees if he found out somebody's wife was sick. He dropped everything and made all kinds of phone calls. So one of his Executives wasn't he writing. VT on the outside of Yankee Stadium and when he was a kid, so then the rumor has it. Well The Story Goes On the room. It's just true story George Steinbrenner was dressed was pulling in with his limo. Whatever reached out went on the car grabbed the kid. What the hell are you doing? Find out this kid's name what his situation was and got him a job working at Yankee Stadium the guy rose up through the ranks until he was an executive one of the biggest Executives of the yeah. What a Rican kid from the Bronx. Yeah. He's a good guy in his own way. It's you know, there's a lot of stories out there floating around about him being a real good guy. Listen, I know he's a fire his managers often and you know, that was his thing and he was always in the paper. Yeah. So so that intelligence Vision was a good place to work, huh? It was a great place to work. It's good people now, it's a bureau now, they really rightfully so they beefed it up after 9/11 that you a lot more different things. They post guys in other countries now, so the intelligence Bureau now does outstanding work that they start doing that when you were the CEO now, They started it after after after I left. I know some guys who were in London, you know the real as real that's pretty amazing. They would have a guideline have to live there. Yeah. They do like a 2 or 3 year commitment know they take a train every day. If of conocí I said, that's because that's really what the hell did you do? Retired but he was stationed in London. He goes it sucks turrets 15 bucks a beer. That's how we measured it. Wow. That's a lot of when we came to be a stipend here. Yeah. It's a lot of money for a nice obviously drinking in the wrong places. Well, London, everything's expensive as hell. Yeah. Well, yeah, you got to get out of London off the beaten path a little bit. I'm sure this place is that it's not 50. I don't give it to your TA in London. I don't care man. You can take him back would probably pay. You gotta tell Detective Pat in London. Don't forget that it's in there guys got any pbrs. So yeah, so you worked in a lot of interesting places. I was reading your resume bill made me he always makes me do this the movies coming out. That's right. Yeah, I sent em to Pamela shot to I hope I'm going to quiz them later. So I don't want to embarrass you but like well Police Commissioner of Yonkers, obviously Deputy Chief of the NYPD you worked with the FBI the DEA the Secret Service. I mean that's that's that's a beautiful resume and they all sent me to different schools and stuff like that. So I saw that all the training you got the one of you talk about guy's balls dipped in butter. The training comes in there, too. Yeah, you know me the FBI Academy, even if it was getting a CDL license. Training on the job. Then you go drive a truck when you retire it gives me a nice drive the truck, but I'm just saying there's a lot of great training on the job. Yeah, there is I'm looking at my resume sometimes I'm like, it says he was a team player. He played ball a lot of ball playing never be a shining star, but he was a boy. It's a team never Jam you up. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, he doesn't go to the bathroom when the third round has been purged makes it makes a good cup of coffee. We talked about that upstairs. We're getting coffee didn't trust your coffee coming when you're a big boss. Right? What happens is everybody wants to bring you coffee. They want to do some you were a big boss on the job. He wants kissing his ass. Yeah. It's basic man, right? I got my old coffee Chief. You got your own coffee. I got my shift. Could I start your car before you go out so I could turn the heat on. Well, you know, it's funny. It's funny but not funny in Yonkers. Jacques is maybe every 15 years goes outside for a police commissioner. So our keynote Charlie Charlie Charlie Conley's also friend and mentor to me. Charlie was the Charlie snout 80ish. But Charlie was the PC in Yonkers in the 80s then in the mid 90s. They brought in a guy Bob Olsen who I still don't stay in touch with little bit by boltzmann was like the chief and like Omaha, Nebraska someone so right away when he got there the Yonkers cops called him text. He was tax even though he did was in Texas who he was. X but there was some craziness going on in Yonkers at the time and there was a guy who was fired for some always use told to leave. He's going to be fine. He decides to resign and whatever happened there was a rumor that somebody affiliated with that guy was very upset about it and had a background in Vietnam and explosives and stuff like that. So long story short commissioner Olson comes out of his home starts his car and it was a hand grenade wired to a coffee can so to call blows up good. He got like burns on his leg and stuff like that. He's actually stayed under the year. But so people kid around about like, you know, hey when you went to Yonkers, did you give you a call keys to your wife so she could start the car, but for those who are listeners are from New York. Let's describe. What what Yonkers is even is Yonkers is a little bit further north in the Bronx. That's where it actually begins. And why isn't it part of and why isn't it Patrol by that new NYPD, you know Yonkers is the Legacy. How big is the youngest Westchester Yonkers is Westchester County Yonkers is the fourth biggest city in New York state and it's only Rochester for some reason always comes in a few thousand people more than Yonkers and I always when I would do it my colleagues in Rochester. I said you're counting dead people up there, huh? Because Yonkers is white bigger. I think than Rochester. But anyway, it's a separate process you talk about something way further know. Yeah way up in Western Europe. So Yonkers has its own identity. They really get ticked off when people think it's the Bronx or to six borrow or when people that don't know the city at all say so so so that's your New York City, right? It's not and they're very they're very sensitive about that and rightfully, so it's one of the what did they call you when you went to Yonkers they called the other guy texts what they call you well to my face. They said Commish but I don't know I used to sign everything. Eh, so it's like eh or when they were pissed at me. It was that effing. Eh, you know, so but Many cops on that department. I had 650 sworn cops, which by national standards is a very big police department, but it's on my left we down with budget cuts and stuff. We don't about 600 but I'll say right up front. It was a great experience for me not to be self-serving a blow smoke. But the five years I spent in Yonkers was one of the highlights of my career good street cops great detectives great from another division. They're smaller products unit. I know somebody that worked in there very very good person. It's pretty much. Other than like a bomb squad and stuff like that. It's pretty much self sufficient. It's big enough to be self-sufficient and I'll tell you what thing anytime there's a test given or cops. I never had a cop rollout of Yonkers to another department if they always roll into Yonkers, which everyone's making 500 hours a year over time. And what is the salary over there? It's at they do a bit better base salary within the New York City like so everybody does better than New York. It's not necessary. That's not Clarkstown Orangetown like in Rockland County, but They do well and there they still make over time. The overtime is sometimes a little out of control. But but the they still do pretty well they still do but let me add some Cuts culturally I know on the NYPD, they really proud of them cutting back over time. How come you couldn't cut over time and young? Well, I did I didn't cut it I'll I didn't get crazy like, you know, they would complain like, you know, you're bringing the NYPD Playbook here and I said, well, it's a good play book, but I don't bring everything from there might be just enough to works. I mean I say, I'll Patrol guide the NYPD is this thick? Because of all the mistakes and tragedies that we've had you know, so So but but by and large, it's a good play book, especially when you throw in all the stuff that Bratton brought in with compstat Etc. So you bring comes that I did I did but I did it in a more. I think the police academy. What do they combine it with? The other words Chester counties. Well Westchester does the academy and the Yankees sent their guys there and then they get two weeks with you know, my training and why does in New York just go up there and just take over York. You can run I can run around man. Just take it over. They better we better we better come ready to fight and they can do that. But that was the plan. What's the area over there Mountain Vernon Mount Vernon is part of Yonkers. Well, I tried to separate City. My Vernon has all kinds of problems. We got bigger problems big problems politics. They're crazy. They're you know, the elected officials there or that's how will do terrible might take over Mount Vernon and then we'll have you on both sides and we can just walk on the police commission was the World War II Netflix documentary. Watching Game of Thrones is something they explain what happened in the World War II document on man. You gotta see it. It's it's unbelievable. But that's that's what you know you watching how they actually the Germans went about the Second World War and why they got England started getting involved because it started taking over all these lands they used to have but slowly methodically building up. I think the NYPD should do the fuck that man. Let's go take a look at math. Take it right over. You can never find anything. Like what's the difference between Being a chief now and being the actual commissioner. Well, you know when I was the how many chiefs did you have on the US as the I3 but when I was in NYPD, I was the molluscum and NYPD. I was the second in command of the Narcotics Division for the entire city. And the CEO of the commanding officer was my friend just recently retired Jim O'Neill. Okay. So so Jimmy and I got along very well good guy. So the Arcus thing kind of pops up in a guy no that's involved with the city of Yonkers at the time. He calls me up and he says Hey the Is looking to switch out the police commission it so he's calling me and I said I'll see if I can find someone. Oh my God. He says no knucklehead. He wants to talk to you. Oh, wow. So I said, okay, so you had a casual conversation then it became more like a reality where he said they're going to offer me the job. So it's funny when you're at that rank when your Deputy Chief or even lower than that protocol requires that written down anywhere but protocol requires. You have to tell a police commissioner that you're leaving that you go that you're looking at another job you leave you don't want him to find out about that. Street so I made an appointment to see commissioner Kelly at the time and he was very gracious. He wished me well, and actually, you know, I had to actually get approved by the city council. So I took the job without city council approval which is a bit of a risk and to his home of the Yonkers PD obviously after the artists job and to his credit Ray Kelly unsolicited wrote a letter. Somebody said you must been really trying to get rid of me. He bought a letter on my behalf saying it city council. I fully endorse, you know, Ed. Hartnett is the next Police Commissioner. So I was really kind of in to do that. I actually put that on a wood plaque just so I could show it to people and its really it's an amazing career that you had to be political Police Commissioner and and again mentors like is guys like I said man, I'm happy doing what I'm doing. I don't want to take that. That's a crazy job and I wasn't sure if I was ready for it. And then like John timoney Pat haunted other people said you got to go run your own police department. They all did it and they said you could do it too. So they gave me the confidence to take the job and I went in by myself, you know, I didn't have a luxury. Bringing friends and mentors and other guys in with me what kind of problems that you have in Yonkers as compared to New York City. Well when I got to Yonkers Yonkers again the great street cops. They were maybe a little rough around the edges in the street. There was a lot of backlash come from the community about you know, that they weren't treating people respectfully, especially in communities of color and I gotta say those stories were not or fabricated I could see that there was an edginess there was a there was an attitude Dude, maybe in some neighborhoods where that they weren't treating folks in those neighborhoods the same as the treating other neighbors. So we got down to business and I we told people what can what I expect of them what we expect of them and what won't be tolerated and you know, I had to discipline some folks and get them to understand that, you know policing now and 21st century requires that we have it a little more tact a little more sensitivity shall we say and listen they came around the good cops. So they always have the body cam. I think they might be getting some of them now maybe on a pilot the Raceway over there right trying to think of things that happen in Yonkers, you know, like that could be comparable to the city like, you know, the race was now the casino to so it's been a casino for years. So that really does generate much problem sometimes okay, but if that is in Yonkers though, yeah Yonkers has four precincts and and it's almost like four separate towns like North East Yonkers is like the suburbs it borders Scarsdale Bronxville, you know Eastchester. It's It's very nice. Low crime Southwest Yonkers parts of it looked like parts of the Bronx it is and it's got all the social ills, you know, drugs gangs violence and then the other two precincts a little bit of a mix, but I tell you like I said, it was a great experience. They will show you the Jadakiss the rappers from Yonkers all the younger he is he one of them is Jadakiss with DMX to get stop the mail do right and you know, which one all the cops know he does not have a valid driver's Like who? What are these guys one of I get them mixed up and he drives down Yonkers. I'll take his he wants to get stopped. Let's go. I think record sales go up. You want some street cred It's gotta be DMX. I think it's D of X. Yeah, and the guy stopped him and he's like, yeah, you know what have a driver's license and it's and it makes the papers the next day but it's a fun. It was a fun place to work. How many homicides would you get a year? They're not that many. I tell you what there was they'd never get into double figures really. They're barely barely and detect it when they'd ever homicide. They got solved a great clearance rate. They knew people in the street did good informants. I tell you they were I stack the best Yonkers detectives and the best Yonkers detective bosses. I would stack up with the guys. I met and when PD did that good and same thing with Street crime guys. I had great Street crime guys that were good, you know, goodness Street could make a car look at make could make the case. Not just indiscriminately tossing everybody the emergency service guys up there at standing. I got them some equipment got the wrong building. So maybe somebody got These guys may not like me but the ESU guys like me like I'm a black smoke that SUV that was driving around your own driver and all this stuff like that. No. No, I had a SUV if I didn't know where I was going. I bring a guy I mean how how hot was your driver me would give it tell us what she looked like and I get down. Listen. He's probably listening right now. It was a he was a big ugly bagpiper. Sorry Pat. Send in the car when you died on oh, no, I didn't bring his Chancellor with them now. No, but I know how to drive a pat. You're not hot. I'm sorry, bro. Yeah, man, that's that's so Mon Ami, please come shy I used to work in the building a 300 Gold Street. That's where you worked. I read that you were also the CEO of quality ensure quality assurance. Yeah, which was an interesting unit. I say the least it was it's the kind of job where I got called in as a Precinct commander and I got heard a rumor that has been moved and You when your Precinct Commander when you being moved you be moved to the precinct. Usually that's okay. You know, I got promoted. I'll go to the precinct. Hopefully get promoted their you get called on the back. Then the culture was if you getting good news, you went to see the police commissioner. It was how it's safe for the time. If you getting bad news, you're going to see the first Deputy Commissioner who's Pat Keller at the time. So I'm being told to see the police commissioner. So it's good news of some kind. So the commissioner calls me in and he talked to me for a while nice guy and he tells me and and you've been selected by commissioner Keller because uh, Reported to him at the time. That's a killer her and he says you've been selected by commissioner Kelleher to be the CEO of the quality assurance Division. And you had to sail is the can't say no. I don't want it, you know what actions you know what she has to say and I like I always say like never met a little kid like when you're five years old what you want to be. I want to be an astronaut. What do you fireman? No little kid ever said I want to be the CEO to Quality Assurance division. So it's not that kind of job. But I tell you what, I will do your half they go to the precincts and go over their books everything. They look at everything. Being at really at the cop so much they're looking at all that what the interim log the paperwork 61's 28 every time we think gas pumps everything and and they also look at anything that the NYPD purchases so helicopters cause refrigerators everything gets looked at but somebody quality assurance that it's roll something out. You got to fill out like 10 pages of paperwork, right? It's amazing, but I think it was but the biggest thing they do I think is they look at the Quality and accuracy of the crime reports the 61's. Yeah, and and sadly. I know some of the guys to sadly this guys that know they cooked the books they would lie, but the crime stats at that something why would anybody do that? Well, they always say there's two reasons they lied about it because they were afraid of cops that but I think more so they lied about it cause I want to get promoted sadly. We caught a couple of guys who had a complete administrative crime reduction like outside. The door crime is really up but inside when it got to his desk I'm with them. Um, so it's an important function, but thankfully I did a year and a half day and I moved on I saw some shit like that we had at one time. We did this in the two three, I won't tell you the CEO was we had a guy machete like nine people almost cut off arms off caught off limbs at the end of it. One of them got robbed by someone who wasn't involved in this. So what do you think? He did menacing know you made it a robbery hate. Remember when I said lines are not salsa, right? And the CEO came after that guy caught using this motherfucker. Oh no and the detectives spent hours in the office once a captain to inspect. I know what you're trying to do. He goes you're full of shit and there's any are and the guys tried to convince him you go. What do whatever you do? You're the committee will do whatever you want to do. We use I'm telling you you're a liar and you and the guy and she got caught by the next. Yeah, there's a couple of precincts in Midtown area, which you get a lot of tourists and in one place in particular. I remember after my time, you know, like chores from Germany gets robbed and when you go back to Germany, I'm go back to Germany tomorrow. Thank you so much and I'll report ya know exactly. So he stuff like that has to be monitored. So, you know, like I said, it was a thankless job at times but I would I would have arguments with friends of mine. Jessica vendors like Eddie. Come on, man. That's not a burglary side of broccoli. That's like my man. The guy doesn't live there. He's in this person's closet when they come home and he's naked. So what's he doing hit evil intent of some kind, you know, so well there we call stuff like that were burgers and cold Lost Property, right? They got trespass Lost Property double parking, whatever try to get out of it but saying but it's a crazy place to work, but it's you know, what? How will there be one leader? He's the same floor. I'll tell you man. Some crack team of detectives working up there and sergeants. They won't detect all the societies. They were great. They were good people. I'm not gonna she's not gonna share a foxhole. Most of them know there was this one dickhead that used to come to the squad and he was a sergeant. He's a piece of shit. You never never did detective work and it's tell us how you feel but it was a fucking piece of shit this guy and he came in and he was busting him and a couple of times people like listen. You're a piece of shit. He could destroy your command. It's so weird. Like when they come to your command to because you know, they usually come unannounced and then they're making your PA crazy because you know, she's the one that knows where all the success you gotta give everything world. The stuff is buried all the bodies are buried is he's like, he's got a list of cases. He wants to look at you know, I'm saying and she's like, all right. We got a nice looking up, you know drop ceilings my case is that's why you stole mine. So my sergeant No, he couldn't get out of when I was that was before the dd5 system. Then you are had. Yeah, I told you the story but the detective from the two three, he's coming in from Long Beach Long Island with this other detective and they were an hour and a half late and inspections is there, you know and right away they see they wanted his cases because he was like 70 in the hole. It was me. So he walks in and he sees inspections that he fucking turds of weight. You know, I'm like Charlie they want to see you again. This with the time but he should have grabbed his chest that looks take me to st. Louis. It was funny as hell when he saw them. There was like, oh no time is up man. Let's time is up. That's when that's when you Pat you're walking out of your office where you used to work with everything that was in your desk. Okay. Take care. Take care of it. Could not see. Yes. It was quite calm. Keep in touch. I used to sit on the kid would come in and he'd say detective. I'm Little John. Ernie Lopez you had me as a missing case seven years ago and people at the fold up your right to do any investigation at all. Yeah, that's why you look familiar to me. I used to ride the elevator and work out in the gym upstairs with a wood on the all the time. It's a shame what happened with the whole pantaleo thing man. I think it was something that you know, the whole thing is just as a tragedy all the way around all the way from both sides, obviously from the Garner family from from what happened to this poor guy pantaleo now and then like even the ramifications of how to deal with it afterwards. I don't think he said hopefully he's going To be okay, you know Neal, you know, because he seemed like a real gentleman to me and then all the Fallout after all of it is just it's disgusting. Yeah, that's if I met Jim O'Neill doesn't need me to defend him. But Jim O'Neill is an honorable guy. Jim O'Neill doesn't like cops. He loves cops. Yeah, that's I had the funny thing about to this must have broke his heart. I didn't talk to Jimmy about it. But listen whether I agree or disagree with this decision one thing I do know, I in my heart of hearts. I think Jimmy made that decision because he thought it was the right thing to do. It wasn't I think because he had any kind of political considerations or anybody pressuring him. I think he I know a lot of people disagree with me, but I think he just saw it was the right thing to do and he didn't want that to be part of his legacy, but he just thought it's right thing. But you know what? Let me add some how do you work with one of these Progressive mayor's how can you do it? And when the flies in the face of everything we learned this car because I had to work with the mayor in rockers Yonkers mayor was a great man. The guy never youngest. Mayor Phil. I'm a Coney a great man. He brought me in didn't know me that well, and at the end when he said he was he couldn't run again cause he was term-limited. He could have had term limits overturned. He wouldn't do it. He's too honorable guy. So I said I'm leaving with you. I mean the new guy coming is I got to keep me anyway, but they wanted to interview me was all a sham but I left with him and I never asked me if I was he's a republican. He never asked me Republican Democrat. I'm an independent. I'm not either one. He never asked me to my rush. You never answered her an enemy. They've asked me to befriend the police department. I need to do so he's a great man. But like in what to get back to your question Bill whether guys like Giuliani or not. You knew that like there was a mega that supported the police department, right? And right now I don't think the cops in the street. I know the cops in the street. My son included probably they don't think that the mayor cares about them or has their back. So I think what's going on now in the police, but even with the historic reductions that are still happening in many ways, it's in spite of the mayor because of the Precision policing are doing now the targeted enforcement. Iseman stuff it's working finale. Well, look, the blueprint was written by Bratton and the the fore bearers of this. Yeah. They just got to keep following that bloop. You know, what's in this week it once in a while. Yeah speaking of future police work. I was reading some more about you that resume, but I mention how beautiful their resume was wrap Technologies, but it to me, you're a consultant there. I am I am. Yes, and it specializes in Innovative non-lethal technology to assist law enforcement officers in Encounters and I'm always fascinated by this stuff. Is there anything groundbreaking coming out that we can look forward to I think they can help us with the traffic. This is what if this thing they have a product called bowler wrap I've done so you'll love that bowler app is a great product. It is a from Planet of the Apes. Is that shooting the net at the gallop like it's more like a it's a it's a long piece of like rope almost like fishing line but stronger with little barbs on the end and it's a step a little taser. One thing I like about this product is listen tasers a great pride. I brought changes to Yonkers. Taste is a great product. But all these things which the taser or beanbag gun or nightstick or mace every one of those products depends on some kind of inflicting of pain to get compliance this product. It's more like, you know, more sister persons and unquiet. It's not like every red situation you want to wrap somebody, but if you have a an emotional start person acting up in a room or in a courtyard of Street would like that you can deploy this thing and it makes a noise. It's a modified 380 caliber charge in it. So it makes a lot of noise which is Distracting and then it either wraps up his arms wrapped up his legs and then you rush him. So it's it's actually working in parts of the country. Now, it's been about what I think it's not getting that much. I think people is there a fear that it's going to go around somebody's head or the neck. It's it's it can't strangle anybody. Okay good. She's so white. What is why is this not coming to New York some some some Department to look concern about the noise because if you deploy the noise some cops might think somebody shooting and they might start and there's no way to like make a noise reduction out of it working on a another potato on it and the end of the video the video man. I've seen it I've seen video on it and I'm thinking to myself like you said, it's not hurting the person it just wraps around their torso secure in their arms to their body or around their legs. So they can't run flee fight back. It's to me it's beautiful though. They always say in when you're when you're a police chief is always somebody calling you to sell you stuff. Yeah. A nice to have a guy former fed and I get along very well with the feds but this guy was like a snake oil salesman and every like six months he would call with some kind of no super electronic dental floss is some proud and and I'm like no man, i--'cause I would say like listen, it's got to be good gotta be good for my department. Got to be good. Got to help the men and women in the street and the communities gotta like it you check off those boxes. I'm going to listen. So when you when you're a police chief people won't get want you to buy stuff from them when you're a former police chief I get calls now of people want me to help them. Cells in the doorstep so I would say like I can't put my eye looks like I spent 32 years building up a pretty good reputation. I can't attach my name to some BS product that I don't believe that I met with these people. I saw what it does then I thought about myself being a young captain or young Sergeant out the street trying to subdue an EDP and what happens is in Yonkers. I was getting guys hurt sometimes a dozen cops would get hurt trying to subdue something to go to university. So they're in the hospital. He's in hospital now, I'm getting complaints. Hey, I called you up and you came and beat up my son. This is a product that in some cases works. Well, you don't have to beat anybody up get them all wrapped up. Then you rush him you put them on the ground it's over. So I attach my name to something like this and there's a couple other products. I attach my name to that something like this that I think Tech chicks those boxes for me to Kilkenny shall a lie. Yeah that one I like that what that one works in Kilkenny? Yeah, but not over here. How much space will how would you carry that thing? It looks almost like a look somewhat like a taste. It looks like a big garage door opener, and it's got it. Charged in a front. It looks almost like a flashlight like a flattened out flashlight it thing comes out. Like I've watched the demo many times. You can't see it. It comes out that it comes out like 650 feet a second. Well, you can stand up on the side you need about 10 feet or more so you don't get that close to the guy either because like with the taser even sometimes you got to get close like I could hurt you this thing, you're 10 to 20 feet away. It comes out fast. It goes around and wraps if it goes around the head it's not gonna like I strangle them. So you get them the legs are great, maybe by the wrists and sometimes UWF Got boom boom. He's not going anywhere and he could eventually get out of it. But that time be rushing in with him and he stopped everything collapsed. So people aren't getting hurt. It gives a great use of it recently in Fresno, California where it was perfect. That's that's what's the sign for not look like anything. It's not perfect nightsticks. Not perfect chases certainly never like that is definitely one of the biggest problems that police have is that the use of force it never looks good. It never looks and everything is videotaped now. It's a great Point Bill write something like that will, you know save them from like well, Not using force with just you know, the province who is the God of this stuff if it's really effective you're going to have groups like the ACLU. They're going to fight it. All they wanted was the cameras. They just want all the police officers with cameras. So then this way, you know, there's going to be a record now the cameras are no good because the police officers supposedly can look at what happened and then they can put it on their report. It's if we got the tape, we're only going to live with never going to look at your stupid report again, because your report, isn't it? There's not going to tell us more than what's on the tape. Yeah, I bet you know what? I became a convert to body cameras because I did Consulting with with Bill Bratton. I did Consulting in Detroit and Baltimore Oakland places where they had cameras, but what did they did was those places have consent decrees so they rushed in these cameras. So for cameras to work, right? You got to have good equipment got a good policy to go with it and good training. If you don't have each of those three things the camera systems going to fail and then I like a I guess first of all, I was like wow man cameras. I would want to work with a camera, but you know what? Now I see cameras because you get the whole story with a camera. Yeah, you don't get the 10 second YouTube thing that somebody wants to limit the cops look bad. You get the whole story now, you see the exactly what happened that led this incident to take? Well, that's why they want to get rid of the want. They're saying it's because the officer has an opportunity to change his report. Well, the only reason why we look at the report is to jam up the cop instead of looking at what the what led the cop to want to arrest his criminal. You don't need any report anymore. It's all in the video. Also, it it it it keeps you know, listen, we all know there's some cops out there that maybe misbehave. It keeps a guy who's a modest little bit line and he knows he's being recorded now and I got to tell you it also it also gives the public a really good idea of what these cops go through and how hard it is to subdue. It's another problem how hot is this? Let me see somebody that doesn't want to be safe. You have a bad cop or somebody who's videotaping in their car on their own or you know, just a civilian trying to record the cop. People forget their own camera in 15 seconds the real use going to come out and 10 to 15 seconds. You're going to be nice in the beginning. I got a camera. I got a camera. Hey, fuck you, you know what I'm saying that you just not even going to care. That's the way it is something sometimes how you use your voice helps and if someone has a problem with you saying put your fucking hands down they have a problem with yeah, but that could still help save your life like you have a great detective supervisor background, and I know it's now Standard that the interviews will get recorded right away and you know what and again it's a good thing. But but you know yourself some detectives have a certain style. They're not beating anybody up right but some guys like the yellow bit some guys like the script other guys very subdued that's their style. They get the confession the got it yells and screams of waves his arms. He gets a confession too. But now when you see that on video intimidating, you know what he's may be just as effective at that other guy, but if different paths to the same goal real great detective is going to know they're going to have a A couple of different interview ways that they interview and for some person and usually it's like I'll tell you if you if you have somebody that comes from a certain country where the police are authoritative probably abusive. That's what they learn. So if you're talking to him like hello, and how are you? I'm sorry to disturb you they're going to run roughshod right over you they want their that's the only way they're going to talk to you if you're a little bit more aggressive and if you're a good detective that's the strategy you're going. To talk to this person. If you see that somebody else is going to require a more, you know, so, you know an easier go about it. You're not going to yell at them. It's not necessary you use those you have all those tricks in your bag. It's like acting in a way and well, how am I going to get the confession about out of his guy you're going to sometimes in one interview in one interrogation. You might try two or three different tactics, you might try two or three different detectives and each one has their own tactics just to see which one works. Yeah, and I think the against a good thing in many ways, but I think the recording of the interview is sometimes a detective is now inhibited from doing his normal style some guys I know would like to like put a hand on a guy and you know kind of console them now. It's like I've had it, you know, this guy's gonna think oh, how is it you can look right even reading Miranda Right a jump street that used to never be done. You would schmooze the guy a little bit get them comfortable getting coffee get him something to drink and then you present Miranda now they want you to present Moran. Immediately. Yeah, that's a little tough. I want to know is this the statistics on why is it? Why is he sitting so close? Because that's that's a tactic that you learn. If you go to investigate if you go to like training we talked about and learning how to do interrogations. One of the tactics is to get close to him. So we're talking like this. Another tactic is to mimic your body language, you know, you see the way somebody sits if they're leaning back you lean back if this sitting up you copied me mimic them it makes them feel more comfortable. Psychologically sure but one of the tactics of sitting so close now you have a defensive. Why is he sitting? So close its intimidating is right in his face like my client felt uncomfortable. He said, you know and all these things on that because there may always have to be cognizant about putting too many people in the room. I never wanted more than two detectives interviewing a guy because you put a third in there and then the defense attorney goes there's three detectives in the shit out of my client, you know, so Really interesting with the camera the body cameras and any other ones besides that the bowl of thing. I love that both. I'm with it. I'm with the company also they do I guess for want of a better term in layman's terms. They do electronic blueprints. Where no more do you need to have the floor plans of a building or complex or a stadium or hospital or a college campus or a school in folders and binders and written down somewhere. This is all on tablets and it's really taken off course the country. I think this is several hundred school systems in New Jersey. Jersey right now that have this product it's called crg collaborative response Graphics Co G plan that's a good feel like active Shooters. You have a shooter. It's even good for the daily operational stuff, but for active shooter now if something bad goes on in a building say a school, for example, if the school system has this product and again, it's one of the places that one of the products that I'm happy to attach my name to they go there now the first round of the responders immediately it get it gets activated. They know everything about the building right now. They know what every entrance is every exit is every guest pipe every every fire extinguisher everything in the Is mapped out and this thing is I mean Bolin wraps around this thing is a really together get their hands on this electronic blooping thing burglars. Yeah. Well, I would bring it here, but you guys put ahead of my put on my hair. I gotta know where this address is. I'm a burglar the way we met you in the corner. Yeah. But again Coggs again, they have a website also see. Oh, geez. It's actually sweeping the country. This shit is shotspotter. Like old hat now shotspotter. No Shots by this could be a trap spot in Yonkers to it's an acoustic gun detect your sister detecting system where once a shot goes off. It's a triangulation of these devices that pinpoint where the shot actually happened. It's pretty cool though. NYPD has yeah. It's a great system. So you could narrow down where that call came from you actually Bill Bratton does some work with shotspotter now and we just have to do it old school back in the day like find again and it actually it actually within their advertising is within 10 to Feet with a gunshot and this is when it gets even better. It's a kind of a system that learns itself as it gets better. It'll tell you even like shotgun versus pistol. Oh, so it's really really nervous that system course. It's probably I think it's a little pricey but you know, it's worth it and listen, you know one thing even if you have a tight budget you can use like, you know asset forfeiture money money. You see you learn to do that during the Project's anyway, my friend Dante has a joke that he does about how his daughter heard the gunshots and then he know instead of getting scared and Jumping on the bed. She goes daddy. Somebody's shooting an AR-15 outside. They got 15 in the club. That's his joke not to move down to narrow the shout out to you buddy. Also, too. There was another thing. Oh the talking about the right forget. I forgot already, you know, like I could if I could just segue into this there was just a former deputy inspector from the NYPD is now a chief in Vermont and he was talking about and I don't know what he's smoking him for a month. He was talking about cops not shooting a knife wielder. Did you see that? Yeah, I mean I in all fairness depending on how far away the that the the guy with the knife is you all know during training. You probably better using your hands then trying to reach for your gun. If you reach for your gun in the guys less than 10 feet away. You're going to get stabbed the fuck up the I disagree my guns coming out of a guy's got a knife and ever now you only got that one. I think the more for my left hand. I'm going to light him up with my right hand come from a fighting Baal. Come on. I'm not only am I taking away the knife. I'm stabbed six and a half years and I think he's making a blanket statement, which I don't agree with. I know he's a very well educated God member. He was an NYPD guy actually went up went up there to some of the most world you could be able to stupidest motherfucker. On this Earth. I'm not sure if he's that category, but he always know it's the truth but he's a highly educated fellow. You said I could tell me it has no place in the police. I'm not saying I'm just saying if he's making a blanket statement like that, he's wrong. Well, do you see a few years ago? They sent a bunch of Chiefs from the NYPD to Scotland to study their use of force because they don't carry guns in Scotland. And that's where a lot of this crap came from. Yeah. It does. Look at this. I think there's somebody in the city council that is saying that trying to put some legislation out York City City. Counsel saying that we need less cops. Yeah. I saw the I've never ever heard any like the visual thinking less cops, you know, this is a viewer conspiracy theories like sometimes I tend to fall into that. There's a whole thing that's going on right now between the the prison reform lowering the voting age getting the allowing people with with felony convictions to the vote. It's all you know, it's preparing for For the future where we're going to have and who you going to who gave me this ability to do this all over again. Oh this party did so who are you gonna vote for? Yeah, like all it's it's too much of a coincidence. All these things that are pushing Us in This One Direction taking away the authority from the police officers the respect going back to basically defending yourselves what happens to us as a community when all of a sudden there's less police officers that less authoritative. Now, you're going to have people who are vulnerable again and who do those vulnerable people have to rely on right now their family or they have to join into a clan of some sort guy. A gang or a group, you know, it's funny. I did a lot of meetings Community meetings Church basements School cafeterias, and I'd get a room full of church ladies a lot of times and nobody's paying as much attention to the church leaders as they should because Church ladies want they want assertive policing show. Nobody's paying attention. You want stretch ladies they want they want their neighborhoods cleaned up. We want the guys off that corner. They want nobody on this stoop. They don't want to be smoking weed. They don't want nobody stoves. Twilight stuff they want that. Did you see the big fight with in the subway in Brooklyn when the One Cop who I wanted my anti-crime team of ever went back down to come hit and knock the kid out. That was beautiful. Yeah, but politicians were criticizing that and he got transferred the necklace when he was finished Garden Academy to have to punch. Yeah with this. Yeah, that's that's part of training. You can't you can't get rid of that that you train that you box in the police academy, but it was keep forgetting when I wanted to talk. But only with this regarding old people one troubling. Seeing a seasons are completely being disregarded in our society right now. It's like they don't have a voice. Yeah. Well the church ladies the they should spend more time talking certain. Once you reach a certain age. Look at the little thing that they throw out right now. Okay Boomer that's a like whenever somebody who's out of a certain age a baby boomer past fall into that break or they don't like being called Millennials. So now they're retaliating by. All right Boomer relax, then I want to listen to it. O people have to say that this regarding their voice, isn't it going to be young forever? Wherever people young people always think that that they're going to live forever that they're going to be young forever and they're forgetting their parents that their grandparents when somebody somebody heaviest critics of the NYPD, for example of young folks that never lived and What didn't live in this city when it was when it was really bad so they can jump up and down only want about I don't like this and like that but they weren't here in the in the mid 80s during the crack wall marks marks told us about Comics. He knows three of them got robbed. Yes and lie. Getting a taste of the other condition was cool the hot dose. Yeah, listen now to like the local news stations on the radio and they'll say like, you know a knife-wielding suspect in Brooklyn, you know, robbed robbed a bodega and I'm waiting for like no you don't get another kid that used to be every day. Now that's a no that's a news event because doesn't happen that much anymore. Exactly. Well, I tell you what, and I'm not one of these pessimist but when I start here During that my friends are getting robbed, you know on a daily basis now and you know, that's the sentiment that's you all kind of sort of talk to each other. Like look if somebody's walking their dog and they happy to walk their dog three or four three or four blocks take them on a nice walk. The way you want to do for you the talk that you love now, all of a sudden you'll walk is refined the it's refined to just in front of your house where you could still see your vestibule if you have a doorman you're lucky enough or The you know, the building next door that has a doorman or somebody. There's lighted a lit Street, it dogs not getting that walk anymore and I did might not even go out anymore night because it's my danger Adam. Somebody's targeting comedians. It could be anything. It could be told some bad jokes tonight before we doing about this. Yes, I can see that it comes that thing and the by like we talked about the good right? Has anyone been working on this comic happened? Yeah. Have you had a meeting with the kleenex? It's just so happens that we got this. Guy Mark tomato. He was the person who call, you know, obviously they're all going to call me. What should I do? They want to know how involved should I get now? What do you tell this person about what's going to happen to them. Now? You got robbed You're gonna have to you. Can you probably going to have to go to a grand jury if they don't take the plea you're going to have to go to trial and you know, listen the further you get from these horrible events, the the the less of a memory and then do you want to recall that again? Do you want to rip the scab? Off that wound again and go through that pain again, and then you know it burst your bubble because all these people live in a bubble and I always used to joke around when I retired. I said, I want to just live in my bubbleman. I don't want to give a shit about what happens to the rest of the city. I just want to live in my bubble and everybody's been living in their bubble. And guess what? It's going to burst the bubbles going to burst your bubble pretty soon man. It's a matter of time because back in the day when you came on the job in the late 70s the late 70s and the early 80s me. Had two months of the state would even cooled. They weren't even called robberies anymore. They were called muggings. Yeah, there was so many robberies. They it's a mugging use the term yoke to a millennial who think it's the thing around a cow, you know, he doesn't know that that's how you got yoked up. Like you're being ignored, you know, that's one of my points. I was making the big the victims of Beijing door to your point, but also a troubling Trend I see across the country but not even you can just localized. It is people are running for district attorney. Now and they're not talking about Crime Victims Law and Order. They all want to be social justice reforms that's like there was a debate in Queens without the woman who won barely squeaked out against against a public defender and their whole debates were about social justice and and who's going to be kinder to the suspects not one word was mentioned about victims victims rights victims victims being taken care of properly walking them through the process with dick. Demand, you know we could segue right into what Mark was talking about before is that January first comes all those new. No bail crimes that people are just going to be released from arraignment for that's going to be so interesting because one of the questions that my friend had for me was well, I don't know if they're going to know my name that because they they stole the credit cards. So they're going to know my name they're going to know where I live and all this stuff and usually you'd say don't worry about that. That was a incident. Nobody goes. It's going to go to your house look for you, but now if Now within a certain couple hours and they're freaking pissed that you ratted them out. They might see who knows they might show at is that Discovery rule? I mean, the Nobel thing is going to be horrible the the subway rule. I mean the discovery rule when this crime all over the place that means in 15 days prior to our audience with Discovery is they do they may not know I'm so Discovery is basically all the material that a prosthetic that the cops bring to a prosecutor in order to pursue that case. So everything names addresses photos witness statements all That stuff now has to be given to the defense within 15 days. So detectives and Bill knows better than me detectors are hard enough time getting witnesses to cooperate now. Good luck because the 15 days that guy's going to know that bill can and it one two, three main street ratted me out to the cops. It's going on 15 days. So that's going to be even while walking through crime scenes. Imagine being the victim of a home invasion and next thing you know that the French team with the purpose coming in the walk to your house your home. Yeah, and and and on your phone the police I'm sorry to disturb you do you remember this person? Yeah, well as as somebody ran a police department now on the budget side, you're gonna have to hire more people to put all this stuff together and drifting days. So you're gonna be taking caps off the street or paying overtime and all kind of stuff like that. So it's gonna be a nightmare. Yeah. I don't think it was well thought of I really don't it's being done by the stage before you walk back a bit and some other states where they realize it's an unsustainable system. Yeah. Well you think about it. They're Extreme Measures. Oh and right now we're moving at that pace. We're moving at an extreme Pace because they trying to take advantage of this moment that they have where you know, you can get stuff like this done, you know, and don't forget to the we were living in a time where this doesn't seem so absurd because there was no crime really and you can go anywhere you want really, you know, we're talking back. We're all old enough to remember a time. You didn't go to a certain neighborhood at a certain certain owl. Do you know what I'm saying? Nobody? Was going we joked around about it. But if you want a Subway and you were going past 96th Street, they conduct us stop. We got a white boy on the train. He forgot to get off. You know what I'm saying? You joke around about that. But that was true. You did not go to certain neighborhoods. Unless you were taking a big chance at a certain time of day, right, you know, in this case of why would why would like to officials in act stuff like this and it's like I think it's part of a maybe a progressive agenda where they think it's like does this hurt? Yeah. Do people but a short memory they forget what it was like they didn't grow up in that like they have no memory because a lot of these peoples the these people that are coming to New York City. They didn't experience the crime. Like you said, they don't remember what it was like when I go to school with Cummings constantly Comics moving to Bed-Stuy, right? They're moving all over the place. It's all about. Yeah from a story. I was like, no I'm from I grew up in Astoria. Yeah, you know a story was different. It was not like now now I still Go back. I still get you know story is one of those places we drive through and like you're not even there five minutes. Like what the fuck you looking at straighten out your face. Like you can't help it drive freaking idiot, you know saying you stuck it out drive. So it just brings out the anger out of the I don't know why and combined with all of what we're talking about. This Progressive agenda is that cops are Under Fire and then not being backed up by their bosses. I mean certainly the feeling in New York City if from City Hall is Is that they feel like they're not being supported that from day one. I mean, they've won the current mayor whatever name he uses. Now the current me he's changed his name a few times, but the current mayor clearly was not on the side of the cops. I mean Giuliani again, probably not a perfect human being we know that but Giuliani always said when in doubt I'm gonna I'm gonna give the cop the benefit of the doubt. That's really all the cop wants. I just know that listen don't don't judge me right off the bat get all the facts and then, you know, we'll buy all the options and now it's the opposite now, Apps and I was right off the bat. We're going to go against the cop. And the mayor the mayor has kind of Incorporated his wife into it as first lady. She's involved in the old stuff and and again, you know, they don't seem to want to get the facts. They don't seem to be totally on board with the got those certainly take the police protection that's provided to them, but they don't want to seem to be supportive of the men and women that pushing a radio car around that's another funny thing like everybody's out here. They're globe-trotting to fight in private jets to fight global warming climate climate change. And then drive idiot from Coldplay cancels his concert because he doesn't want to fly Miss. Like all right. Did you talk to your record company about this? How about the people in your band that I'm going to be getting paid? Because the only way that you get paid nowadays if you're in a band is through touring. It's not through records because nobody buys them anymore. How about all those Roadies that a union members now? They're out of work. Oh my God. Can you imagine if it was just so stupid? It's not well for that lead to this killer that I know the other day. He's like, oh, you know the world's going to enter them like this. First of all, the world's not going anywhere. We live in a rock. Okay. The only thing that's going to happen is we're going to die. The only this not that the Earth is going to be fine. It's going to be fine. The only thing that might not be you know, they might be a hole in the ozone layer and we can't breathe. So we're going to go on the ground to find another planet. So this would be a climate change comes that meeting. I think that's a good idea would help. It's unbelievable man. Al Sharpton. We find them I think so shocking will show up. There will always be fine fine. I want I got to talk to him and because you know, Come on the show. No because I'm glad I would love to talk to him. Yeah, I would love to talk to him about that. And how do I how do you get out of these tax problems man? I love what he said. He said the most brilliant thing about that. He said how could they say? I evaded my taxes when I didn't pay any that I made so much sense that I loved it like that. I've been for over a million dollars in his just recently. Yeah, he's got some lifestyle make some bellinis not even eating anymore. Where's all this money going? He was he was kind of more fun when he was. Fat I like them better when he was fat much, but I think behind the scenes. He's a hell of a guy man. It looks too because he's everybody likes hanging out with him. It's only when he gets he's old-school guy to win the cameras. Come on. That's when the real. Yeah. That's right the TV, I'll strap that comes on. But when he's not he's he's you know, pom and everybody's hanging out as an opiate director with them. They say he's a lot of laughs. He's got a good sense of humor and I don't knows. I know it's there's a lot of things happening when when the cameras go on, you know, that's that's when it's an it's an act. It's a nice. He could be a podcast you could meet. You know, he may be a future guest. I don't know you think we could match wits with him. Give a shit. What a hell of a try. Yeah. Now you could if you want to come in here promise, I won't ask you any questions about the taxes. That's your own business. I mind my own business. I'll be a good host man. We'd love to have you here right in here that we know. We had the honor and pleasure to have you here today. That's this was you were thank you guys here exactly. We can't say you was at a moans level because I'm own was but he was great. Well, Madam own was you know, he was the chief of the department. You would just Deputy check it but he was the PCA Yonkers. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He was the police commissioner Bianca. Most people call. It junk. That's right junkers. He's a PC a junker very much. Uh-huh. No, but I'm just saying when you go through Yonkers right now. You park your car you get out. Hey Commish. They're good guys. Listen, I and well-received still in. Yeah. That's that's good feeling man. They're good guys, really good guy. If we ever want to have you come back on when you come back on again, I would I want this is relatively painless. Thank you mean it wasn't fun with you. Can you give me a heads up about him? Okay, you're around the money, by the way, well on behalf of police off the cuff. I just want to say thank you so much Ed for coming in. Thank you guys. In us. Thank you over here. And thank you all the humble a new humble abode in in Tribeca. Now, they put the hood back on my head. Yeah. Do you have it here now that we just kick you out the back there and the next guest Bill any parting words again, you know, it's so great. We've met so many great people through doing this podcast that I include you You're great gig. I mean, I can't believe 1994 you would accelerate to full work there. It's like that's the amazing thing about the police department its long-term shit, you know like 30 years ago. Let's not forget people. Yeah, it's a fraternity that I used. Nothing gets my friends that are accountants and lawyers. They don't have what we have it wrong. Nobody's listening. Who knows? I don't even know if I was gonna say nobody's listening to an accountant podcast series who knows it's fascinating and before we go just special. Thank you to our engineer here. We shot we shot on the ones and twos. Thank you. Thank you Rashad and to our beautiful producer Pam. Thank you Pam Rashad start reading that comedy Booker right Sam scared. Next we were about to start doing construction work out there. Again Pam went out. There were at I get the skid the hello talk like that. All right. Thanks a lot man police off. The cuff is it's over now for today. Thank you. Good luck guys, and the two arguments.
Second half of Edmund Hartnett's interview: Edmund Hartnett was appointed to the NYPD in November of 1979. He served in numerous commands including NSU #9, the 32nd, 48th, 46th and 24th Precincts as well as the Applicant Processing Division and Manhattan South Narcotics District. Ed commanded several NYPD units including the Drug Enforcement Task Force, the Quality Assurance Division, the 109th Precinct, Narcotics Borough Bronx and the Intelligence Division. Upon retirement from the NYPD, he served as Police Commissioner of Yonkers, the fourth largest city in New York State, from 2006 through 2011. After leaving the Yonkers Police Department, Ed then worked with former NYPD Police Commissioner, Bill Bratton, on police consulting projects in Los Angeles, Oakland CA, Detroit and Baltimore. Ed holds a Bachelor’s Degree from Fordham University, a Master’s Degree in Public Administration from Marist College and a Certificate in Police Management from the Columbia University Graduate School of Business. He is a graduate of the 169th Session of the FBI National Academy, the FBI National Executive Institute and the Executive Leaders Program of the Center for Homeland Defense and Security of the Naval Postgraduate School. Ed served as President of Brosnan Risk Consultants, a New York based security firm, from 2013 through 2018. He still provides consulting services to Brosnan as well as several other clients. Ed and his wife, Grace, have been married since 2004. Ed’s son, Matt, is an NYPD Detective assigned to the Emergency Services Unit. Matt and his wife, Kathy, have two daughters, Ava and Madelyn. 